Is "red lock" like being on double secret probation?

I like UM as an insider, he posted a ton of stuff on mblog about things with Michigan.

But the sheer hard-on he's getting from this MSU fall-out is a bad look, IMO.

dubbsco said:

I like UM as an insider, he posted a ton of stuff on mblog about things with Michigan.

But the sheer hard-on he's getting from this MSU fall-out is a bad look, IMO.

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Well, I mean, pride does come before the fall. I heard that somewhere.

michchamp said:

Is "red lock" like being on double secret probation?

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It's some bullshit Dantonio came up with. It's like when you're in jail, then released, and then reinstated to the team immediately so you can start in the game that is played two days later.

It's a very harsh policy.

This is sad, I know for a fact Monster never intended this place to be the "red cedar message board" for Michigan fans. A couple of you apples are spoiling the lot.

gotime909 said:

This is sad, I know for a fact Monster never intended this place to be the "red cedar message board" for Michigan fans. A couple of you apples are spoiling the lot.

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What's sad is the culture Dantonio has created by his lack of discipline regarding serious offenses.

Delton Williams pulled a gun in a road rage incident, served jail time, and was immediately reinstated. Link

Glenn Winston broke a hockey player's jaw with a sucker punch, served 180 days in jail, and was immediately reinstated. Link

20 MSU football players got in a fight at Rather Hall, spearheaded by Winston. He and only one other were dismissed. Link

Chris L Rucker: DUI, on probation, released from jail Thursday, played Saturday. Link

MacGarrett Kings, DUI, zero game suspension. Link

Macgarrett Kings one year later, drunk and disorderly, kicks PACE car, resisting arrest, zero game suspension. Link. Kings DUI was a "super" DUI with a .22 BAC.

I wonder why players thought they could get away with anything and only get a wrist slap?

gotime909 said:

This is sad, I know for a fact Monster never intended this place to be the "red cedar message board" for Michigan fans. A couple of you apples are spoiling the lot.

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yeah, it's surprising we'd be talking about all this. there is so much other college football stuff in the news right now.

gotime909 said:

This is sad, I know for a fact Monster never intended this place to be the "red cedar message board" for Michigan fans. A couple of you apples are spoiling the lot.

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I speculate that were these M players ... say Gary, McDoom and .. let's throw in Taco (for the added drama of that he's not on the team now)... the six people who post on the MSU forum would be gathering like ants to a Lil' Debbie treat.

thewolverines24 said:

What's sad is the culture Dantonio has created by his lack of discipline regarding serious offenses.

Delton Williams pulled a gun in a road rage incident, served jail time, and was immediately reinstated. Link

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This is incorrect. Delton Williams lost his scholarship for the year. The incident occurred during the off-season and he completed his punishment before being allowed back on the team. Also, Williams was a concealed carry permit holder who pulled his gun on a guy that followed and harranged him after a traffic incident. The accuser spoke on his behalf and asked that charges be dropped.

thewolverines24 said:

Glenn Winston broke a hockey player's jaw with a sucker punch, served 180 days in jail, and was immediately reinstated. Link

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This is mostly true and it was poorly handled by Dantonio - everyone acknowledges that, including Dantonio.

thewolverines24 said:

20 MSU football players got in a fight at Rather Hall, spearheaded by Winston. He and only one other were dismissed. Link

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This is incorrect. It was 10, not 20. 5 of the 10 participated in the fight while the others watched. Winston and Jenrette were kicked off the team and out of school while the other 8 were suspended and sat out the Alamo Bowl. There's video evidence from the dorm.

thewolverines24 said:

Chris L Rucker: DUI, on probation, released from jail Thursday, played Saturday. Link

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Rucker missed 2 games while serving 8 days for DUI. How many more should he have sat out?

thewolverines24 said:

MacGarrett Kings, DUI, zero game suspension. Link

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Another off-season violation in April. He was suspended and missed spring practices and the spring game. He got his punishment, and was reinstated before fall practice after meeting all the requirements the team and school set for him. How many programs suspend players for DUI or other non-violent offenses in the off season? And if you don't think missing spring ball is a real punishment - he dropped to second string and struggled to earn playing time that season.

thewolverines24 said:

Macgarrett Kings one year later, drunk and disorderly, kicks PACE car, resisting arrest, zero game suspension. Link. Kings DUI was a "super" DUI with a .22 BAC.

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Another non-violent, off-season misdemeanor. The kid served his punishment and was given another chance. It seems appropriate for the crime.

thewolverines24 said:

I wonder why players thought they could get away with anything and only get a wrist slap?

