deathroh said:

Moral superiority? Posturing? Fuck you. I was trying to come up with something I was worried about and that's it. I'm not slamming MSU as a program by saying it, but with the precipitous fall that the program has had, the extended losing streak that they're on, and with the possibility of being embarrassed by their hated rivals a distinct possibility...I think this lines up to be a situation where some players could lose their cool. Didn't you just have a guy get three personal fouls in the last game?

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You're worried about MSU players taking cheap shots? when have we ever done that? Is MSU a dirty program? do we have dirty players? When have we done anything like that in recent memory? Come on, it's always a hard fought, hard hitting game but generally within the rules.

I will bet one thing. If this game gets ugly I guarantee that McDowell will get thrown out for a stupid play. He's clearly frustrated and has been this whole season. He is playing with a bunch of bums upfront who can't make a play even though he's being double teamed almost every play.

huh. so it seems some cheap shots/personal fouls aren't out of the question, at least according to 2 out of 3 MSU fans.

Maybe calling them "dirty" isn't the right word... I think you can only play dirty if you're actually in a competitive game. in 2011, twisting Denard's helmet was dirty. a guy diving at a knee in the first Q is dirty (like that Wisconsin DB did to Newsome).

this year if the game is out of hand & MSU starts throwing punches & launching hits after the whistle it'll be done out of stupidity and frustration, not dirty play.

jwlcosu said:

I think it's more like this than the opposite. Dantonio's gotta have the locker room plastered with Mike Hart photos, no? "It never gets old." Remember?

MSU plays with pride this week in Spartan Stadium. Not well enough to win, I don't think, but they are not going to be embarrassed.

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loaded word?

I heard "pride comes before the fall"

they should probably not play with pride in this case. Passion, a fiery disposition, or even quiet desperation would all serve them better. Dantonio may need to consult his book of motivational quotes (and bring in a prof from MSU's English dept this time) before kickoff.

I hope that the only cheap shots that occur in this rivalry this week are on these boards.

michchamp said:

huh. so it seems some cheap shots/personal fouls aren't out of the question, at least according to 2 out of 3 MSU fans.

Maybe calling them "dirty" isn't the right word... I think you can only play dirty if you're actually in a competitive game. in 2011, twisting Denard's helmet was dirty. a guy diving at a knee in the first Q is dirty (like that Wisconsin DB did to Newsome).

this year if the game is out of hand & MSU starts throwing punches & launching hits after the whistle it'll be done out of stupidity and frustration, not dirty play.

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Personal fouls are never out of the question in a football game, neither is dirty play but there's no reason to be bracing for it or expect it, funny how it's only a concern for one side too. Remember Lewan shoving Gholstons head into the ground in 2011 and then twisting facemasks in 2013?

There's no significant history of dirty play other than a few personal fouls by the two players that I already mentioned and last I looked, they aren't on the roster this year.

michchamp said:

loaded word?

I heard "pride comes before the fall"

they should probably not play with pride in this case. Passion, a fiery disposition, or even quiet desperation would all serve them better. Dantonio may need to consult his book of motivational quotes (and bring in a prof from MSU's English dept this time) before kickoff.

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once again, let me start by saying you're an idiot - this is a complete mischaracterization of what happened Saturday and of what I said about it. the PFs were all in the 1st quarter when the game was tied at 0 - they weren't out of frustration or even close to intentional, dirty hits. They were just 2 dumb late hits and a targeting call - not egregious penalties but definitely legitimate calls. They happen in football - not usually 3 times in a quarter but like I said, they were dumb and the guy who committed them is also dumb - he has a lot in common with you in that regard. Deathroh used that as an example for why he made dirty play his only fear going into the game, i explained that if he knew the circumstances, that instance shouldn't concern him. Not surprising that was lost on you.

Sbee said:

You're worried about MSU players taking cheap shots? when have we ever done that? Is MSU a dirty program? do we have dirty players? When have we done anything like that in recent memory? Come on, it's always a hard fought, hard hitting game but generally within the rules.

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I explained my reasoning in my last post.

Spartanmack said:

once again, let me start by saying you're an idiot - this is a complete mischaracterization of what happened Saturday and of what I said about it. the PFs were all in the 1st quarter when the game was tied at 0 - they weren't out of frustration or even close to intentional, dirty hits. They were just 2 dumb late hits and a targeting call - not egregious penalties but definitely legitimate calls. They happen in football - not usually 3 times in a quarter but like I said, they were dumb and the guy who committed them is also dumb - he has a lot in common with you in that regard. Deathroh used that as an example for why he made dirty play his only fear going into the game, i explained that if he knew the circumstances, that instance shouldn't concern him. Not surprising that was lost on you.

