"Freedom's Dumbest Army"

[Michchamp]

link.

"In the words of multiple NRA members who confronted protestors this past weekend, ?The Second Amendment is the one thing protecting the First.?"

right. because we know that whenever the government has attempted to restrain speech or assembly, as they do all the time, armed NRA members are there blasting away... so stupid.

 

[byco42]

link.

"In the words of multiple NRA members who confronted protestors this past weekend, ?The Second Amendment is the one thing protecting the First.?"

right. because we know that whenever the government has attempted to restrain speech or assembly, as they do all the time, armed NRA members are there blasting away... so stupid.

Well, we sure as hell know what happens when the government has fired on unarmed citizens. And without the right of self-defense -- the right to life -- the other rights are moot.

 

[Monster]

Well, we sure as hell know what happens when the government has fired on unarmed citizens. And without the right of self-defense -- the right to life -- the other rights are moot.

When have we ever fired on unarmed citizens? Without probable cause, of course.

This is the U.S., not the USSR.

 

[byco42]

When have we ever fired on unarmed citizens? Without probable cause, of course.

This is the U.S., not the USSR.

Kent State come to mind rather easily. Wounded Knee. (they are Indians, so they don't rate, I know).

 

[Michchamp]

When have we ever fired on unarmed citizens? Without probable cause, of course.

This is the U.S., not the USSR.

some of those labor riots in the late 1800's early 1900's. notably:

• Ludlow Massacre.

when workers at Colorado mine [sic] went on strike, company guards fired machine guns and killed several men. More battling followed, during which 2 women and 11 children were killed
​

• The Haymarket Riots in Chicago are famous.
• This came close. We had active duty cavalry charge veterans protesting benefits, and hit them with tear gas.

In all these incidents, the NRA was nowhere to be seen...

 

[Michchamp]

Kent State come to mind rather easily. Wounded Knee. (they are Indians, so they don't rate, I know).

...and the NRA types were there to defend the students' rights to assemble and exercise their first amendment rights protest their government's actions.

Oh... wait.

no they weren't.

they'd probably join in the shooting of unarmed civilians if they were.

 

[Michchamp]

note, in the Ludlow Massacre, the "company guards" were the Colorado National Guard.

 

[byco42]

...and the NRA types were there to defend the students' rights to assemble and exercise their first amendment rights protest their government's actions.

Oh... wait.

no they weren't.

they'd probably join in the shooting of unarmed civilians if they were.

Yeah ... you'd have thought that by now such a mindless and monolithic organization like the NRA would have leveraged the numerous, recent, opportunities to do exactly that. To shoot down all them protesters. Why hasn't it?

 

[redandguilty]

Kent State come to mind rather easily. Wounded Knee. (they are Indians, so they don't rate, I know).

Kent State jumps to mind of course, but that's not the NRA response to that question. It's supposed to be that the government doesn't try much of that sort of thing because it knows we're armed.

 

[redandguilty]

Yeah ... you'd have thought that by now such a mindless and monolithic organization like the NRA would have leveraged the numerous, recent, opportunities to do exactly that. To shoot down all them protesters. Why hasn't it?

They're working on it.

 

[byco42]

Kent State jumps to mind of course, but that's not the NRA response to that question. It's supposed to be that the government doesn't try much of that sort of thing because it knows we're armed.

It's evident that the most oppressive governments on the planet have disarmed its citizens before murdering them masse. An inconvenient truth, if you will. To say "it cannot happen here" is the first, critical step in ensuring its inevitability. So, yes, that is the hope and promise of the 2nd Amendment -- a last recourse to preserve the rest of them and the "Free State" along with it. The Bill of Rights is not a series of ad hoc amendments; they are interdependent; they either all exist or none of them do.

 

[Monster]

Kent State come to mind rather easily. Wounded Knee. (they are Indians, so they don't rate, I know).

My bad. Kent state. 13 years before i was born. Sorry, memory is fuzzy. And yes...Native Americans do count. My point still stands, though. The government and law enforcement aren't trying to deny any of your rights. And having a gun doesn't protect those.

 

[Monster]

It's evident that the most oppressive governments on the planet have disarmed its citizens before murdering them masse. An inconvenient truth, if you will. To say "it cannot happen here" is the first, critical step in ensuring its inevitability. So, yes, that is the hope and promise of the 2nd Amendment -- a last recourse to preserve the rest of them and the "Free State" along with it. The Bill of Rights is not a series of ad hoc amendments; they are interdependent; they either all exist or none of them do.

And what kind of governments were in charge? Democracies with a rock solid constution and guaranteed rights? Take a look at Australia. Perfect example of what happens when there is restrictions on guns, but responsible owners are allowed to own them.

 

[tinselwolverine]

It's evident that the most oppressive governments on the planet have disarmed its citizens before murdering them masse.

In order to be disarmed, one has to be armed. Who was ever armed in Russia before the communist takeover? Most of them were just god damn peasants who went from being subjected by one despotic regime to another.

Same with Maoist China, and same with Cuba as far as I know - and actually all the rest.

Really, what free society in history has ever been armed to be disarmed and have totalitariarianism imposed upon it?

 

[KAWDUP]

In order to be disarmed, one has to be armed. Who was ever armed in Russia before the communist takeover? Most of them were just god damn peasants who went from being subjected by one despotic regime to another.

Same with Maoist China, and same with Cuba as far as I know - and actually all the rest.

Really, what free society in history has ever been armed to be disarmed and have totalitariarianism imposed upon it?

I think it comes from quotes like this:

The most foolish mistake we could possibly make would be to allow the subject races to possess arms. History shows that all conquerors who have allowed their subject races to carry arms have prepared their own downfall by so doing.

?Adolph Hitler

Not sure whether Germany prior to Hitler would have been considered a free society, and the concept certainly didn't begin there, but those who remember what happened may have a differing point of view.

 

[Michchamp]

...

Not sure whether Germany prior to Hitler would have been considered a free society..

glenn beck didnt cover it in his book?

 

[redandguilty]

Guns won't matter much when it's all nanobots and lasers. And lobbyists. Don't forget the lobbyists. Powerful weapons for taking whatever you want.

 

[tinselwolverine]

I think it comes from quotes like this:

The most foolish mistake we could possibly make would be to allow the subject races to possess arms. History shows that all conquerors who have allowed their subject races to carry arms have prepared their own downfall by so doing.

?Adolph Hitler

Not sure whether Germany prior to Hitler would have been considered a free society, and the concept certainly didn't begin there, but those who remember what happened may have a differing point of view.

I don't know that those who were slaughtered en masse (it's "en masse," not "masse") necessarily came from a gun totin' culture.

 

[KAWDUP]

I don't know that those who were slaughtered en masse (it's "en masse," not "masse") necessarily came from a gun totin' culture.

Well I don't think I was making that connection to gun totin', just where the modern concept would have come from. You asked for an example - I just provided one - I wasn't disagreeing or agreeing with anything. Jews most certainly owned guns, that is all I am saying.

PS - I know it is "en masse" - I think the statement you quoted is from someone else. No worries.

 

[KAWDUP]

glenn beck didnt cover it in his book?

He may have - are you making a point or just being an elitist jerk again?