tinselwolverine said:

In every Western democracy with public healthcare people with money can still buy private insurance to not to wait in line.

The broke dick poor on Medicaid in this country really don't have to wait in line that long.

Old bastards on Medicare don't have to wait that long in line either.

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The lines are long in Canada and they got like 540 people there. So now the chasm are ppl who can get care now and those who won't and it's still a money game. Fine. Bring it here. Because everyone else is doing it. It's our ethos now.

Spartanmack said:

if you think insurance companies are bad, wait until gov't bureaucracy gets its hands on health care.

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How would that solve anything? Insurance companies are by far the biggest lobby in DC and surpassed the NRA in contributions to candidates from the GOP. It's literally legislated extortion. Pass laws requiring people have insurance, take premiums every month on threat of dropping them and then deny claims when people need the help.

Fuck Insurance companies in the ear, six days a week and twice on Sundays.


Had a friend living in Italy for a while who had to go to Hospital (not The Hospital, you know). She said there was the main floor for all the Italian citizens who were on the gov't program and the much nicer private wards where the well to do Italians and ex-pats were treated. She said it was better than US Hospitals in the private area and worse in the gov't program space.

Sounds about right.

Desert Valley Medical Center in Palm Springs where my Dad spent a year of his life battling Leukemia (and beating it!) can't hold a candle to Eisenhower across town ...the hospital where Bob Hope breathed his last as have many other well to do celebs. My Dad had no choice, the Ambulance took him to DVM and there he stayed. That's the hospital on the "mexican side of town" and where all the "regular" people go.

It was miserable.

TheVictors said:

How would that solve anything? Insurance companies are by far the biggest lobby in DC and surpassed the NRA in contributions to candidates from the GOP. It's literally legislated extortion. Pass laws requiring people have insurance, take premiums every month on threat of dropping them and then deny claims when people need the help.

Fuck Insurance companies in the ear, six days a week and twice on Sundays.


Had a friend living in Italy for a while who had to go to Hospital (not The Hospital, you know). She said there was the main floor for all the Italian citizens who were on the gov't program and the much nicer private wards where the well to do Italians and ex-pats were treated. She said it was better than US Hospitals in the private area and worse in the gov't program space.

Sounds about right.

Desert Valley Medical Center in Palm Springs where my Dad spent a year of his life battling Leukemia (and beating it!) can't hold a candle to Eisenhower across town ...the hospital where Bob Hope breathed his last as have many other well to do celebs. My Dad had no choice, the Ambulance took him to DVM and there he stayed. That's the hospital on the "mexican side of town" and where all the "regular" people go.

It was miserable.

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How would what solve anything? I'm saying the govt would make it worse.

You're blaming the insurance companies for that? That's all on the politicians. the insurance companies are simply reacting rationally to irrational incentives. If the govt was gonna overhaul your or any other industry you can bet your life every company would be trying to write the rules and spending all they could to make that happen.

We need term limits and a ban on all lobbying.

TheVictors said:

Desert Valley Medical Center in Palm Springs where my Dad spent a year of his life battling Leukemia (and beating it!) can't hold a candle to Eisenhower across town ...the hospital where Bob Hope breathed his last as have many other well to do celebs.

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Of course it's great that your dad beat leukemia.

Old Bob died in his Toluca Lake palace around the corner from my dogs' condo.

Spartanmack said:

We need term limits and a ban on all lobbying.

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This reads like something MichChamp would post.

tinselwolverine said:

This reads like something MichChamp would post.

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maybe - if I had included exceptions for unions and trial lawyers.

Spartanmack said:

maybe - if I had included exceptions for unions and trial lawyers.

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President Trump is apparently once again a Democrat this week.

Chinese food and chocolate pie.

Who knows what magicality we may be in for?

byco42 said:

The lines are long in Canada and they got like 540 people there. So now the chasm are ppl who can get care now and those who won't and it's still a money game. Fine. Bring it here. Because everyone else is doing it. It's our ethos now.

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Byco long lines for what?

I went to local walk-in clinic, 30 minute wait, appointment with specialist next day, surgery scheduled for next week.

Typically big waits are for MRIs and for certain specialists who are in short supply due to being snagged by us.

Also not all of Canada has socialized health care. Alberta has private system. And contrary to popular belief not everything is covered.

All system have some form of wait .. still dosnt make for profit healthcare better then a government controlled/regulated system. . Let's give it a shot and see if we can get it to work . Heavens knows the for profit way is unethical and basically stinks .

You know the funny part?

I was actually paying more tax in USA, so the Canadian government just charged me the health premium. Which was around $400-500 for the entire year.

The walk-in, specialist, and surgery totaled 0 extra.
Was on the hook for $35 on prescription cause my drug plan from us employer was inferior to what I had as a student.

