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Lions Off Season Thread

If we played those teams with Abdullah, Riddick, Swanson and Reiff it might be a different story. If Tate, Ebron, Boldin and Jones each made one better play (ie not drop the ball), the playoff game is a different story


The talent is there. They underachieved a little bit but had all their games against playoffs teams on the road except one. They are adding talent this offseason regardless

You used the words "if" and "might" in the same sentence. So even if we had all those players you're conceding that the outcome might not have been any different. That is not very convincing. We will never know what sort of difference those players would have made anyway so what's the point of conjecturing?

When we say we are "loaded with talent," what is that in comparison to? The Browns? The Jaguars? Or the Patriots, Cowboys, Seahawks, Steelers etc.? This is the point all of us are trying to make here. It's not enough to just have talent and then dismiss losses as being "too hard because they're on the road". We need to start winning these tough games, to take the next step. Or at least feel like we have a decent chance. Right now we are nowhere close to that.

I am definitely hopeful Quinn can make some good improvements with this draft however. I'm excited to see what the team looks like come training camp time.
 
If we played those teams with Abdullah, Riddick, Swanson and Reiff it might be a different story. If Tate, Ebron, Boldin and Jones each made one better play (ie not drop the ball), the playoff game is a different story


The talent is there. They underachieved a little bit but had all their games against playoffs teams on the road except one. They are adding talent this offseason regardless

I don't think the talent is on par with the remaining playoff teams. Roster wise, they are probably on par with GB with the exception of AR, which is the big difference. I think they overachieved a bit (record wise).

This doesn't mean they can't improve this off season.
 
It's on par. Better in some areas, weaker in some. Lions have a better D than Dallas/Atlanta/Green Bay talentwise and better O than Giants. Lions are better or equal at every position than Green Bay other than QB or safety. Seattle has a better D but it's closer than you think and Lions have better O though Wilson, Baldwin and Graham can ball.


And one offseason you can add a ton of talent. Giants added Harrison, Jenkins, Vernon and Apple in one offseason with Mayhew in charge of their cap now.


We'll see what the Lions can do to shore up run game and defense.


Plenty of cap room and 8 picks.
 
It's on par. Better in some areas, weaker in some. Lions have a better D than Dallas/Atlanta/Green Bay talentwise and better O than Giants. Lions are better or equal at every position than Green Bay other than QB or safety. Seattle has a better D but it's closer than you think and Lions have better O though Wilson, Baldwin and Graham can ball.

Looks like you have your Honolulu blue and silver tinted glasses on again.
 
If it's on par, they wouldn't have been embarrassed in the game.

If it's on par, they would have competed against some of the NFLs better teams.

If it's on par, they wouldn't have been down in basically every game in the 4th quarter other than one.

Bottom line, the team is much further away than you let on.
 
While we have a lot of cap room, we have a lot of holes to fill with that cap space. KC posted the Lions free agents. 27 guys with 15 playing significant time. That would equal out to just over $1 mill per guy. The right side of the Oline will take $10+ mill if we are lucky with contracts.

The only way we will add real talent is through the draft. We need to hit on starters for the first 3 rounds and add quality depth with the rest of the picks.

It will take time to get the roster to the talent level of the teams competing for a spot in the Super Bowl. We are still 2-3 years away from competing for a Super Bowl if we draft really well.
 
Look at the QB cap hits for the better teams in the league. You can pay your QB and still have a Super Bowl team. Staffords new contract will put him around 12th-18th for the first two years......then spike after that. Same as Brady, Ben, Rodgers, Wilson......

Sure, you CAN. But it leaves a lot less wiggle room and more dependency on drafting really well. If Quinn can pull off another solid draft I won't worry as much but I'll remain skeptical until he (or any other Lions GM) does. From everything I've read, those other guys you mentioned, their contracts will pale in comparison. Time will tell.

Also, probably best to leave Brady off that list. If there was ever such a thing as a QB giving his team a 'discount', he's the guy. He's been doing team friendly restructures for the better part of a decade. Dude just wants to win.

Shit, Dallas has Romo with a $20M+ cap hit and he is their backup!!

Haha, funny you mention Dallas because their 2017 cap situation is brutal by comparison to most of the league. Romo has got to go.
 
If it's on par, they wouldn't have been embarrassed in the game.

If it's on par, they would have competed against some of the NFLs better teams.

If it's on par, they wouldn't have been down in basically every game in the 4th quarter other than one.

Bottom line, the team is much further away than you let on.

You can have talent but struggle in a few game. See Packers losing 4 in a row.
 
And the Lions have about 3 guys they need to bring back. Everyone else on that list is c cheap guys. And it's not 1 guy 1 million. There is the top 51 rule and already 48 under contract. Lions have a ton of cap room. Stafford extension could lower his 22 million hit. A Ziggy extension could lower his 2017 hit (higher in other years)


Lions are in great cap shape
 
Top teams with most cap space:

1) Cleveland
2) San Fran
3) Tampa Bay
4) Tennessee
5) NE
6) Washington
7) Jacksonville
8) Carolina
9) Chicago
10) Indy

PLEASE, PLEASE stop associating having cap space as some magical franchise saver.
 
