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Ron Gardenhire next Tigers Manager

I always admired how the twins played. They always took the extra base and manufactured runs. He managed how Ausmus was supposed to manage. I can't complain.
 
I have to say this is a bad hire, even though we're years away from contending and this job will consist mainly of babysitting young players. It's really disappointing to hear about how far behind we were in analytics, I never thought we were leading the pack but after JV's turnaround due to the wealth of information he was given in Houston just shows how far behind we were. Ausmus said that he didn't use a lot of advanced stats because he didn't have access to them with the Tigers, that's a big factor in the team being disappointing over the years. Usage of analytics could have been the difference between a disappointing playoffs and winning a world series, especially considering that at one time had 4 current or future Cy Young winners in their rotation.

I understand that the team needs to get younger, faster, cheaper and every mid market franchise has to do that, even the Yankees did that, but it's really sad when you understand how far the front office has to go. I have very little confidence in Avila, he might draft or collect some young talent by default but he's not going to outsmart other GM's, especially when he thought signing Mike Pelfrey was a good idea. If we had a strong analytics department, that never would have happened.

I would have much preferred a Gabe Kapler or another young guy who brings a fresh perspective to this franchise. Gardenhire says the right thing about analytics but I can't help but think that he sounds like your grandpa saying he wants to try snapchat.
 
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I have to say this is a bad hire, even though we're years away from contending and this job will consist mainly of babysitting young players. It's really disappointing to hear about how far behind we were in analytics, I never thought we were leading the pack but after JV's turnaround due to the wealth of information he was given in Houston just shows how far behind we were. Ausmus said that he didn't use a lot of advanced stats because he didn't have access to them with the Tigers, that's a big factor in the team being disappointing over the years. Usage of analytics could have been the difference between a disappointing playoffs and winning a world series, especially considering that at one time had 4 current or future Cy Young winners in their rotation.

I understand that the team needs to get younger, faster, cheaper and every mid market franchise has to do that, even the Yankees did that, but it's really sad when you understand how far the front office has to go. I have very little confidence in Avila, he might draft or collect some young talent by default but he's not going to outsmart other GM's, especially when he thought signing Mike Pelfrey was a good idea. If we had a strong analytics department, that never would have happened.

I would have much preferred a Gabe Kapler or another young guy who brings a fresh perspective to this franchise. Gardenhire says the right thing about analytics but I can't help but think that he sounds like your grandpa saying he wants to try snapchat.

What does Kapler know about analytic? We had a young guy (with no ML managerial experience), it didn't work. We need a seasoned vet with this bunch. Analytic would have been nice but Kapler would be horrible. Leyland didn't know analytic but managed just fine.
 
Gardenhire = placeholder and the easy choice. Absolutely zero expectations from him other than please don't burn down the clubhouse.
 
Gardenhire = placeholder and the easy choice. Absolutely zero expectations from him other than please don't burn down the clubhouse.

It will be about the coaches he hires. Hopefully a better bunch than we currently have.
 
What does Kapler know about analytic? We had a young guy (with no ML managerial experience), it didn't work. We need a seasoned vet with this bunch. Analytic would have been nice but Kapler would be horrible. Leyland didn't know analytic but managed just fine.


There we go .." Leyland Managed Fine" lol. Maybe with advanced anylitics the dumb ass would have had a better post season record with us and not fading September's.
Maybe helped with his bullpen decsions. We shall see. RG says all the right things but I have no faith In Avila and his staff at all. Advance stats work. Tigers are just way behind like always .
 
There we go .." Leyland Managed Fine" lol. Maybe with advanced anylitics the dumb ass would have had a better post season record with us and not fading September's.
Maybe helped with his bullpen decsions. We shall see. RG says all the right things but I have no faith In Avila and his staff at all. Advance stats work. Tigers are just way behind like always .

When was the last manager in Detroit to get to two WS? When did any other manager win back to back division titles for us. Not sure why the hate.. What happen to Houston and their 3 100+ lose seasons with their advanced stats. Houston is good for one reason, they tanked enough to get some good draft picks.

Analytics are mostly just common sense.
 
One example to your anti-Leyland thing going..

San Francisco and their 3 Titles in 5 years. They probably over exceeded their regular seasons with great playoff runs. But at the time they didn't do anything related to analytics.
 
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When was the last manager in Detroit to get to two WS? When did any other manager win back to back division titles for us. Not sure why the hate.. What happen to Houston and their 3 100+ lose seasons with their advanced stats. Houston is good for one reason, they tanked enough to get some good draft picks.

Analytics are mostly just common sense.

Nice we had a ten year run with no WS titles . I'm not going to rehash all of smokey's mistakes because there is the manager can do no wrong camp on this board and the other that its only the players fault . When in fact it's all of the above. Was he better then Brad yup he was . But don't act like he didn't make mistakes because there were plenty.

