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Christ is Risen

I forget who actually had the original comment about Cosmos, but what is the problem with it? Christmas stole a lot of traditions from different religious holidays. Maybe not the Christian religious part of Christmas, but the traditions; The Tree, the gifts, Santa, etc. I don't think anyone can actually dispute that.

What does that have to do with science? They were talking about lead and lead's name came from the Latin god Saturn and the Christians re-purposed Saturnalia and other pagan holidays, but back to lead...the Romans knew lead was bad but they used it anyway.

It was a complete aside from the narrative only serving it's own purpose. It didn't tie back into the history of science at all. So I disagree with you over the idea that the show only tries to explore the Universe and explain in an uncomplicated way. It goes out of its way to attack Christianity.
 
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Well, if the writers and producers have 3 or 4 roles in making the show...

It's just like any other show or movie. YOu get credit for every job you have.

No. I've seen plenty of TV. It is extremely rare to see someone's name appear 3 or 4 times in the opening credits.

In the credits after the show, sure, but not the opening credits. ...or movies maybe. Maybe I've seen it in movies, but not on TV.

I don't see where you're seeing the idea that the show is anti-religion. They do challenge some Christian beliefs like the universe being 6,000 years old and being the center of the universe, but I don't see any obvious anti-religion content. Tune into Fox News whenever they have atheists on. They're treated like scum and any time they make an actual point, they have a catholic priest and a jewish rabbi to tag team him/her. Do you get offended by that, too?


Like I said before, I'm not opposed to anti-religion people voicing their opinions. I don't like wrapping it up like it's science.
 
I don't like the promotion of the science vs. religion divide. I don't like the idea that people might feel that they have to choose between the two.
 
What? So, because you believe in God, all of science's discoveries are bullshit? Or is it because the more you learn about science, the less likely it is that your faith is well placed?

No. I believe that God is the source of science. It did not make itself.

The show doesn't seek to destroy religion, only to explore the Universe and explain in an uncomplicated way about why we are here and how it came to happen. Not based on belief or faith, but actual experimentation and observable facts. There are a bit of educated guessing that goes into certain fields, but they are educated guesses. Not based off of some book from 2,000+ years ago full of symbolism and outright baloney.

That's a lot of baloney for many people to take the time and effort to record...and preserve. Much of what is recorded in The Bible was observed by people who wrote it down, in the same basic manner that scholars and authors do now.

This is what I said in my last (was supposed to be my last) response to you. You are completely blinded by your faith and can not make clear headed decisions when it comes to thinks like this. I, and several others on this board, just ask for some shred of evidence for what you say. That is science. It's not a religion. It's an actual path toward knowledge.

That is rather presumptuous. (as is the following paragraph) I function rather effectively in the world. There are a lot of brilliant people throughout history and living today who believe in God, including scientists.

The more you deny things that are accepted by the most educated men and women in the world, the deeper you fall into ignorance. Show us some proof. Give us something that says, "You're so wrong and this is why".

Nothing more fruitless than to attempt to prove an atheist wrong. I have no inclination to try. I will only share what I believe.

I am not swayed by some God who created us to be imperfect and then punishes us for being imperfect.

God did not create us to be imperfect. We did that to ourselves. We have the capacity to be perfect, but we don't aspire for perfection.

I'm not swayed by some God who thinks it's cool to end the world every time his imperfect creations are too imperfect. I mean, the Christian God is all knowing. He knows everything that has ever happened, is happening now, and will happen. So why not create us a little less imperfect and know that it will turn out better?

Love. That's why. It's the source of all existence. We have the capacity to be like God, but we refuse the offer. He does not need us--stop trying to think of Him as a person. He's God. Get to know Him and his Son ... and especially his Mother. She will lead you to God.
 
I don't like the promotion of the science vs. religion divide. I don't like the idea that people might feel that they have to choose between the two.

Do you dispute that traditions from Saturnalia were put into christmas? I don'tsee any denying that. So i don't see why it upsets you. The host makes a lot of side notes, like the origins of the wordd, "algebra" and,"alchemy".
 
Do you dispute that traditions from Saturnalia were put into christmas? I don'tsee any denying that. So i don't see why it upsets you. The host makes a lot of side notes, like the origins of the wordd, "algebra" and,"alchemy".