Polish-Hammer said:

You know the funny part?

I was actually paying more tax in USA, so the Canadian government just charged me the health premium. Which was around $400-500 for the entire year.

The walk-in, specialist, and surgery totaled 0 extra.
Was on the hook for $35 on prescription cause my drug plan from us employer was inferior to what I had as a student.

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That is pretty funny...but it doesn't hold a candle to this classic:

Doctor to patient: "You have to stop masturbating."

Patient to doctor: "Why?"

Doctor to Patient: "So can I do the examination."

the truth about rationing in the left's beloved socialized medical systems:

France, England, Canada (despite PH's anecdote to the contrary), Japan, Europe in general.

The sources of these links are NPR, The Guardian, Huffington Post Canada, Japan Times, and Forbes.

Spartanmack said:

the truth about rationing in the left's beloved socialized medical systems:

France, England, Canada (despite PH's anecdote to the contrary), Japan, Europe in general.

The sources of these links are NPR, The Guardian, Huffington Post Canada, Japan Times, and Forbes.

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Who cares. National Healthcare is coming to America becaue dipshit republicans and some but not all democrats don't give a shit about ordinary people who are on the ACA. Novel concept . Why instead of fighting it for years like the Gop has why not work across the party lines and make it work better for everyone.
Becaue whatever the Gop is pushing will not cover anyone. The new bill by Graham is a sham like most things the Gop does. FILLED WITH LIES.

socialized medicine is failing but as bob says "who cares? It's coming to America!"

newsflash bob, the ACA is a failure because it was designed to fail, not because anything Republicans did to it.

Spartanmack said:

newsflash bob, the ACA is a failure because it was designed to fail, not because anything Republicans did to it.

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It was designed to fail because the GOP gutted the original version and in a rush to push it through, the dems accepted it. I give you half credit. :tup:

*edit* Upon further review from my esteemed colleague Tinsel, you get zero points. Sorry :*(

Polish-Hammer said:

Byco long lines for what?

I went to local walk-in clinic, 30 minute wait, appointment with specialist next day, surgery scheduled for next week.

Typically big waits are for MRIs and for certain specialists who are in short supply due to being snagged by us.

Also not all of Canada has socialized health care. Alberta has private system. And contrary to popular belief not everything is covered.

Click to expand...

Polish-Hammer said:

You know the funny part?

I was actually paying more tax in USA, so the Canadian government just charged me the health premium. Which was around $400-500 for the entire year.

The walk-in, specialist, and surgery totaled 0 extra.
Was on the hook for $35 on prescription cause my drug plan from us employer was inferior to what I had as a student.

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Still waiting for someone to respond to the guy who has actual experience in the system and not from a Huff Post link.

sggatecl said:

It was designed to fail because the GOP gutted the original version and in a rush to push it through, the dems accepted it. I give you half credit. :tup:

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What you're describing isn't a design by definition. You're describing an unintended outcome.

The people who claim it was designed to fail say it was designed to fail to be a bridge to full single payer.

Accurate? False?

sggatecl said:

Accurate? False?

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LXUBN8SJASw

I guess candidate Trump wasn't aware at the time that we already long had a system, going way back to long before the ACA, where people didn't die in the streets.

Access to health care, primarily through Medicaid, has been around for poor people for generations.

It's already somewhat like Medicare for people who aren't eligible for Medicare - but it isn't for everyone - a person has to be pretty much penniless to qualify.

As I've said before, that has long been the gap in US Healthcare - people who weren't broke who had pre-existing conditions couldn't get insurance until they went broke.

The ACA kind of fixed that - but it also "fixed" a whole lot of shit that didn't need fixing.

Also, Medicare and single payer aren't exactly the same thing - Medicare Part A which deals with doctor visits covers 80%; the patient has to a) cover the rest out of pocket or b) have supplementary insurance or c) can't pay and doesn't have supplementary insurance, in which case the provider eats the difference- which happens, the providers know this, and make market adjustments for it.

Medicare Part B deals with hospitalizations; it isn't full single payer, and Medicare Part D deals with prescriptions, and it also isn't fully single payer either.

EDIT: Oh, and also Medicare isn't fully funded through general funding, it's partially funded through FICA pay role taxes and it's administered through the SSA.

sggatecl said:

It was designed to fail because the GOP gutted the original version and in a rush to push it through, the dems accepted it. I give you half credit. :tup:

*edit* Upon further review from my esteemed colleague Tinsel, you get zero points. Sorry :*(

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gutted how? and with what leverage? not a single Republican voted for the bill. It wasn't sabotaged by Republicans, it was designed to fail by the people pushing it.