It's a bummer after 25 years there will be no playoffs for the Wings..

How can an NHL team, after 56 games, the lead goal scorer is at 14? This is pathetic. We need a new goalie and definitely a goal scorer.. Someone who can score 40-50 in a season.

Now that I look at the leader board, 30 is the most. And 63 points. What happened to 100 points in a season?

Outside Ovechkin, 50 goals is a thing of the past I guess. It's not the 80's any more.

Zip. Fun last two minutes though but a bad goal in the first did us in..

I am unsure why the NHL scoring seems to be worse every sesson. Maybe it's a lot of things. To much clutching and grabbing allowed ? Team many teams with the talent spread to thin? Maybe the talent is worse than years ago. Also goalies are better too.

Personally I think the NHL should be played on Olympic size ice. Open the the rinks . Maybe that would solve some scoring problems.

Finding someone who can score 40-50 is much easier said than done. However, getting a top 2-3 draft pick is the start of something good. They have to do this the right way. Be sellers at the deadline, unload Vanek and whoever else teams are willing to take.

biggunsbob said:

I am unsure why the NHL scoring seems to be worse every sesson. Maybe it's a lot of things. To much clutching and grabbing allowed ? Team many teams with the talent spread to thin? Maybe the talent is worse than years ago. Also goalies are better too.

Personally I think the NHL should be played on Olympic size ice. Open the the rinks . Maybe that would solve some scoring problems.

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I'd be okay with the bigger rink. In baseball I don't mind low scoring but I need some goals in the NHL. I think it is more grabbing, clutching etc. I mentioned before I thought the game looked more choppy. Seems everyone has one hand on their stick and just chopping at it all game.

Not sure if it's better goalies or the talent is thinned out or a combination. I just know the Wings, where 14 goals leads the team is weak.

Mitchrapp said:

I just know the Wings, where 14 goals leads the team is weak.

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For Detroit in 2015-16 the lead in goals/points was 23 goals from Larkin and 50 points from Zetterberg.

Currently Zetterberg is on pace for 59 points and Vanek is on pace for 22 goals.

Last time anyone on Detroit broke 30 goal mark was 2008-9 which is 8 years ago. Hossa (40), Franzen (34), Datsyuk (32), Zetterberg (31).

Mitchrapp said:

Not sure if it's better goalies or the talent is thinned out or a combination.

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Better goalies, bigger pads, better players, better coaching, better scouting and rewarding NOT winning. Most importantly, more balanced teams due to salary cap.


The goalies right now are a lot better than they were 20 years ago. The average height for an NHL player is 6'2. The goalies are now bigger, faster, and better trained.

The butterfly style of goaltending which took the league by storm in the 90s is a vastly superior style to standup.

Even if you ignore the size difference and the pad sizes, a butterfly or hybrid goalie will be far better at covering the lower part of the net than a traditional standup. You know.... where every d-man aims when shooting from the point.




Note the difference in size between Price and Halak in the images below. Comparison of modern butterfly position with goalies over difference sizes.
*Note how the pads are stacked on the ice. This form is highly effective against low shots which plagued the standup style.



As for talent being lower I also disagree. Your modern 3rd/4th liners can do what top talent in the 90s could never dream of. Player development from both skill and conditioning has taken massive leaps since the influx of Soviet players into the league.

Players from a young age are taught the importance of conditioning and nutrition. For example, Gary Roberts was one of the first players to start taking nutrition seriously and that was in his 30s! Hasek did not get into nutrition until is 40s when his brother (a football player) got him into it. Hasek who was a 'skinny' guy lost 10-15 lbs in his 40s to keep up with the young players!! It helped extend his career.

As athletes, the modern players are stronger and faster than their equivalents from the 90s. The skill is also higher especially since the major improvements in the minor leagues down to youth hockey. Canada is the prime example. More recently you can look at the US hockey development program. The U18 tournaments the past few years have been dominated by the US teams.


Recall the interviews from some of the series that the Soviet team player NHL players. The Soviets were smaller but they were physically stronger because they actually trained to improve as athletes. That was rare here now it is the norm across the board.

Another example, Howe vs his contemporaries.

