The Private Sector is Fine, and Teachers, Firefighters and Police are the Problem

[tinselwolverine]

Christmas.

How many more months of this shit are left, again?

 

[Michchamp]

counting the months until November on my fingers. let's see: June to July, August, September, October... November. Five.

 

[tinselwolverine]

Thanks.

 

[tsmith7559]

firefighters, policeman and teachers don't grow the economy. That's what we need. They are a necessity but they create nothing

 

[redandguilty]

firefighters, policeman and teachers don't grow the economy. That's what we need. They are a necessity but they create nothing

education is everything

 

[Michchamp]

they create nothing.

yeah, fire protection and police protection is a total drag on business.

and in your case, education probably isn't too necessary, as it's obvious you have none.

 

[tsmith7559]

they create nothing.

yeah, fire protection and police protection is a total drag on business.

and in your case, education probably isn't too necessary, as it's obvious you have none.

they protect the wealth but create nothing.....they're a necessity but are only an expense.

 

[cheeno]

they create nothing.

yeah, fire protection and police protection is a total drag on business.

and in your case, education probably isn't too necessary, as it's obvious you have none.

These are the good government entities, but speaking specifically about education they can be bettered. Right now a good teacher and a bad teacher and an old teacher and a young teacher are worth the same to the union, and both cannot be fired. Personally I'm okay with paying good police officers and firefighters a substantial wage. Only that that substantial wage should come with you needing to be the best and the brightest foregoing the nepotism and cronyism of hiring in both professions.

In the grand scheme of things the size and number of government agencies are a problem. Agencies need to lean their production line and become more efficient. Some need to be cut altogether. Don't kid yourself there are hundreds of arms length government entities that duplicate other entities, and public sector jobs which duplicate other jobs, and so on ad infinium. Better social programs can be floated off these efficiency gains.

We need the old repub party back that isn't in the pocket of financiers whom are willing to throw the baby out with the bathwater. What happened to the party of ideas GOP faithful?

 

[Michchamp]

I think that the case for gutting union power based on the odd "I heard about a bad teacher once..." policy is misguided.

sure, no one likes government waste (...except companies like Halliburton, or, yes, Solyndra, that get millions or even BILLIONS in handouts.) and no one is okay with a guy who gets to sleep on the job because he's union. But I'm sick of hearing these tales of union abuse that amount to peanuts - what's the avg. teacher or cops salary? $50K/year + benefits? compared to the massive billions in costs to the economy from corporate malfeasance... that's nothing. that's not an impetus for union reform.

focus on the big picture here.

 

[Michchamp]

Banks took $700 billion + a lot more that went largely unreported by the mainstream media when they fucked up. None of their execs were fired, and the additional regulations added to the industry in the wake of maybe the most massive aggregated fraud scheme in history did anything that will in any way solve the problem, mainly because the banks themselves lobbied to write the legislation.

but of course, you can probably tell me a couple stories about a worker at Ford Wixom, who found a way to pad his hours. or a teacher that got tenured and the union couldn't fire her even though she shows up late every day. Or of course, the cop who got in trouble for writing excessive parking tickets to make his quota... etc. etc.

 

[cheeno]

Banks took $700 billion + a lot more that went largely unreported by the mainstream media when they fucked up. None of their execs were fired, and the additional regulations added to the industry in the wake of maybe the most massive aggregated fraud scheme in history did anything that will in any way solve the problem, mainly because the banks themselves lobbied to write the legislation.

but of course, you can probably tell me a couple stories about a worker at Ford Wixom, who found a way to pad his hours. or a teacher that got tenured and the union couldn't fire her even though she shows up late every day. Or of course, the cop who got in trouble for writing excessive parking tickets to make his quota... etc. etc.

The financial sector's fuck ups are no reason to be blind to the public sector's major fuck ups. And the public sector's fuck ups are in the billions and even trillions as well. IE 3 state agencies with $100 million dollar plus budgets each with similar mandates and the same mandate as a Federal agency. This isn't private vs public this is right vs wrong.

As far as unions go they are as big and corrupt as any big corporation if not more so, and stand in the way of better schools, police, fire and other services. Watch the documentary, Waiting for Superman for examples, its not one bad teacher showing up late for class, its removing the competition aspect for better teachers from the scenario. And it is part of the reason why the US is 25th in education (among others).

 

[redandguilty]

Is it too soon to start arguing over who ran up the student loan debt?

 

[tinselwolverine]

firefighters, policeman and teachers don't grow the economy. That's what we need. They are a necessity but they create nothing

tsmith, this is the thing, and the thing is this...

Forget about ideology, I know your ideology, I know the ideology, generally speaking, of everybody on this board, I'm talking about electoral strategy, simple as that...

In a week when the President found himself back on his heels a little bit...how DUMB was it of Romney, who should absolutely be etchasketching to court the votes of the moderates and independents, to say ANYTHING disparaging toward teachers, firefighters and police officers?

All the doofus had to was let the President and the President's surrogates play defense...but no...

Whether it's "I don't care about the poor" or "I know owners of lots of race cars" or "My wife has two Cadillacs" or whatever dumbass thing it happens to be at the time, the guy simply cannot avoid stepping on his own dick, it seems...

 

[tinselwolverine]

...and going beyond that...a TRULY conservative candidate wouldn't even be TALKING about police or firefighters, or even teachers, really, if the candidate were truly conservative...

What do police, firefighters and teachers have to do with the President of the United States, really? Those are all functions of states and municipalities, not the federal government...