this should be under the politics tab

michchamp said:

this should be under the politics tab

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If I put it under the politics tab, you would have said it belongs under the religion tab.

Maybe we should have a separate Palestine, Israel or the Pope tab.

Gulo Blue said:

If I put it under the politics tab, you would have said it belongs under the religion tab.

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no, that's not true.

palestine's status is obviously a political issue, and this is a secular ruling from the pope. he's not like declaring the eucharist isn't the body of Christ.

tinselwolverine said:

Maybe we should have a separate Palestine, Israel or the Pope tab.

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could you move this thread to the politics thread, or is there a high risk you screw it up like the dumb recruit/softball championship threads on the Michigan board.

maybe a different mod should do it. Bob?

tinselwolverine said:

Maybe we should have a separate Palestine, Israel or the Pope tab.

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I'd go the other way. All of Diggler's Junk would become two tabs: Diggler's Junk for people that feel like being assholes, and Diggler's Junk for people that don't want to be offended. Hopefully we wouldn't have as many threads devolve into who called who a name first that way.

I'd probably screw it up. I might even accidentally create a new Palestine, Israel or the Pope tab.

So pretty good idea to ask somebody else.

The bigger question would be is Israel now having a fit?

NM, obviously they are, only have time to skim the article for now.

Thumb said:

The bigger question would be is Israel now having a fit?

NM, obviously they are, only have time to skim the article for now.

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http://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/vatican-recognizes-state-palestine-new-treaty-n358286

The Israeli foreign ministry said it was "disappointed" by the development. "This move does not promote the peace process and distances the Palestinian leadership from returning to direct and bilateral negotiations," the ministry said in a text message. "Israel will study the agreement and will consider its steps accordingly."

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Gulo Blue said:

I'd go the other way. All of Diggler's Junk would become two tabs: Diggler's Junk for people that feel like being assholes, and Diggler's Junk for people that don't want to be offended. Hopefully we wouldn't have as many threads devolve into who called who a name first that way.

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your solution won't work if spartanhack still has access to both sections.

michchamp said:

your solution won't work if spartanhack still has access to both sections.

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I hereby recognize both MC and Spartanmack as independent states.

(Let's see if that helps or hurts the peace process.)

Gulo Blue said:

I hereby recognize both MC and Spartanmack as independent states.

(Let's see if that helps or hurts the peace process.)

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my advice to you: go back and just delete this post. it's stupid.

if you do that, I'll delete this one.

Gulo Blue said:

I hereby recognize both MC and Spartanmack as independent states.

(Let's see if that helps or hurts the peace process.)

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michchamp said:

my advice to you: go back and just delete this post. it's stupid.

if you do that, I'll delete this one.

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There.

Now neither of you can delete.

well, shoot.

Gulo Blue said:

I'd go the other way. All of Diggler's Junk would become two tabs: Diggler's Junk for people that feel like being assholes, and Diggler's Junk for people that don't want to be offended. Hopefully we wouldn't have as many threads devolve into who called who a name first that way.

Click to expand...

michchamp said:

your solution won't work if spartanhack still has access to both sections.

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He started it!

I have never understood Israel's position on this. Creating the state of Palestine is actually in Israel's best interest. As long as Palestine does not exist, Israel is the one oppressing Palestinians. Create Palestine and then,if the Palestinians continue launching rockets and attacking Israel, the UN will not have the oppression excuse. They would, if they have an ounce of integrity, need to denounce the attacks.

Of course, Palestinians will possibly continue to decry the oppressive state of Israel as the reason for the attacks and pressure the UN toward denouncing the existence of Israel and such because the UN, like all political groups, do not have much integrity. I wonder if Champ will continue to agree with them and blame it on Israel too.

Regardless, Palestine being created is the smart move. Expose the reality, Palestinians want Israel wiped off the map and won't settle for this minor concession but continue pushing forward with their militaristic stance.

No, I am not suggesting Israel is innocent. In truth, if the situation was reversed, I'm quite certain Israel woukd behave exactly the same way. After all, that's hiw Israel was created, right? The entire region seems doomed to continue cycling through one side being the governing state and oppressing the other until a power shift happens and the other nation takes control. Every now and then an outside nation will briefly takeover, but then one of these two obtain enough power to fight them off and kick them out so they may then oppress the other group once more. Jews have definitely been to blame for that in the past, and likely will be again...same goes for the Palestinians.

The ominous problem that now exists though is Israel has nukes. Maybe that mutual agreed destruction threat will finally be enough to make them live more agreeably? (notice, I did not use peacefully, for that is highly unlikely to ever happen)

zyxt9 said:

Of course, Palestinians will possibly continue to decry the oppressive state of Israel as the reason for the attacks and pressure the UN toward denouncing the existence of Israel and such because the UN, like all political groups, do not have much integrity. I wonder if Champ will continue to agree with them and blame it on Israel too

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You know why Israel is upset about this move? Because they have allowed their citizens to settle in the occupied Palestinian territories, even though the UN (lacking integrity) has denounced this. Israel is just doing a land grab, no more justifiable than what Putin is doing in the Ukraine, except at least Putin seems comfortable in the role of villain, while Israel plays the victim, even though they rack up higher body counts than the Palestinians do.

There is no legitimate reason Palestine should not have it's own recognized state already, and be free from it's occupiers. Then they can fight it out if they want as equals.

zyxt9 said:

They would, if they have an ounce of integrity...

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Not this again.

Thumb said:

You know why Israel is upset about this move? Because they have allowed their citizens to settle in the occupied Palestinian territories, even though the UN (lacking integrity) has denounced this. Israel is just doing a land grab, no more justifiable than what Putin is doing in the Ukraine, except at least Putin seems comfortable in the role of villain, while Israel plays the victim, even though they rack up higher body counts than the Palestinians do.

There is no legitimate reason Palestine should not have it's own recognized state already, and be free from it's occupiers. Then they can fight it out if they want as equals.

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I mostly agree with what you are saying, right up to the "fight it out as equals".

Does that mean Palestine will have the world's support until they have nukes? That is a concern since they have declared their goal is to wipe Israel off the map, not to mention the terrorist groups would likely be willing to use dirty bombs and then the Palestinian government gets a "freebie" since it was a terrorist group instead of the actual state government?

Does Israel deserve to have nukes when the others do not? No. I'd prefer none of those nations have nukes with their itchy trigger fingers. The world has survived via the threat of mutual assured destruction...I'm just not sure the same people who believe it is ok to die in the name of Allah will give a fuck about the mutual assured destruction part since they get to go to heaven and chill with virgins for blowing up Israel despite it causing the subsequent destruction of Palestine.

If nukes are removed from the "equal" part, are you saying they should be armed and trained with the same level of military expertise as Israel? It is highly doubtful Palestine can defeat Israel in a conventional conflict at their current levels.

But yes, Israel has amplified the problems with the land grab tactics. And yes, I do agree Palestine should be it's own state. I'm just not optimistic it will solve much as I doubt Palestinians will be appeased by such a thing. They want far more, they want Jerusalem under their control, which Israel will not concede. So the next step is to say "poor Palestine, if only Israel would give them Jerusalem and stop their oppression of the Muslim religion".

The pendulum is swinging away from Israel being in control and moving toward Palestine having control of the region, and the cycle continues.

zyxt9 said:

... That is a concern since they have declared their goal is to wipe Israel off the map ...

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and this is somehow worse than how Israel is actively wiping Palestine and Palestinians off the map, settlement by settlement?

what planet are you posting from again? It can't be Earth.