Whitehead played much better in 2014 and 2015. He is certainly capable but the DT play changed in front of him (even from 2015) and there wasn't a DE to set the edge on the closed end spot this year.


Whitehead and Levy are under contract. DT (pass rushing that isn't a run D liability, DE(good against run with consistent pressure) and a larger CB who could be a number 1 if Slay got hurt are the bigger fish to fry this offseason. On top of Reiff and Warford re-signs or upgrades, more speed at WR in the slot and maybe a workhorse back.
 
Top teams with most cap space:

1) Cleveland
2) San Fran
3) Tampa Bay
4) Tennessee
5) NE
6) Washington
7) Jacksonville
8) Carolina
9) Chicago
10) Indy

PLEASE, PLEASE stop associating having cap space as some magical franchise saver.

Lions are 12th. Lions can spend if they want too. Plus have another Quinn draft. Lions have a good talent base and more talent is coming. Plus will get some key guys healthy
 
Fine. So can these other 10 teams. And they are all crap other than NE.

Being able to spend needs to stopped be looking at as a sure-fire way that things will get better.
 
Fine. So can these other 10 teams. And they are all crap other than NE.

Being able to spend needs to stopped be looking at as a sure-fire way that things will get better.

Of course you need to spend wisely. Quinn will do that.

Vernon, Jenkins, Harrison. That kind of spending is what the Lions need.

Kawan Short, Charles Johnson, Trumaine Johnson. Spend like that.
 
Whitehead played much better in 2014 and 2015. He is certainly capable but the DT play changed in front of him (even from 2015) and there wasn't a DE to set the edge on the closed end spot this year.


Whitehead and Levy are under contract. DT (pass rushing that isn't a run D liability, DE(good against run with consistent pressure) and a larger CB who could be a number 1 if Slay got hurt are the bigger fish to fry this offseason. On top of Reiff and Warford re-signs or upgrades, more speed at WR in the slot and maybe a workhorse back.

Whitehead might've been a lot better this year, if we hadn't benched him for Tulloch in 2015. Played well in 2014, sat a majority of 2015. I remember ranting about this quite a bit in 2015.
 
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Of course you need to spend wisely. Quinn will do that.

Vernon, Jenkins, Harrison. That kind of spending is what the Lions need.

Kawan Short, Charles Johnson, Trumaine Johnson. Spend like that.

This is another thing you need to stop doing. Stop talking in absolutes. "Quinn will do that". You say that as if it's a certainty. You do that with a lot of things. Like "the Lions will win at 'fill in the blank'" and a lot of the times it doesn't happen.

Try to be open minded and leave open the possibility that you're not always right. Often times you're not. Just some friendly advice there.
 
This is another thing you need to stop doing. Stop talking in absolutes. "Quinn will do that". You say that as if it's a certainty. You do that with a lot of things. Like "the Lions will win at 'fill in the blank'" and a lot of the times it doesn't happen.

Try to be open minded and leave open the possibility that you're not always right. Often times you're not. Just some friendly advice there.

Friendly advice, don't make up what I said or didn't get right or wrong without checking the facts.

Lions will win it all if, they stay healthy. They did not for a lot of season on defense and at the end on offense. They made the right roster moves though and had depth (not DE or backup QB though). The depth got hurt at RB (Riddick) and RT (Robinson) and LB (Bostic, Bynes, Williams during the season). Slay and Ansah injuries and Staffords finger were pretty huge injuries plus Abdullah and Riddick combined. And don't get me started on the refs again. That is beyond anyones' control. The Lions should have stayed healthier, we deserve them to stay healthy and the be the heathiest team in the league for the next 10 years.

They had the capability to play better run defense and not drop 5 crucial balls. But on that particular day they didn't and on that day Seattle made 5 great catches too (3 one handed, Baldwin toe tap deep and Baldwin butt catch). If you replay the game again, the Lions might have made those routine catches (it doesn't mean our weapons suck). We'll never know now.

I said they would make the playoffs. They did. Many said they wouldn't. Defense was 13th in PPG. Had flaws but bend but don't break worked for playoffs when the offense struggled at points (20th) due to run game issues, some protection with a young line, Stafford finger injury at worst time, other key injuries and only six drives starting in opponent territory all year (tough sledding for offense).

Quinn will spend wisely. Please show me why you don't think he will spend wisely. It's basically a fact he will based on his one year history.

The Lions have the capability to spend to add talent. Some teams don't have that capability. Many do but some don't. Some teams don't have a good GM and won't spend wisely. Quinn should. And Lions have 8 draft picks to improve too. Getting key guys back healthy is big too. Every year the injury situation is different. We'll see what we have in store next year. But Quinn has a whole offseason, money and draft picks to even better deal with injuries (and they did a pretty good job in 2016, but some of the depth got hurt too). And again young guys should develop even more and they played. Decker, Robinson, Glasgow, Killebrew. Better play from them helps the team. Certain guys like Whitehead and Levy and Diggs could have much better seasons in 2017.

There are many reasons why the Lions will be "more improved" than other teams in 2017
 
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Ugh, you had a nice two day run after the loss to Seattle, but you are back to normal.

"They will win it all if they stay healthy."

What a joke.
 
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