Gidp

[Rebbiv]

Grounded Into Doubleplays are generally from runner on 1st with less than 2 outs. Here is career averages from the 2015 Tigers and the 1984 Tigers as comparisons.


1984 Team

L. Parish 7.7 PA/GIDP .315 OBP
L. Herndon 7.8 PA/GIDP .326 OBP
B. Garbey 8.1 PA/GIDP .262 OBP
C. Lemon 8.9 PA/GIDP .351 OBP

R. Jones 10.9 PA/GIDP .332 OBP
J. Grubb 11.0 PA/GIDP .385 OBP
D. Bergamn 11.1 PA/GIDP .371 OBP
T. Brookens 12.3 PA/GIDP .295 OBP
A. Trammell 12.4 PA/GIDP .346 OBP
L. Whitaker 13.1 PA/GIDP .354 OBP
D. Evans 14.9 PA/GIDP .395 OBP

H. Johnson 17.9 PA/GIDP .320 OBP
K. Gibson 18.4 PA/GIDP .360 OBP

7 players above .340 OBP

2015 Team

J. McCann 3.9 PA/GIDP .222 OBP

V. Martinez 6.7 PA/GIDP .388 OBP
M. Cabrera 6.7 PA/GIDP .379 OBP
I. Kinsler 7.8 PA/GIDP .343 OBP
A. Gose 7.9 PA/GIDP .313 OBP
J. Iglesias 7.9 PA/GIDP .305 OBP
J.D. Martinez 8.7 PA/GIDP .336 OBP
A. Avila 9.2 PA/GIDP .342 OBP

R. Davis 10.1 PA/GIDP .281 OBP
Y. Cespedes 11.0 PA/GIDP .325 OBP
N. Castellanos 11.5 PA/GIDP .265 OBP
A. Romine 11.6 PA/GIDP .333 OBP

4 players above .340 OBP

Tigers from 2006

I. Rodriguez 6.4 PA/GIDP .344 OBP
M. Ordonez 6.5 PA/GIDP .394 OBP
Dm. Young 6.9 PA/GIDP .358 OBP
P. Polanco 7.2 PA/GIDP .365 OBP
C. Shelton 7.4 PA/GIDP .342 OBP
S. Casey 7.5 PA/GIDP .385 OBP
C. Monroe 8.6 PA/GIDP .317 OBP
C. Guillen 9.1 PA/GIDP .360 OBP

B. Inge 10.2 PA/GIDP .292 OBP
O. Infante 11.6 PA/GIDP .298 OBP
M. Thames 12.3 PA/GIDP .310 OBP

C. Granderson 24.1 PA/GIDP .345 OBP

8 players above .340 OBP

 

[byco42]

So I guess that the telling factor is the spread in PA?

1984: 11
2006: 6 (granderson is an outlier)
2015: 8

And the woeful OPB of the '15 team, meaning that they are squandering the few chances they get?

 

[tigermud]

total team GIDP's stats

1984: 102
2006: 120

I think what makes it all look so bad is that through 85 games thus far the 2015 Tigers have grounded into an astonishing 91 DP's that's 1.07 per game, this is a current pace for 173.34 the record is currently 174 held by the 1990 Boston Red Soxs

 

[tomdalton22]

There have to be a lot of factors involved...one of which is just bad luck.

 

[byco42]

There have to be a lot of factors involved...one of which is just bad luck.

BABIP: Tigers lead MLB. (.333) Also OBP (.339). But they are 21st in GB% (43.9) ... so (lack of) luck seems to be a factor.

And I retract this: And the woeful OPB of the '15 team, meaning that they are squandering the few chances they get?

 

[Mitchrapp]

I expect a guy like Iggy will get his fair share because he hits a lot of balls on the ground..

 

[Rebbiv]

The stats I showed were the player's CAREER averages with a Runner on 1st, less than 2 outs, not that year's stats.

Team Averages

2015 = 7.1 PA/GIDP .282 BAVG .329 OBP .399 SLG .628 OPS .314 BABIP (21 CS 9 Sh)

2006 = 9.7 PA/GIDP .307 BAVG .343 OBP .497 SLG .840 OPS .337 BABIP (27 CS 38 SH)

1984 = 12.2 PA/GIDP .281 BAVG .331 OBP .410 SLG .741 OPS .302 BABIP (44 CS 40 SH)

What a player is doing when he hits a ground ball:

Rolling over on the top hand too early

Not getting into a good lower half position (pick up the back heel and drive the back knee into the ground

Swinging at the ball too low in the strike zone – bad pitch selection

Hitting the top of the baseball as apposed to the middle or bottom/middle of the baseball – poor accuracy

Pulling the front shoulder or head off the baseball

Trying to pull a pitch on the outside part of the plate


Speed out of the batter's box eliminates a lot of GIDP. Generally, lefthanded hitter do better. Also, being able to "hit behind the runner" is essential for some player types. Teams generally employ "hit and run" and "sacrifices" to minimize GIDP.

BLUF..It has nothing to do with luck. It is the make up of the team. The 2015 team is comprised primarily of slow and/or righthanded hitters. They do not hit behind the runners. Ausmus does not employ the "hit and run", or at least effectively. The players cannot hit sacrifice bunts (although, personally I am against this lunacy, it still effects the stats).

