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JD traded to the Diamondbacks....

I've seen some people try to defend Avila in a few places that it was a 'frosty market' for rental players and that this was the best he could do.

While true in itself, that's a bullshit POV. We're selling JD cheap because the team he constructed failed to win. It still falls on him. Avila needs to go, this is on him no matter how you slice it. Even if you're the type of delusional person that hates Ausmus and think that this team has the talent for post season success (again, you're delusional if you do)that's on Avila too for keeping him.

Bye bye Al Sr. Your son can stay, you most certainly can not.
 
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sggatecl said:
I've seen some people try to defend Avila in a few places that it was a 'frosty market' for rental players and that this was the best he could do.

While true in itself, that's a bullshit POV. We're selling JD cheap because the team he constructed failed to win. It still falls on him. Avila needs to go, this is on him no matter how you slice it. Even if you're the type of delusional person that hates Ausmus and think that this team has the talent for post season success (again, you're delusional if you do)that's on Avila too for keeping him.

Bye bye Al Sr. Your son can stay, you most certainly can not.
Click to expand...

BLUF....Martinez cannot be given a qualifying offer by the D-Backs (or any other team that had traded for him). He had to be with a team for the full season. So, unless DET kept him and did just that, his best value would have been to trade him in the offseason. Either way, it is still on Avila and he would have fucked that up as well. Yes, the same man that made excuses as to why they signed Lowe and Pelfrey.
 
Sadly none of these prospects crack the top 10 of the tigers . That is pretty sad return for JD..
 
Rebbiv said:
DET 40-man Roster + 2017 Players = Career Minor league stats (for prospective)


J.D. Martinez .328 BAVG .389 OBP .542 SLG .931 OPS 13.2 PA/BB

**Christin Stewart .267 BAVG .372 OBP .521 SLG .893 OPS 8.0 PA/BB

V. Martinez .319 BAVG .391 OBP .487 SLG .879 OPS 10.7 PA/BB

I. Kinsler .299 BAVG .386 OBP .492 SLG .878 OPS 11.3 PA/BB

J. Upton .288 BAVG .373 OBP .481 SLG .854 OPS 9.4 PA/BB

N. Castellanos .303 BAVG .359 OBP .445 SLG .804 OPS 13.3 PA/BB

A. Avila .283 BAVG .373 OBP .425 SLG .798 OPS 8.1 PA/BB

M. Cabrera .286 BAVG .350 OBP .431 SLG .781 OPS 13.2 PA/BB

A. Presley .290 BAVG .350 OBP .426 SLG .776 OPS 12.7 PA/BB


J. Jones .264 BAVG .329 OBP .436 SLG .765 OPS 13.0 PA/BB

J. Hicks .285 BAVG .329 OBP .423 SLG .752 OPS 17.9 PA/BB

T. Collins .259 BAVG .333 OBP .415 SLG .748 OPS 11.0 PA/BB

M. Mahtook .272 BAVG .338 OBP .410 SLG .748 OPS 14.0 PA/BB

J. Adducci .285 BAVG .357 OBP .384 SLG .741 OPS 10.6 PA/BB

A. Romine .279 BAVG .354 OBP .367 SLG .721 OPS 11.0 PA/BB


D. Lugo .277 BAVG .308 OBP .397 SLG .705 OPS 26.1 PA/BB

J. McCann .265 BAVG .315 OBP .374 SLG .689 OPS 18.0 PA/BB

S. Alcantara .255 BAVG .343 OBP .322 SLG .665 OPS 8.6 PA/BB

D. Machado .246 BAVG .323 OBP .317 SLG .640 OPS 10.7 PA/BB

J. Iglesias .259 BAVG .308 OBP .319 SLG .627 OPS 17.00 PA/BB
Click to expand...



I want to start off by saying I'm not a huge fan of this trade because I think they should've waited a little longer to get more value, but it is what it is.

Anyways, I feel that it should be pointed out that using "career minor league stats" isn't telling enough of the story. To point this out I'll use a player that you're quite fond of and was angered that we traded.


AA stats

Devon Travis(age 23-24)- 103 games(453 pa's) .292/.350/.450

Dawel Lugo(age 21-22)-- 136 games(546 pa's) .290/.324/.436


When you just use "career minor league stats" you aren't showing that Travis was 22 years old hammering midwest league pitching and then regressed(nothing wrong with it by the way) when he was bumped to AA or that Lugo was a teenager(17 years old) breaking into professional baseball and struggled with his first few season, but really started putting it together as he moved up. Two different paths to get to pretty similar AA numbers. Also the fact that Lugo is 2 years younger than Travis was.

At the end of the day I don't understand how you can love one of these guys and shit on the other.
 
I would bring Lugo up in September.. And also anticipate having him as a starter for 2018. But not as a shortstop.. Use him at 3rd put Nick in the outfield somewhere. Bring Stewart up. Might as well see what we got.
 
Mitchrapp said:
I would bring Lugo up in September.. And also anticipate having him as a starter for 2018. But not as a shortstop.. Use him at 3rd put Nick in the outfield somewhere. Bring Stewart up. Might as well see what we got.
Click to expand...


Heard it suggested on the radio to move Nick to first and Miggy DH. Gonna be a problem hiding some of these guys in the next couple years lol
 
gotime909 said:
Heard it suggested on the radio to move Nick to first and Miggy DH. Gonna be a problem hiding some of these guys in the next couple years lol
Click to expand...

