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Kid Rock continues to suck

LOL: from the same article:

"Kid Rock was honored in 2011 by the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People branch in Detroit.'I've never flown that flag with any hate in my heart,' Ritchie told a crowd attending the organization's annual fundraising dinner that year. 'Not one ounce.'"


How long can anyone continue to feign ignorance over the symbolism inherent in flying that particular flag, given all the public scrutiny brought by the despicable kid in SC?
 
Tom Petty unequivably apologizes and retracts his past display of the Confederate flag, and regrets ever using it on stage. link.
 
Anyone who thinks That piece of shit flag has anything to do with Independence can flat out go F---- themselves.... That flag is a symbol of racism...
 
It's the flag of an enemy of the state. Racists use it because they equate it with the slave south. Non racists love it because they see it as the symbol of the south - of defiance, not slavery. Is it a racist flag? I guess it depends on your POV.

Any Northerner who flies the flag or is cool with it being flown on public property is either racist, ignorant, or is playing politics. The flag is legal for individuals to own and fly, but in no way is it okay for an enemy flag to be flown on gov't property.
 
It's the flag of an enemy of the state. Racists use it because they equate it with the slave south. Non racists love it because they see it as the symbol of the south - of defiance, not slavery. Is it a racist flag? I guess it depends on your POV.

Any Northerner who flies the flag or is cool with it being flown on public property is either racist, ignorant, or is playing politics. The flag is legal for individuals to own and fly, but in no way is it okay for an enemy flag to be flown on gov't property.

Would that people recognize the origins of the battle flag that was carried into action only by limited armies of the Confederacy. It was never the National Flag of the Confederacy. Or that, since slavery seems to be the focal point of its symbolism, we need to also consider striking the Stars and Stripes from all government property since it, too, was flown in support of slavery, and in reversing the progress of reconstruction, in interning Japanese-Americans, et al. If we are going to be sensitive of what flags can symbolize, we need to be thorough.
 
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Would that people recognize the origins of the battle flag that was carried into action only by limited armies of the Confederacy. It was never the National Flag of the Confederacy. Or that, since slavery seems to be the focal point of its symbolism, we need to also consider striking the Stars and Stripes from all government property since it, too, was flown in support of slavery, and in reversing the progress of reconstruction, in interning Japanese-Americans, et al. If we are going to be sensitive of what flags can symbolize, we need to be thorough.

I see some holes in that argument.
 
I see some holes in that argument.

I see some holes in the counter-argument. If one of them is that the starts and stripes represents an "ideal unfulfilled" well, now it actually does, ironically. And here I thought you'd be four-square in my corner.
 
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Clearly and regardless of the true history of the confederate flag, it stands for really one thing now ...and it's as much what those who were persecuted and wronged think as for any weight given to this sense of Southern Pride that matters.

Take the current rejuvenation for Don't Tread on Me ...half those flying that flag today couldn't tell you the first thing about its history beyond the 2008 election and creation of the Tea Party.
 
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I see some holes in the counter-argument. If one of them is that the starts and stripes represents an "ideal unfulfilled" well, now it actually does, ironically. And here I thought you'd be four-square in my corner.

well, certainly I'm a harsh critic of my government, but those abuses are not, of course, the only thing the US Flag stands for, and it has never stood for treason in defense of slavery.

trying to tie the Founding Fathers to the CSA because of their status as slaveholders (as some have done) is similarly false; they didn't commit treason.
Clearly and regardless of the true history of the confederate flag, it stands for really one thing now ...and it's as much what those who were persecuted and wronged think as for any weight given to this sense of Southern Pride that matters.

Take the current rejuvenation for Don't Tread on Me ...half those flying that flag today couldn't tell you the first thing about its history beyond the 2008 election and creation of the Tea Party.

yeah, that's pretty much it... everything I've read about the topic agrees that the current "Confederate flag" more or less made it's modern appearance in the 1960's as a symbol of opposition to the Civil Rights movement across the South. So these days, it stands for one (1) thing; you can't say that about the National US Flag. Beyond that, if you want to go REALLY retro it was one of the emblems of treason in defense of slavery... that's something to be proud of?
 
to the extent Kid Rock, and the rednecks he panders to in his fanbase are being honest, and they aren't racist but simply want some symbol to fly to show they don't go for all that "coffee drinkin', book-learnin', indie rock them liberals in the cities do"... maybe they can come up with some alternate flag to fly that isn't connected in some way to the Confederacy, or modern opposition to the Civil Rights movement?

I'd propose something that includes a monster truck, gun(s), alcoholic beverages, oxy pills, mud, scantily clad 40-something lady missing a tooth
 
to the extent Kid Rock, and the rednecks he panders to in his fanbase are being honest, and they aren't racist but simply want some symbol to fly to show they don't go for all that "coffee drinkin', book-learnin', indie rock them liberals in the cities do"... maybe they can come up with some alternate flag to fly that isn't connected in some way to the Confederacy, or modern opposition to the Civil Rights movement?