Again
I hope Ron works out but it sounded like Brad didn't even have any advance stats at his disposal :/ wtf.

Heck does everyone forget missing the playoffs 4 years in a row after 2006 ?
Oh wait my bad it was 3 out of 4 because we lost game 163 in 2009. A Freaking Team that was up 7 games on September 6th of that season. Classic Leyland September. Starting Alfredo Figaro in game 161 ? Wtf !! Let's not forget the 4-2 twin losses to The Red Sox and Rangers in the playoffs .. what one guy Nelson Cruz hit billion home runs off us and well crap we all remember the game 2 debacle in boston in 2013.
 
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There we go .." Leyland Managed Fine" lol. Maybe with advanced anylitics the dumb ass would have had a better post season record with us and not fading September's.
Maybe helped with his bullpen decsions. We shall see. RG says all the right things but I have no faith In Avila and his staff at all. Advance stats work. Tigers are just way behind like always .

if winning in the post season is important to you...post season winning percentage

JL .524 (.521 with Det)

RG .222
 
What does Kapler know about analytic? We had a young guy (with no ML managerial experience), it didn't work. We need a seasoned vet with this bunch. Analytic would have been nice but Kapler would be horrible. Leyland didn't know analytic but managed just fine.

He's the director of player development for the dodgers, he has one season of minor league managing experience and managed in the WBC. The Dodgers are a heavily analytics based franchise, he would have been my pick. I don't think we really need a seasoned vet, we need to get with the times and we took a step backwards.

I do agree that Leyland managed just fine for the time that he was our manager, failures were a lot more due to injuries and bullpen failure than him.
 
It will be about the coaches he hires. Hopefully a better bunch than we currently have.

He'll hire similar benign coaching staff ... jackets on, hands in pockets, lumps on the bench ... Zzzzzzzzzzzzzz
 
if winning in the post season is important to you...post season winning percentage

JL .524 (.521 with Det)

RG .222

I never said I liked the hire. I'm on board with it but it doesn't move the needle. Neither use anylitics. My guess is it would have put them over the hump one of those years if we would have been at the for front of the movement and not the bottom half of the league .
 
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This franchise needs an overhaul of management, coaching, and scouting, Gardenhire is a 3 year placeholder to placate season-ticket holders with a known quantity, instead of a future-forward manager with some risk involved. But with winning seasons at least a few, if not several years away, why the hell not?

On the bright side, however, maybe Avila will take the fall if Gardy epic fails.
 
Joe Girardi is out as Yankee's Manager. He had a 910-710 record and the Yankees won a World Series under him (or despite him being the manager). 10 years with the Yankees and he didn't have a single losing season.

BLUF...Girardi is an arrogant asshole, who refused to give into analytics.

Simply put, talent wins. The manager is there to not and screw things up. Girardi is on par with Ausmus, in that they do some of the stupidest things as a manager. There are at least 15-20 MLB caliber managers who would have done more with the Yankees during Girardi's tenure, then what Girardi did.

20-game winners need run support, or they don't win 20 games. Just ask Rick Porcello. Managers don't win, or win in the playoffs, without talent. Citing a starting pitcher's win-loss record his meaningless. Citing a manager's win-loss record is also meaningless. Even their playoff records can be suspect.

Money can buy you talent. For smaller market teams (see Pirates, Royals, etc) strong analytics gives you bang for the buck. Moneyball was all about analytics. When "old school" managers get fired, like Dusty Baker, it wasn't that their teams didn't win, it was that they didn't met expectations.
 
Yes talent. Enough to get us 2 WS opportunities. But lack of analytics didn't suddenly lose those WS after getting there. I love analytics but I also love common sense. It wasn't lack of analytics that got them to sign Pelfrey.. It was a dumb GM.
 
Yes talent. Enough to get us 2 WS opportunities. But lack of analytics didn't suddenly lose those WS after getting there. I love analytics but I also love common sense. It wasn't lack of analytics that got them to sign Pelfrey.. It was a dumb GM.

But analytics can get you that extra out. To know how to pitch to a certain player. To position your fielders in a certain manner. That is what analytics and a manger willing to use that information can do.

The extreme shifts in recent years came from analytics. And until the hitters adjust, the shifts are going to stay. It is like 4-3 or 3-4 defenses in football. West Coast offense. Triangle offense in NBA. Teams will use what works. And when and if it stops working, they move on to the next advantage. You still need the talent for 3-4 defense to work. Drafting slow linebackers when you feature a 3-4 defense is stupidity.

Yes, Avila is a horrendous GM. But, not having a forward looking manager might be a mute point, it does have a bearing on the Tigers long term.
 
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