No, I'm not denying it. What aren't you getting? I'm not sure what part is missing here. I even spelled out how far they had to reach to drag Christianity into it.
 
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No, I'm not denying it. What aren't you getting? I'm not sure what part is missing here. I even spelled out how far they had to reach to drag Christianity into it.

Why would you be upset by it being mentioned then? It doesn't go against your religion one bit.
There could be no bad intent if there is no harm.
 
Why would you be upset by it being mentioned then? It doesn't go against your religion one bit.
There could be no bad intent if there is no harm.

Sure there can. If I take a swing at someone, but I miss, there's no harm, but there is bad intent.

I'm glad you brought up intent, because that's at the root of it. I don't take offense at the fact because I'm not that kind of religious person, but it's not an uncommon atheist talking point and it does get some people riled up. I'm not opposed to people bringing it up or riling up those types of religious people in general. However, it does get under my skin when you go out of your way to raise the point in a show that purports to be about science. It wasn't a little aside, it was a crazy reach that jarred the narrative and in doing so, revealed that their intent is not limited to describing the cosmos as they see it. Talking about how religions have helped and hurt the advance of science through history is fair game (though they bias their telling of that too) but this had nothing to do with the topic.
 
Sure there can. If I take a swing at someone, but I miss, there's no harm, but there is bad intent.

I'm glad you brought up intent, because that's at the root of it. I don't take offense at the fact because I'm not that kind of religious person, but it's not an uncommon atheist talking point and it does get some people riled up. I'm not opposed to people bringing it up or riling up those types of religious people in general. However, it does get under my skin when you go out of your way to raise the point in a show that purports to be about science. It wasn't a little aside, it was a crazy reach that jarred the narrative and in doing so, revealed that their intent is not limited to describing the cosmos as they see it. Talking about how religions have helped and hurt the advance of science through history is fair game (though they bias their telling of that too) but this had nothing to do with the topic.

The way I worded it was poor. I meant that there was no intent to cause harm and the mention of it is not offensive, so there shouldn't be harm. All it was was the host adding something to the conversation. I guess I just don't see why you took such offense. It was never a swipe at your religion, but a nod to where some christmas traditions come from. Those traditions have nothing to do with the christian religion.
 
Sure there can. If I take a swing at someone, but I miss, there's no harm, but there is bad intent.

I'm glad you brought up intent, because that's at the root of it. I don't take offense at the fact because I'm not that kind of religious person, but it's not an uncommon atheist talking point and it does get some people riled up. I'm not opposed to people bringing it up or riling up those types of religious people in general. However, it does get under my skin when you go out of your way to raise the point in a show that purports to be about science. It wasn't a little aside, it was a crazy reach that jarred the narrative and in doing so, revealed that their intent is not limited to describing the cosmos as they see it. Talking about how religions have helped and hurt the advance of science through history is fair game (though they bias their telling of that too) but this had nothing to do with the topic.

Okay now that I'm on my laptop...

I honestly don't remember Tyson mentioning Saturnalia and I did watch the episode. If I'm looking at this from an unbiased position, I do think that Atheists go overboard when talking about Saturnalia and Christmas and also Ishtar and Easter. I get annoyed at some of these ridiculous billboards, especially the one from before easter about how jesus didn't die for our sins. I mean, come on, if you want to get the message across, there are better ways of doing it. I guess they're no worse than some of the anti-atheist billboards I've seen. That said, I really don't see how anyone can think that Neil Degrasse Tyson meant any offense or pushed his atheist agenda on anyone.

So Easter and Christmas have taken some traditions from other religious holidays. That doesn't diminish the religious part of the holidays.

I try not to offend anyone unless they're deserving of ridicule, but I also don't think it's offensive to point out facts to people about their religion. Open debate is a good thing and I'm glad most of us on here don't get too upset.

And yes, I do like to joke and poke fun at certain things. I acknowledge that.
 
I see where Red is coming from. He's basically saying that they went out of their way to go totally off topic, while not really making a point at all except to take a stab at the origins of christmas/saturnalia.

I'm an atheist and not ashamed of it, but atheists that randomly go off on rants are just as annoying to me as religious people who feel they need to preach to everyone else.

