The report on Gray trying to injure himself

[Thumb]

Oh if only that reporter was covering something meaningful....like BENGHAZI!

Angry little man.

 

[Gulo Blue]

have you considered the possibility that some of you guys are sensitive to the accusation because there's a modicum (or more) of truth in it?

who is sensitive to the accusation?

I'll confess: I'm not good at reading.

Now, what's the accusation and who is being accused?

 

[tigersofjustice]

http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/apr/30/baltimore-police-van-freddie-gray-stop

Looks like he was killed by a bolt in the van. Not putting him in a seat belt seems unwise...

 

[tigersofjustice]

Three cheers for White privilege! ....because none of us had to work our asses off for success...WHITE PRIVILEGE!

All your other points aside, I know you are not trying to say that white privilege isn't a thing?

I think that response might as well be called white insecurity.

 

[Gulo Blue]

http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/apr/30/baltimore-police-van-freddie-gray-stop

Looks like he was killed by a bolt in the van. Not putting him in a seat belt seems unwise...

That's a better explanation than the 1st 2, but even if this is true, it won't help that this is the third explanation to make the news.

 

[Spartanmack]

Oh if only that reporter was covering something meaningful....like BENGHAZI!

Angry little man.

No emoji? Aren't you the guy who accused me of deflecting for pointing out Sbee's deflection? And calling me an angry little man while you've probably smashed 3 keyboards throwing temper tantrums in your mom's basement this year - it's as reliable as your overlord calling me a racist and almost as effective.

 

[Spartanmack]

I'll confess: I'm not good at reading.

Now, what's the accusation and who is being accused?

If this is sarcasm, I'll confess, It's not obvious to me. If you're serious, here's my take...

The accusation is his (overplayed) ace in the hole - that anyone who disagrees with him is racist. Apparently he thinks it bothers some people. I can't say for sure who besides me is being accused but most likely jw and tsmith and possibly monster since he made that statement in response to monster's post. You were in there too for a bit yesterday but he seemed to walk that back after you pimp slapped him for it.

 

[Gulo Blue]

If this is sarcasm, I'll confess, It's not obvious to me. If you're serious, here's my take...

The accusation is his (overplayed) ace in the hole - that anyone who disagrees with him is racist. Apparently he thinks it bothers some people. I can't say for sure who besides me is being accused but most likely jw and tsmith and possibly monster since he made that statement in response to monster's post. You were in there too for a bit yesterday but he seemed to walk that back after you pimp slapped him for it.

I genuinely wasn't sure what the accusation was. But it was a brain fart.

When you quoted MC and I saw his post a second time without the post he was referring to, I noticed that MC said "you guys" including Monster, but excluding you, tsmith, and jwlcosu. I f the accusation is racism, presumably it doesn't include me, since he said he was joking yesterday. So who is he talking about? At that point I thought maybe I'd misread the thing and the 2nd paragraph had nothing to do with the 1st.

Reading it a 3rd time now. Yeah. He meant racism.

 

[Thumb]

No emoji? Aren't you the guy who accused me of deflecting for pointing out Sbee's deflection? And calling me an angry little man while you've probably smashed 3 keyboards throwing temper tantrums in your mom's basement this year - it's as reliable as your overlord calling me a racist and almost as effective.

Wow, you used the "mom's basement" attack.

We all know that trumps emojis.

Stand back people, hardcore internet man among us.

 

[Monster]

All your other points aside, I know you are not trying to say that white privilege isn't a thing?

I think that response might as well be called white insecurity.

It's absolutely not a thing. There is a such thing as Money Privilege, though. We need to stop making excuses for people. Stop telling black people that they are victims. It's not just black people that are poor and undereducated.

And saying it's white insecurity is far from the truth. If you knew anything about my life, you'd probably feel sorry for me. Everything has been against me since the day I was born. I've never been given a hand up and I've had to work my ass off to have the life I have now. I'm not rich and not poor. I have a good family and a great life. Nobody handed it to me.