#1 and #2 Hitters

1984

L. Whitaker 13.1 PA/GIDP .354 OBP
A. Trammell 12.4 PA/GIDP .346 OBP

2006

C. Granderson 24.1 PA/GIDP .345 OBP
P. Polanco 7.2 PA/GIDP .365 OBP

2015

A. Gose 7.9 PA/GIDP .313 OBP (R. Davis 10.1 PA/GIDP .281 OBP)
I. Kinsler 7.8 PA/GIDP .343 OBP


In 1984, primarily it was H. Johnson/T. Brookens as the #9 hitter. In 2006, it was Brandon Inge. 2015 it is Iglesias.

#3 through #6 hitter on all these teams generally are at the same OBP and PA/GIDP.

Cecil Fielder = 7.2 PA/GIDP .332 OBP
Prince Fielder = 8.6 PA/GIDP .390 OBP
Austin Jackson = 9.9 PA/GIDP .353 OBP

Tony Phillips = 10.8 PA/GIDP .395 OBP
Bobby Higginson = 13.7 PA/GIDP .367 OBP



When your #9, #1, and #2 hitters (you could add #7 and #8) don't do well hitting with a runner on 1st, less than 2 outs, it most certainly effects the #3 and #4 hitters and their opportunities. While Miggy, Victor and Maggs ground into their fair share of doubleplays, they make up for it with the damage they do when they don't. That isn't the case with some of these hitters. Having an OBP below .340 with a runner on 1st and less than 2 outs, means you suck at continuing the rally.

Finally, players career stats go down with age. All of the 1984 Team players' stats won't change. The 2006 Team is pretty much finished, except Infante and Granderson. That leaves 2015 and their numbers are destined to get worse with time.

 

[tomdalton22]

The stats I showed were the player's CAREER averages with a Runner on 1st, less than 2 outs, not that year's stats.

Team Averages

2015 = 7.1 PA/GIDP .282 BAVG .329 OBP .399 SLG .628 OPS .314 BABIP (21 CS 9 Sh)

2006 = 9.7 PA/GIDP .307 BAVG .343 OBP .497 SLG .840 OPS .337 BABIP (27 CS 38 SH)

1984 = 12.2 PA/GIDP .281 BAVG .331 OBP .410 SLG .741 OPS .302 BABIP (44 CS 40 SH)

What a player is doing when he hits a ground ball:

Rolling over on the top hand too early

Not getting into a good lower half position (pick up the back heel and drive the back knee into the ground

Swinging at the ball too low in the strike zone ? bad pitch selection

Hitting the top of the baseball as apposed to the middle or bottom/middle of the baseball ? poor accuracy

Pulling the front shoulder or head off the baseball

Trying to pull a pitch on the outside part of the plate


Speed out of the batter's box eliminates a lot of GIDP. Generally, lefthanded hitter do better. Also, being able to "hit behind the runner" is essential for some player types. Teams generally employ "hit and run" and "sacrifices" to minimize GIDP.

BLUF..It has nothing to do with luck. It is the make up of the team. The 2015 team is comprised primarily of slow and/or righthanded hitters. They do not hit behind the runners. Ausmus does not employ the "hit and run", or at least effectively. The players cannot hit sacrifice bunts (although, personally I am against this lunacy, it still effects the stats).

#1 and #2 Hitters

1984

L. Whitaker 13.1 PA/GIDP .354 OBP
A. Trammell 12.4 PA/GIDP .346 OBP

2006

C. Granderson 24.1 PA/GIDP .345 OBP
P. Polanco 7.2 PA/GIDP .365 OBP

2015

A. Gose 7.9 PA/GIDP .313 OBP (R. Davis 10.1 PA/GIDP .281 OBP)
I. Kinsler 7.8 PA/GIDP .343 OBP


In 1984, primarily it was H. Johnson/T. Brookens as the #9 hitter. In 2006, it was Brandon Inge. 2015 it is Iglesias.

#3 through #6 hitter on all these teams generally are at the same OBP and PA/GIDP.

Cecil Fielder = 7.2 PA/GIDP .332 OBP
Prince Fielder = 8.6 PA/GIDP .390 OBP
Austin Jackson = 9.9 PA/GIDP .353 OBP

Tony Phillips = 10.8 PA/GIDP .395 OBP
Bobby Higginson = 13.7 PA/GIDP .367 OBP



When your #9, #1, and #2 hitters (you could add #7 and #8) don't do well hitting with a runner on 1st, less than 2 outs, it most certainly effects the #3 and #4 hitters and their opportunities. While Miggy, Victor and Maggs ground into their fair share of doubleplays, they make up for it with the damage they do when they don't. That isn't the case with some of these hitters. Having an OBP below .340 with a runner on 1st and less than 2 outs, means you suck at continuing the rally.

Finally, players career stats go down with age. All of the 1984 Team players' stats won't change. The 2006 Team is pretty much finished, except Infante and Granderson. That leaves 2015 and their numbers are destined to get worse with time.

there has to be some luck involved...right? I mean I watch a game and someone smokes one but it is right at the defender. Or other plays if it is 1' to the right or left it is a hit not an out.