Which is why I'm most in favor of people believing in whatever they want, as long as they try not to force it down other people's throats every chance they get.
 
I see where Red is coming from. He's basically saying that they went out of their way to go totally off topic, while not really making a point at all except to take a stab at the origins of christmas/saturnalia.

I'm an atheist and not ashamed of it, but atheists that randomly go off on rants are just as annoying to me as religious people who feel they need to preach to everyone else.

Which is why I'm most in favor of people believing in whatever they want, as long as they try not to force it down other people's throats every chance they get.

I get that. I just don't see the slightly off topic mention as being offensive. If he had listed all of the deities that are strikingly similar to Jesus, yes that'd be offensive. But, he mentioned Christmas traditions.

And I do agree with your last sentence. If it was that way, none of us atheists would ever complain about what people believe in. Until then, we're in the minority and if the minority sits back and stays silent, the majority grows.
 
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Which is why I'm most in favor of people believing in whatever they want, as long as they try not to force it down other people's throats every chance they get.

Yeeeeeeep.
 
If I'm looking at this from an unbiased position, I do think that Atheists go overboard when talking about Saturnalia and Christmas and also Ishtar and Easter.

And yes, I do like to joke and poke fun at certain things. I acknowledge that.

Ishtar was a much better movie than a lot of people give it credit for.

Although I avoid joking and poking fun at certain things, I do like to joke and at poke fun at Ishtar.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8KdQ7Gig770
 
...

Which is why I'm most in favor of people believing in whatever they want, as long as they try not to force it down other people's throats every chance they get.

Making fun of religions is enjoyable for me though, especially when KAWDAP gets mad and starts insulting people, claims he's not actually mad, and then argues over who insulted who first
 
Making fun of religions is enjoyable for me though, especially when KAWDAP gets mad and starts insulting people, claims he's not actually mad, and then argues over who insulted who first

I specifically remembered you in my prayers at Mass this morning.
 
I specifically remembered you in my prayers at Mass this morning.

how did I miss out on all this fun.

I'm sure that champs life will be enhanced by the fact that you mumbled something under your breath about him at church, that's powerful stuff.

Prayer is a good way to make an individual feel better about something they have zero chance of impacting. you have a sick family member, you pray and that makes you feel better, it has no impact on the sick person though. Praying is similar to superstition, I found a penny face up on the airport on my way to the rose bowl, kept it in my pocket for the game, made me feel like I had some control over the outcome, like my penny made a difference.
 
how did I miss out on all this fun.

I'm sure that champs life will be enhanced by the fact that you mumbled something under your breath about him at church, that's powerful stuff.

Prayer is a good way to make an individual feel better about something they have zero chance of impacting. you have a sick family member, you pray and that makes you feel better, it has no impact on the sick person though. Praying is similar to superstition, I found a penny face up on the airport on my way to the rose bowl, kept it in my pocket for the game, made me feel like I had some control over the outcome, like my penny made a difference.

It depends on what you pray for. And the purpose of prayer is not to make the "prayee" "feel better." And I wonder why something so trivial in your mind warrants a response from you, especially one that I could have forecasted had I considered the possibility of you offering your opinion, which I didn't.
 
That's a pretty weak god if Satan rules this Earth.

Would you be fearful of mocking Mohammad or Buddha? Probably not. We don't believe in your deity nor your devil. No fear on our side.

And Satan is a huge joke. Vain and jealous, but was somehow made to be the Angel in charge of worship. Then, he believes he should actually become God and is thrown out of Heaven. His main goal becomes turning people away from God so they would be with him in Hell. Then what does he do? Instead of rewarding them, he and the rest of his fallen decide to torture them! WTF!!!!

God created all things visible and invisible.
 
It depends on what you pray for. And the purpose of prayer is not to make the "prayee" "feel better." And I wonder why something so trivial in your mind warrants a response from you, especially one that I could have forecasted had I considered the possibility of you offering your opinion, which I didn't.

When I was in the hospital with my son for two weeks, people would say they were praying for all of us, it was nice to know they were thinking about us and they cared but it would have been a lot more helpful if they would say, bring us lunch or go to my house to feed the cat.
 
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