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you wonder why probably because you've taken mostly non-violent off season infractions, ignored the punishments and made them out to be much more than they are then said there were no consequences. And in the few instances involving violent offenses, you've gotten most of the facts wrong, either failed to look into them or are out-right lying about the players not being punished so you can tell more lies about how Dantonio doesn't take character issues seriously, which as we know is the exact opposite of what a third party investigator recently found and reported. MSU has set an example for how to deal with sexual assault cases involving student athletes. Our friends in AA should learn from this so they'll know better what to do for next Brendan Gibbons and Taylor Lewan.

byco42 said:

I speculate that were these M players ... say Gary, McDoom and .. let's throw in Taco (for the added drama of that he's not on the team now)... the six people who post on the MSU forum would be gathering like ants to a Lil' Debbie treat.

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That and its not an accurate comparison. Red cedar is where state fans obsess over Michigan and take non-issues and make mountains out of them.

This is very serious and real criminal activity and what appears to be accepted by a culture not unlike that at Baylor. And it's bein discussed here because it's happening. It's not at all like red cedar where state fans obsess over Harbaugh.

And ...it is 'Pride comes before the fall' type shit. A LOT of state fans - alumni or otherwise- have been running their mouths for years. Sucks but spartys are goIn to have to take it. And take a beating this October in Ann Arbor.

TheVictors said:

That and its not an accurate comparison. Red cedar is where state fans obsess over Michigan and take non-issues and make mountains out of them.

This is very serious and real criminal activity and what appears to be accepted by a culture not unlike that at Baylor. And it's bein discussed here because it's happening. It's not at all like red cedar where state fans obsess over Harbaugh.

And ...it is 'Pride comes before the fall' type shit. A LOT of state fans - alumni or otherwise- have been running their mouths for years. Sucks but spartys are goIn to have to take it. And take a beating this October in Ann Arbor.

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this has already been debunked but go ahead and run with it if it makes you feel better.

Spartanmack said:

this has already been debunked but go ahead and run with it if it makes you feel better.

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It's not an isolated incident. Debunk away if it makes you feel better.

TheVictors said:

It's not an isolated incident. Debunk away if it makes you feel better.

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it's two isolated incidents and both were dealt with swiftly, publicly and appropriately. I don't debunk to feel good, I do it to expose the lies of the haters and educate the willfully ignorant. I do feel good about how the school and the program has handled these instances - any reasonable, unbiased observer would probably agree.

actually three incidents if you count Keith Mumphery.

michchamp said:

actually three incidents if you count Keith Mumphery.

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The Ingham County prosecutor declined to press charges in that case - the accuser never returned calls from investigators. Maybe Taylor Lewan stopped by her dorm.

Mack, I know you are trying to explain away all the situations that have happened in East Lansing. Hell, I have even gone out of my way to defend Dantonio on other forums.

But if you don't think something is wrong with the culture, you have your head in the sand. You have guys on the board of trustees going on radio shows to single out people. Reports about this huge fracture in the locker room.

I think the obvious answer here is that he got away from recruiting those character athletes and went for the bigger stars, and he doesn't really know how to handle it.

And the snap reaction is to bring up the Gibbons/Lewan case. Yeah, we all know it was completely handled like shit and it is a bad look. But it has nothing to do what is happening at YOUR SCHOOL.

Hollis and Dantonio look and sound like they have aged 20 years. If they make it another 2, 3 years at MSU, I'll be stunned. Hollis especially. He's got much bigger fish to fry with the Nassar situation.

Spartanmack said:

The Ingham County prosecutor declined to press charges in that case - the accuser never returned calls from investigators. Maybe Taylor Lewan stopped by her dorm.

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maybe so, but still MSU itself investigated the incident, found he violated the campus sexual assault policy, expelled him, and banned him from campus until Dec 2018.

since it sounds like you missed this recent news this while conduting your oh-so-thorough investigation of sexual assault and rape at your alma mater, here's a link for reference.

If you don't think Dantonio is a big reason for the culture problem, see post #7. Dantonio set a precedent that players could do whatever they wanted and get nothing more than a slap on the wrist. Dantonio's hand had to be forced for him to levy out any real punishment.

the MSU board of directors recently issued a statement that Hollis & Dantonio had their full support.

in 21st century America, that actually means: "do something to get this bad press off page one, or your ass is history tomorrow."

the football season can't start soon enough for these two.