I'd propose something that includes a monster truck, gun(s), alcoholic beverages, oxy pills, mud, scantily clad 40-something lady missing a tooth

Here's outlaw country music icon David Alan Coe in one of the few pictures a person could find of him WITHOUT some image of the (what has come to be called, but isn't really) confederate flag, but instead looks like a head adornment paying tribute to Kwanzaa, or Judaism, or both:

50db1c671a279.image.jpg


So maybe they could put this on a flag.

EDIT: Oh - it also looks like it might be saluting same sex marriage.
 
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well, certainly I'm a harsh critic of my government, but those abuses are not, of course, the only thing the US Flag stands for, and it has never stood for treason in defense of slavery.

It certainly flew over a land that defended slavery and then, subsequently, Jim Crow, for more than 175 years.

trying to tie the Founding Fathers to the CSA because of their status as slaveholders (as some have done) is similarly false; they didn't commit treason.

I do not believe that the CSA committed treason. Secession is not treason. Even the Northern politicians of the day recognized that. Otherwise, scores of Southern officials would have been tried for it.
 
Would that people recognize the origins of the battle flag that was carried into action only by limited armies of the Confederacy. It was never the National Flag of the Confederacy. Or that, since slavery seems to be the focal point of its symbolism, we need to also consider striking the Stars and Stripes from all government property since it, too, was flown in support of slavery, and in reversing the progress of reconstruction, in interning Japanese-Americans, et al. If we are going to be sensitive of what flags can symbolize, we need to be thorough.

1. I never said this flag was the flag of the entire Confederacy. I said that it was the flag of an enemy of the State. That is all that truly matters.

2. The 50 star American flag never flew over a land that had slavery. This flag has only been a part of America since 1960, so it also did not fly over Japanese American Internment camps.

3. Nobody in America uses the current or older American flags as a symbol of hatred. And if any do, it's a very small number. On the other hand, in my high school and many others that were in my area, racist kids would draw, print out, or buy those confederate flags as the symbol for their hatred of black people. My area was not alone in this as I've heard stories from friends who live in Pennsylvania and Indiana who have said the same.

4. The first Amendment gives freedom of speech and the right to fly whatever flag you want...even if it is hateful. Enjoy it.
 
1. I never said this flag was the flag of the entire Confederacy. I said that it was the flag of an enemy of the State. That is all that truly matters.

Not even Lincoln, Grant or Sherman considered any Confederate soldier or sympathizer an "enemy of the state" which, to me, is not consistent with the spirit and meaning of what was at one time a Constitutionally Limited Republic.

2. The 50 star American flag never flew over a land that had slavery. This flag has only been a part of America since 1960, so it also did not fly over Japanese American Internment camps.

So the U.S. is so much more "progressive" now? I disagree. It's regressing at warp speed.

3. Nobody in America uses the current or older American flags as a symbol of hatred. And if any do, it's a very small number. On the other hand, in my high school and many others that were in my area, racist kids would draw, print out, or buy those confederate flags as the symbol for their hatred of black people. My area was not alone in this as I've heard stories from friends who live in Pennsylvania and Indiana who have said the same.

So blame the person and not the symbol. That's been my point all along. Until a month ago, this was not even a story, until some crazed young white kid snapped in a church. I have no cause to display the battle flag of Northern Virginia, but I will not assume that someone who does is a racist or hatred-fueled.
 
Not even Lincoln, Grant or Sherman considered any Confederate soldier or sympathizer an "enemy of the state" which, to me, is not consistent with the spirit and meaning of what was at one time a Constitutionally Limited Republic.



So the U.S. is so much more "progressive" now? I disagree. It's regressing at warp speed.



So blame the person and not the symbol. That's been my point all along. Until a month ago, this was not even a story, until some crazed young white kid snapped in a church. I have no cause to display the battle flag of Northern Virginia, but I will not assume that someone who does is a racist or hatred-fueled.

Then I suggest you move to Russia. American Conservatives now have more in common with Russia than they do with the majority of America now.

And I disagree. This has been an issue for a long time but it's never been given the respect of being a legitimate story. I don't get why you are defending this so much. No rights are being taken from anybody in the country.
 
Then I suggest you move to Russia. American Conservatives now have more in common with Russia than they do with the majority of America now.

"Love it or leave it." What a turn of circumstances. And the American "Liberals" in office are equally draconian in my opinion. And their liberal supporters celebrate and defend the barbaric concept of abortion. Same as Russia. So, I guess ..."what difference does it make?" The presumption is that we are prone to err and government is our chaperonage.

And I disagree. This has been an issue for a long time but it's never been given the respect of being a legitimate story. I don't get why you are defending this so much. No rights are being taken from anybody in the country.

I reject that anyone who displays the battle flag of Northern Virginia is a de-facto racist, notwithstanding that some who do are. It's this mob-like mindset that I challenge.
 
You have a warped view of reality. And if you read my first comment, you'd see that i don't think all supporters are racist.
 
You have a warped view of reality. And if you read my first comment, you'd see that i don't think all supporters are racist.

You state that American "Conservatives" "now have more in common with Russia than they do with the majority of America." I agree with you. I toss in the "Liberals" and that suddenly makes my view of reality "warped?"

Well, present-day reality is indeed "warped" so you might be on to something.
 
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