Which brings us to coaching. Back in the day multi minute shifts were the normal. Now 20-30 second shifts are the norm.
Who do you think has the competitive advantage, the guy at tail end of 2 minute shift or the guy straight off the bench?



The talent pool is deeper than it has ever been. Only place where the 'talent pool' is shrinking is the former Soviet countries. I can go into several paragraphs on that but is easily summarized by this;

Hockey is a rich man's game. Countries where the population is poor will produce "less" quality players.

biggunsbob said:

I am unsure why the NHL scoring seems to be worse every sesson. Maybe it's a lot of things. To much clutching and grabbing allowed ? Team many teams with the talent spread to thin? Maybe the talent is worse than years ago. Also goalies are better too.

Personally I think the NHL should be played on Olympic size ice. Open the the rinks . Maybe that would solve some scoring problems.

Click to expand...

Clutching/grabbing is not the reason. If you've seen last night's game recall the Nick Jensen holding penalty. Compare that to the grabbing of the 90s.

Goalies are considerably better. But also the gap between top talent and and rest of players is narrower than ever. Just compare the physical training regimes of modern players compared to those who chose to train at all in the past.

Take for example players like Bure and Fedorov who had explosive speed. When they broke into the NHL they could outskate 99% of the league. Nowadays their skating would simply be above average.


Also the coaching is a lot different. The structure in place kills a lot of the creativity that players have because they are forced to play 'the system'. Take for example the neutral zone trap which was infamous in the late 90s and into the 00s. Neutral zone trap and playing defence first hockey stopped the constant breakaways players had. As we all know unless your name is Darren Helm you have a decent chance of scoring on a breakaway.

*Boom* shots fired.

Thanks for all the info, Polish. But if you saw the first goal against us last night the good goaling isn't on our team.

"Back in the day multi minute shifts were the normal. Now 20-30 second shifts are the norm."

This is not a good thing. They barely skate and then dump it and then there's no action for a bit. In fact my opinion is just like baseball's SP's, their conditioning doesn't allow them to take long shifts. You see tired after a long shift I see conditioning to go 2 minute shifts.

SP's aren't more conditioned. Back in the day when 300IP was the norm those P's were just as good at the end of games, and end of seasons as they were at the beginning.

Mitchrapp said:

Thanks for all the info, Polish. But if you saw the first goal against us last night the good goaling isn't on our team.

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I saw goal and wasn't too impressed.

Wasn't a good goal, but neither was the defensive coverage on the goal either. Mrazek had to be sharp to bail out that twit Smith.

Mitchrapp said:

"Back in the day multi minute shifts were the normal. Now 20-30 second shifts are the norm."

This is not a good thing. They barely skate and then dump it and then there's no action for a bit. In fact my opinion is just like baseball's SP's, their conditioning doesn't allow them to take long shifts. You see tired after a long shift I see conditioning to go 2 minute shifts.

SP's aren't more conditioned. Back in the day when 300IP was the norm those P's were just as good at the end of games, and end of seasons as they were at the beginning.

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The decrease to to 20-40 second shift is due to coaching rather than the players ability.

I don't watch American cricket. Hence can't comment on SPs.

Polish-Hammer said:

The decrease to to 20-40 second shift is due to coaching rather than the players ability.

I don't watch American cricket. Hence can't comment on SPs.

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It might have been the coaches decisions but on a power-play last night, I forget which team, one shift had to be out there a bit longer than normal and when play was stopped they were bushed (defense), slumped over.. I guess when you get used to 20-30 second shifts any more is hard to accomplish.

Less surface area to shoot. Less time to decide to shoot. (time and space is far condensed over a generation ago) All while players attempt to hit smaller gaps on the perimeters of the goal area. With goalies more agile. Not a recipe for more scoring.

We need to dump ever old player and bring up the youngsters !!!!

biggunsbob said:

We need to dump ever old player and bring up the youngsters !!!!

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Holland's Likes:
Aging Veterans
Anyone from Michigan
Anyone who ever played in Michigan
Anyone who ever accidentally made it to Michigan

Dislikes:
Young Players

Byco said:

Less surface area to shoot. Less time to decide to shoot. (time and space is far condensed over a generation ago) All while players attempt to hit smaller gaps on the perimeters of the goal area. With goalies more agile. Not a recipe for more scoring.

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Great summary.