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looks like you quoted the wrong post of mine, jackass. I mean, sure it's an honest mistake but if you're going to keep calling someone dumb, try to not to fumble it so badly.

michchamp said:

looks like you quoted the wrong post of mine, jackass. I mean, sure it's an honest mistake but if you're going to keep calling someone dumb, try to not to fumble it so badly.

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whoa, you got me there. I feel so dumb. If it helps at all, the post I quoted was pretty stupid too - but you can't help but fumble things so badly.

A key stat in this game is going to be average starting field position. If we can't get first downs on their defense and we're punting from the 22 yard line all game it could get really ugly early. I did read an article that says MSU's offense is 34th in yards per play which isn't bad at all but we're terrible at converting in the red zone. We need to reverse that if we want any chance to keep this game tight.

Ive hit the point of no expectations, which is somewhat of a relief. I think at this point we salvage a few wins against Illinois and Rutgers and get our Frosh some playing time. If we keep it within 2 scores its a moral victory at best.

dubbsco said:

It's really an odd dynamic right now. MSU fans are predicting that the game will be a blowout, and Michigan fans say it's going to be really close (including me). I guess that's what a decade of losing to MSU will do.

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45-17 is really close?

I do the prediction threads way more optimistic than I actually believe.

But thanks for stalking me and making it beyond creepy.

dubbsco said:

I do the prediction threads way more optimistic than I actually believe.

But thanks for stalking me and making it beyond creepy.

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Remembering that you sounded like a scared bitch yesterday but then predicted a blow out today is stalking? Whatever man. At least you admit that you're full of shit.

Spread the word. Call up the police, bring me in.

Sbee said:

A key stat in this game is going to be average starting field position. If we can't get first downs on their defense and we're punting from the 22 yard line all game it could get really ugly early. I did read an article that says MSU's offense is 34th in yards per play which isn't bad at all but we're terrible at converting in the red zone. We need to reverse that if we want any chance to keep this game tight.

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Time of possession is going to matter as well. If we can't keep our defense off the field, they're just going to get run over for the last 25 minutes - if the game isn't already over by then.

Spartanmack said:

Time of possession is going to matter as well. If we can't keep our defense off the field, they're just going to get run over for the last 25 minutes - if the game isn't already over by then.

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Those things really go together, but I agree. TOP and average starting field position is directly related to MSU being able to get first downs, if we're 3 and out all day, it will be ugly. Our defense would be on the field all game with Michigan getting the ball around midfield. for those looking for something positive, check out this link. It's from a football analytics site and this guy predicted that we would be bad this year.

https://thepowerrank.com/2016/10/25...ld-be-too-big-a-favorite-over-michigan-state/

some interesting (somewhat) positive things.

By adjusted yards per play, Michigan State ranks 38th in the nation. While not stellar, the Spartans look much better by yards per play than adjusted margin of victory (90th).

To explain the discrepancy between yards per play and margin of victory, we consult Bill Connelly?s data on finishing drives. By points per trip inside the 40, Michigan State ranks 94th and 89th on offense and defense respectively.

The Spartans haven?t been clutch this season. However, this could change any week, as an offense ranked 34th in adjusted yards per play will almost certainly finish drives better than they have so far this season. And the defense overall should be better than their rank of 62nd by adjusted yards per play.

Michigan is 5th in team rankings based on adjusted yards per play, and this suggests they should be favored by about 10 points

Spartanmack said:

Time of possession is going to matter as well. If we can't keep our defense off the field, they're just going to get run over for the last 25 minutes - if the game isn't already over by then.

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MSU is converting 37.1% of third downs, which ranks #88
UM is allowing conversions on 13% of third downs, ranks #1

As you said, that is going to be a key of the game. Those are some huge trends to buck.

https://youtu.be/y-He6qHZ11c

This is our major problem, I'd suggest paying the $10 a month to subscribe for these kid of break downs. We simply don't have the guys up front and we can't play the same DL all game long at a high level. The problems are on the lines, the OL looks better but we've also taken a starting guard and put him on the DL to plug a hole in the boat. We lost Evans and Sweat to dismissal, Evans was a starter and difference maker, we never saw sweat play due to him being in trouble but reports were great. Damon Knox opted to not come back for a 6th year, Cassius peat and Enoch smith both chose to transfer late in the year. We scrambled to get Kevin Williams and Gabe Sherrod but that's all that was out there. At least we had a killer DL class with 4 rivals 250 recruits and 2 are top 100.