Steel tariff vs infrastructure

[Gulo Blue]

This tariff idea has to fall apart, right? It's incredibly stupid. I understand subsidies and tariffs have their place to support strategic industries, but one of the things I agree with Trump on is our need to invest in infrastructure. Why would you do this when our infrastructure is already a significant need?

 

[Gulo Blue]

Not to mention his border wall.

 

[turok]

This tariff idea has to fall apart, right? It's incredibly stupid. I understand subsidies and tariffs have their place to support strategic industries, but one of the things I agree with Trump on is our need to invest in infrastructure. Why would you do this when our infrastructure is already a significant need?

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We don't have the capability to produce modern high tensile steel and the steel mills here in the midwest have long gone to seed. The cost to rebuild and train workers, plus rejuvenate the rail lines and revive the dead railroads who served them would take a long time and be very high.

 

[Gulo Blue]

'

We don't have the capability to produce modern high tensile steel and the steel mills here in the midwest have long gone to seed. The cost to rebuild and train workers, plus rejuvenate the rail lines and revive the dead railroads who served them would take a long time and be very high.

And nobody is going to invest in increasing steel production capability based on the market driven by tariffs that would potentially be undone before the investment paid off. Long term investment requires long term commitment to favorable market conditions. Trump can't promise long term anything. Changing terms is part of his schtick.

 

[turok]

The gradual erosion of our former manufacturing and industrial based economy took place over decades, and modern hi-tech steel mills would likely be built in the right to work, employment at will, anti-union South. Plus many laborus jobs would never materialize, due to advancements in automation and robotics. The "Rust Belt" would be SOL again.

 

[Polish-Hammer]

Imagine what would happen to food prices if corn subsidies went away.

Go to supermarket in USA and corn is literally in everything.

Hell, its even in your gas tank.

 

[turok]

Imagine what would happen to food prices if corn subsidies went away.

Go to supermarket in USA and corn is literally in everything.

Hell, its even in your gas tank.

Trump's anti-immigrant policies are gonna cause food prices to soar anyway. No one is gonna do sweaty and back-breaking field labor for min wage. Perhaps the coming police state and private prisons could force their inmates to do it in lieu of "earning their keep".

Big Oil put their strong lobby and PACs to work, so that we still have mostly gasoline and diesel powered vehicles.

 

[Polish-Hammer]

Think there are some minimum security prisons where the prisoners grow crops to supplement the cafeterias.

Probably sometimes for profit of company.

 

[tigermud]

Why was it OK when O slapped on tariffs but the world is going to end when Trump does.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...on-from-obama-in-crushing-china-steel-imports

 

[tigermud]

'

We don't have the capability to produce modern high tensile steel and the steel mills here in the midwest have long gone to seed. The cost to rebuild and train workers, plus rejuvenate the rail lines and revive the dead railroads who served them would take a long time and be very high.

bunch of Eeyores round here. I mean shit you're right no job at all is still way better. God forbid we take care of our own first again. WTF trump

https://www.platts.com/latest-news/...producers-cheer-25-tariff-on-imports-27919583

 

[turok]

Why was it OK when O slapped on tariffs but the world is going to end when Trump does.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...on-from-obama-in-crushing-china-steel-imports

b/c it was targeted against only one commodity and one country in China, while Trump's is vs all imports...did you read the article that you linked to?

 

[tigermud]

b/c it was targeted against only one commodity and one country in China, while Trump's is vs all imports...did you read the article that you linked to?

good read

https://www.forbes.com/sites/kenrapoza/2018/03/02/is-davos-man-rethinking-china/#506bf8df1152

The point of making the tariffs global—for now—is so China can't ship steel to Mexico and get it into the U.S.

 

[turok]

good read

https://www.forbes.com/sites/kenrapoza/2018/03/02/is-davos-man-rethinking-china/#506bf8df1152

The point of making the tariffs global—for now—is so China can't ship steel to Mexico and get it into the U.S.

I've always been opposed to trade with cheating China, of whom the late Nixon and Kissassinger were responsible for normalizing trade relations with. Ross Perot accurately predicted what would happen as a result of almost 75% of products imported to the US arrived duty-free.

And although I never worked for any of the domestic automakers, I resented allowing the Japanese to export their vehicles into the US with the unfair advantage of no tariffs and no legacy costs tied to them beginning in the mid-70s.

 

[tigermud]

I've always been opposed to trade with cheating China, of whom the late Nixon and Kissassinger were responsible for normalizing trade relations with. Ross Perot accurately predicted what would happen as a result of almost 75% of products imported to the US arrived duty-free.

First time I was able to vote, I voted for Ross Perot in 92 and still support his message today, he was right then and he is still right today. Al Gore was wrong. again.

 

[Gulo Blue]

Why was it OK when O slapped on tariffs but the world is going to end when Trump does.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...on-from-obama-in-crushing-china-steel-imports

"From China"

Big difference.

Either way, claiming Obama did it too wouldn't be a defense even if it were the same thing.

 

[turok]

First time I was able to vote, I voted for Ross Perot in 92 and still support his message today, he was right then and he is still right today. Al Gore was wrong. again.

I don't know what Al Gore has to do with trade, but the people who will be most harmed by protectionism now are US consumers. Why should businesses who engage in offshoring and outsourcing, be given the same permanent tax-cuts, as those who do not?

 

[tigermud]

I don't know what Al Gore has to do with trade, but the people who will be most harmed by protectionism now are US consumers. Why should businesses who engage in offshoring and outsourcing, be given the same permanent tax-cuts, as those who do not?

93 NAFTA debate gore was wrong, Ross was right. and thank god trump pulled us out of TPP! Give him time can't do everything all at once. he's on it

http://money.cnn.com/2018/02/23/technology/h1b-visa-abuse/index.html

 

[sggatecl]

@tigermud - You're the king of conspiracy theories around here. What do you think? Fake news or nah?

https://www.theguardian.com/busines...-sell-trump-steel-tariffs-announcement-timing

Carl Icahn, a former special adviser to Donald Trump, sold $31.3m of shares in a company heavily dependent on steel imports last week, shortly before Trump’s announcement of new tariffs sent its shares plummeting.

Icahn, a billionaire investor who was a major Trump supporter, started selling shares in the crane and lifting equipment supplier Manitowoc Company on 12 February, days before the commerce department first mooted on foreign steel imports.

According to a regulatory filing Icahn was able to sell his shares for $32 to $34. On Friday morning Manitowoc’s shares had fallen 5.48% to $26.37. The fall was in line with drops seen by other companies dependent on cheap steel imports, including Boeing and Caterpillar.

 

[tigermud]

@tigermud - You're the king of conspiracy theories around here. What do you think? Fake news or nah?

https://www.theguardian.com/busines...-sell-trump-steel-tariffs-announcement-timing

I'd say investigate him for insider trading and throw his ass in jail if found guilty.

 

[turok]

93 NAFTA debate gore was wrong, Ross was right. and thank god trump pulled us out of TPP! Give him time can't do everything all at once. he's on it

http://money.cnn.com/2018/02/23/technology/h1b-visa-abuse/index.html

Pretty sure that the TPP was being agressively pushed by Republicans in Congress, who wanted to give Obama of all POTUS, fast-track power to sign off on it. You are aware the neither the TPP or NAFTA involves China or India?