While I watched other friends be handed brand new cars for their birthdays and free educations, my first car was a 10 year old Chevy (that I bought on a McDonald's paycheck at 18 years old) and college was an absolute impossibility.

So yeah, it's definitely not insecurity. It's me, sitting here, knowing from experience that the only privilege out there comes with dollar signs attached.

I do know that we need to take better care of our poor. That's a fact.

 

[Monster]

have you considered the possibility that some of you guys are sensitive to the accusation because there's a modicum (or more) of truth in it?

maybe you're not the full-blown race-baiting hypocrites as spartanracist, tLiar and jdilco, but it's the low level racism, looking at the actions of some of the rioters as "the others" that is insidious and allows the lack of understanding of the conditions of poor black communities and the effects on those who live there to perpetuate.

this isn't an attempt to excuse any lawlessness, just an assertion that any condemnation of violence should be accompanied by an equally forceful discussion of the plight of poor blacks, and how difficult of a situation they face due to a lack of access to education, high unemployment, police harassment, & high levels of incarceration.

There is no justification for rioting. I don't give a shit if the president came out and said "All White People are the Devil". There is nothing good that comes from it. All you do is ruin your own neighborhood and terrorize people that have nothing to do with the situation. Whether it's after a hockey game or because a kid was killed by a cop, it's still pointless.

See, you keep saying blacks. Like this is only a black issue. This is the type of thing that pisses me off so much. If you look at the numbers, white people are being harassed, beaten, and killed just as much and even more than black people, despite black people making up a majority of violent crime in this country.

Black Lives Matter, but where is the outrage when a white person is killed? Do we have no sympathy for them, or is it only the black portion of the population? The news never reports the other side. They only report the black deaths and the times when white people are not killed or beaten by cops. I can't blame blacks for being so angry. If all I heard ALL FUCKING DAY, ALL THE TIME was about how white people are being targeted for assassination, I'd probably start to lose it, too.

My whole point is that this shit is all wrong. News needs to be equal for all. There are shit loads of white people who are poor and under-served. I don't hear anyone crying about them being impoverished and abused by the system.

I'm absolutely not a racist and I realize there are racists that are making my same points. Unfortunately, they're right...for once, for different reasons. I wish I didn't have to take their side, but I am in this one situation.

I said it in other threads and posts, but we do have a serious problem with poverty. People need help and until we give them the same chances that people with money have, we're going to have inequality. All I ask is that it's not only black people who are being represented in this whole poverty/police violence protests. All it has done to this point is drive a wedge between people.

 

[Spartanmack]

http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/apr/30/baltimore-police-van-freddie-gray-stop

Looks like he was killed by a bolt in the van. Not putting him in a seat belt seems unwise...

Very dumb not to restrain him.

Still, that's gotta be disappointing for the chubby little Italian.

 

[Gulo Blue]

It's absolutely not a thing. There is a such thing as Money Privilege, though. We need to stop making excuses for people. Stop telling black people that they are victims. It's not just black people that are poor and undereducated.

And saying it's white insecurity is far from the truth. If you knew anything about my life, you'd probably feel sorry for me. Everything has been against me since the day I was born. I've never been given a hand up and I've had to work my ass off to have the life I have now. I'm not rich and not poor. I have a good family and a great life. Nobody handed it to me.

While I watched other friends be handed brand new cars for their birthdays and free educations, my first car was a 10 year old Chevy (that I bought on a McDonald's paycheck at 18 years old) and college was an absolute impossibility.

So yeah, it's definitely not insecurity. It's me, sitting here, knowing from experience that the only privilege out there comes with dollar signs attached.

I do know that we need to take better care of our poor. That's a fact.

Both exist. Nobody is disputing the advantages associated with having money, but the fact that it exists doesn't mean there isn't also additional challenges associated with being black.