I wouldn't mind Miguel at DH to protect his health but not sure Nick would be any better at 1st. But you're right, bad defense.
 
JD 2nd at bat drilled in the wrist , looks pretty bad and being taken out of game .
 
gotime909 said:
I want to start off by saying I'm not a huge fan of this trade because I think they should've waited a little longer to get more value, but it is what it is.

Anyways, I feel that it should be pointed out that using "career minor league stats" isn't telling enough of the story. To point this out I'll use a player that you're quite fond of and was angered that we traded.


AA stats

Devon Travis(age 23-24)- 103 games(453 pa's) .292/.350/.450

Dawel Lugo(age 21-22)-- 136 games(546 pa's) .290/.324/.436


When you just use "career minor league stats" you aren't showing that Travis was 22 years old hammering midwest league pitching and then regressed(nothing wrong with it by the way) when he was bumped to AA or that Lugo was a teenager(17 years old) breaking into professional baseball and struggled with his first few season, but really started putting it together as he moved up. Two different paths to get to pretty similar AA numbers. Also the fact that Lugo is 2 years younger than Travis was.

At the end of the day I don't understand how you can love one of these guys and shit on the other.
Click to expand...

As with any league, there are home park biases.

Most of Travis' AA numbers came in 2014:

Home = .734 OPS
Away = .902 OPS

Lugo's:

2017 Home = .807 OPS
2017 Away = .702 OPS


So, your complaint is against Lugo's inclusion of Rookie League numbers. Travis did not play in Rookie league, nor in A ball, just A+. They both have player A+ and AA. And Travis played in AAA. So just comparing A+ and AA numbers should be a better reflection, but does not reflect differences/biases in leagues or home parks.

A+ and AA numbers

Travis (23-148d) .316 BAVG .373 OBP .495 SLG .868 OPS 12.5 PA/BB

Lugo (22-200d) .280 BAVG .315 OBP .424 SLG .740 OPS 23.6 PA/BB


I am not a rocket scientist, but anyone would be hard pressed to find a productive MLBer who had a career walk rate above 20.0 PA/BB from the minors. I could also go on about how not improving walk rate in respect to improved BAVG is a hollow improvement and that history has proved it isn't sustainable. But all of that would go on deaf ears.
 
Rebbiv said:
As with any league, there are home park biases.

Most of Travis' AA numbers came in 2014:

Home = .734 OPS
Away = .902 OPS

Lugo's:

2017 Home = .807 OPS
2017 Away = .702 OPS


So, your complaint is against Lugo's inclusion of Rookie League numbers. Travis did not play in Rookie league, nor in A ball, just A+. They both have player A+ and AA. And Travis played in AAA. So just comparing A+ and AA numbers should be a better reflection, but does not reflect differences/biases in leagues or home parks.

A+ and AA numbers

Travis (23-148d) .316 BAVG .373 OBP .495 SLG .868 OPS 12.5 PA/BB

Lugo (22-200d) .280 BAVG .315 OBP .424 SLG .740 OPS 23.6 PA/BB


I am not a rocket scientist, but anyone would be hard pressed to find a productive MLBer who had a career walk rate above 20.0 PA/BB from the minors. I could also go on about how not improving walk rate in respect to improved BAVG is a hollow improvement and that history has proved it isn't sustainable. But all of that would go on deaf ears.
Click to expand...


Bottom line is the kid is better than you're making him out to be. He excellent with the bat and his walk rate is improving this year. He doesn't fit your whole "swing first.....then strike out" comment either. His K rate is fairly low which is extremely impressive given that he's been pretty much the youngest guy in every level he's been in.

I'm still not a fan of the trade, but this kid isn't a bad prospect.
 
The way i know we made a good deal or signed so and so is if the masses here bitch and complain about , that means it was something good . Cause the morons on this board are a plenty .
 
nsonnett14 said:
The way i know we made a good deal or signed so and so is if the masses here bitch and complain about , that means it was something good . Cause the morons on this board are a plenty .
Click to expand...


DD trades,
So Fulmer, Norris, Boyd, Joubert, for 2 months of Cespedes and Price,

Avila trades,
Lugo and 2 other stiffs for 2 months of JD Martinez.

Avila slappy Everytime you post you become better comedy for the forum.
 
kalinecountry said:
DD trades,
So Fulmer, Norris, Boyd, Joubert, for 2 months of Cespedes and Price,

Avila trades,
Lugo and 2 other stiffs for 2 months of JD Martinez.

Avila slappy Everytime you post you become better comedy for the forum.
Click to expand...

yea and everyone on this board hated DD too , so you have no point .
 
nsonnett14 said:
yea and everyone on this board hated DD too , so you have no point .
Click to expand...

The one thing I know about JD is we all pretty much hated him when he got here. Based on previous numbers. He's been a stud here so I try to keep an open mind about prospects. Maybe we can get lucky again..
 
nsonnett14 said:
yea and everyone on this board hated DD too , so you have no point .
Click to expand...

DD couldn't build a pen or he would still be in Detroit with a statue getting ready to be built of him.. Shame we were so close so many times.
 
nsonnett14 said:
yea and everyone on this board hated DD too , so you have no point .
Click to expand...

For someone who wasn't on the board for a number of years makes comps your comment to swiss cheese.

DD had more success as a GM than the couple of warts, bad trades signings of huff and washburn, and the bullpen curse, I liked DD and didn't want to see him go.

nice try gimp, now go get your shine box.
 
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