Are you aware of the studies on the issue or do you just reject them?

 

[Gulo Blue]

It's absolutely not a thing.

How about a specific example.

http://www.nber.org/papers/w9873.pdf

ABSTRACT
We perform a field experiment to measure racial discrimination in the labor market. We respond with fictitious resumes to help-wanted ads in Boston and Chicago newspapers. To manipulate perception of race, each resume is assigned either a very African American sounding name or a very White sounding name. The results show significant discrimination against African-American names: White names receive 50 percent more callbacks for interviews.

Do you see some flaw in this study?

Or maybe you just reject the recent trend of calling it a privilege to not face a specific discrimination.

 

[Michchamp]

white Americans love to riot too, only they cover white riots differently in the media.

 

[Spartanmack]

Wow, you used the "mom's basement" attack.

We all know that trumps emojis.

Stand back people, hardcore internet man among us.

well, it's not as good as the "angry little man" attack, I'll grant you that. But it at least has the benefit of being true - you're a little troll who has been openly hostile to me since the beginning and when I consistently beat you at your own game, you try to make it look like I'm the one who is doing the name calling - it's really quite amusing. If it wasn't so entertaining to pull your little puppet strings and watch you fly off in a rage, I'd just ignore you. Thanks for being so reliably stupid. And angry.

 

[Michchamp]

...

See, you keep saying blacks. Like this is only a black issue. ...

My whole point is that this shit is all wrong. News needs to be equal for all. ...

well, we were talking about this particular riot...

and the next time the media covers a white sports riot or threatened redneck insurrection by using all sorts of thinly veiled racial epithets ("thugs" "looters" etc) focuses on property damage instead of the reasons underlying the riot, calls for an end to pro sports culture etc, that will be a start toward equal coverage.

 

[Gulo Blue]

white Americans love to riot too, only they cover white riots differently in the media.

Yes and no. This is becoming a popular thing to report on, "look how differently rioting is reported based on race." It's never an entirely fair comparison though. White riots are over trivial BS (usually sports) while black riots occur alongside something that actually matters. The difference in treatment isn't fair, but especially when it's a sports victory instead of a loss, are you really surprised it's covered differently?

The link makes a better point talking about historical riots than the point about "coverage" which has nothing to do with historical riots.

 

[Michchamp]

Yes and no. This is becoming a popular thing to report on, "look how differently rioting is reported based on race." It's never an entirely fair comparison though. White riots are over trivial BS (usually sports) while black riots occur alongside something that actually matters. The difference in treatment isn't fair, but especially when it's a sports victory instead of a loss, are you really surprised it's covered differently?

The link makes a better point talking about historical riots than the point about "coverage" which has nothing to do with historical riots.

Well, surprised is not the right word. I do think - despite the reasoning for the riot being different -that the coverage is fundamentally different. no media outlets ever make the logical leap from sports riots to greater cultural or community issues. the link that perhaps sports-fandom is overblown and cities need to stop catering to pro sports franchises, etc. ... you never hear that. but when it's a riot like in the case of Baltimore, you do hear about a "lack of accountability" from that community, doubting the sincerity of the reasons for the riot by focusing on the looting/property damage aspect of it.

I suppose what would end this disagreement is a study of the number of arrests, coverage, etc. after a sports riot that involved a majority of African Americans vs. one that involved mostly whites, like an NHL championship. I remember reading about how the 1984 riots in Detroit after the Tigers won were seen as an example of how far Detroit had fallen under Coleman Young (i.e. under black leadership). someone could take the time to pull coverage of sports riots and see what weasel words make their way in to describe them, depending on the racial makeup of those rioting, or "celebrating" ... as the case may be.

 

[Monster]

white Americans love to riot too, only they cover white riots differently in the media.

100% agree with you. Thugs. Even if rioters aren't normally thugs, they are thugs in the moment. That goes for all races. Just like that kid whose mom beat him up on live TV.