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Mad Max Trade Value

stonecold2136

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 6, 2011
Messages
951
It seems like the perfect time to trade Scherzer is now. Word is the Tigers are open to dealing him. His value could be almost as high as it is for David Price.

My idea would be to see if the Reds are interested. The thinking on this would be a return of Billy Hamilton and Aroldis Chapman.

With Scott Boras being the agent for Scherzer, there is no way we will be able to resign him past 2014 for any less than $20 million a year for at least 5 years or more.

This would leave the door open to extend Porcello. This would also open up a spot for LHP Smiley in the rotation.

We still have a rotation of

Verlander
Sanchez
Fister
Smiley
Porcello
 
A closer who might get 75 innings and a guy who adds little, IMO, for Max? Not a chance.
 
That trade is shit. Chapman is a start not the main piece. The reds aren't the ideal team.
 
That trade is shit. Chapman is a start not the main piece. The reds aren't the ideal team.


This.


Teams that would trade for Max are either;

A) A team that wants to add him to an already established contender team trying to make the WS, or;

B) A team that wants, and can afford to sign him to an extension after they have traded for him.

It narrows down the field considerably.

While I would not mind us trading Max to fill some holes, and I'm actually hoping they can accomplish this, I'd rather we kept him than dealt him for pieces we didn't need or that don't make sense at all.
 
How bout. Cardinals as a trading partner. Matt Carpenter and Rosenthal (closer) or Martinez (set up man w/ electric stuff.
We get a Kings ransom for Sherzer or let him become a free agent after next year.
 
How bout. Cardinals as a trading partner. Matt Carpenter and Rosenthal (closer) or Martinez (set up man w/ electric stuff.
We get a Kings ransom for Sherzer or let him become a free agent after next year.

I'd want Tavares and Rosenthal.
 
Max Scherzer is gonna be the CY Young, we better get something wayyyyy better than what has been suggested. I want something like:

Jason Heyward or Giancarlo Stanton plus a young arm
 
Max Scherzer is gonna be the CY Young, we better get something wayyyyy better than what has been suggested. I want something like:

Jason Heyward or Giancarlo Stanton plus a young arm


Keep dreaming.

A 1 year rental of a player who only effects 1/5th of your games at best is not going to get a young superstar like Stanton all by himself, let alone a young arm thrown in.
 
Why on earth should the Tigers get Billy Hamilton?

Cause Hamilton would cost about $100 million dollars less than Jacoby Ellsbury and he is not an injury risk. He could also fill the LF black hole we have and give us a lead off hitter that could steal 100 bases a year.
 
Cause Hamilton would cost about $100 million dollars less than Jacoby Ellsbury and he is not an injury risk. He could also fill the LF black hole we have and give us a lead off hitter that could steal 100 bases a year.


1. He does not hit for any power, never will and this team lacks power.

2. He does not walk all that much and strikes out a ton. See Austin Jackson.

3. How do you know whether a player is an injury risk?

4. Went from being a SS, to one year in CF and you want to make him the LFer?

5. So far, defense has not been part of his game.

All the scouting reports talk about is his insane speed. Great. Some people drool over speed guys (Quintin Berry). But stealing bases is not that valuable in today's AL game. It is valuable, just not like it was back in the 70's and 80's.

Bottom line, with the recent position change, he is at least another year away from the big leagues. Even if we made him the starting 2B he would be a year away.

Scherzer should net a starting position player (maybe not an All Star), a solid reliever and a mid-level prospect, at a minimum.
 
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He should net a starting position player, solid reliever, and 2 top tier-level prospects. At a minimum.
 
1. He does not hit for any power, never will and this team lacks power.

2. He does not walk all that much and strikes out a ton. See Austin Jackson.

3. How do you know whether a player is an injury risk?

4. Went from being a SS, to one year in CF and you want to make him the LFer?

5. So far, defense has not been part of his game.

All the scouting reports talk about is his insane speed. Great. Some people drool over speed guys (Quintin Berry). But stealing bases is not that valuable in today's AL game. It is valuable, just not like it was back in the 70's and 80's.

Bottom line, with the recent position change, he is at least another year away from the big leagues. Even if we made him the starting 2B he would be a year away.

Scherzer should net a starting position player (maybe not an All Star), a solid reliever and a mid-level prospect, at a minimum.

1. He doesn't need to hit for power, he just needs to get on base, .350 OBP in 2258 plate appearances(5 years). This team has plenty of power Tied for 7th in all of baseball in HR'S with 176. Also finishing 2nd in all of baseball in total bases and RBI.

2. Hamilton walks 0.43 times a game to Jacoby Ellsbury's 0.31 and strike outs are 2013 season Hamilton 0.83 to Ellsbury's 0.68 a game. Austin Jackson's walks per game 0.38 and 2013 strike outs per game 1.0 (I used Ellsbury cause he is supposed to be the best lead off man in the game)

3. Hamilton is not an injury risk he has had a season stealing 133 bases in 135 games.Also 395 SB'S in 502 games The wear and tear of stealing that many bases means he has the body and the toughness and make up of a big time base stealer. A la Ricky Henderson, Vince Coleman, Tim Raines.

4. He did have a lot of errors at SS but his range factor was in the 4.50 range. The logical choice was to move him to move to CF. Billy did have 7 errors this year in CF, but he also had 8 OF assists which is excellent. 2nd base is not an option, keep him in the OF


5. My school of thought is if a guy can play CF he should be able to play LF with out any hiccups. With the cannon arm he has he could develop into an Alex Gordon, Carl Crawford type LF

The difference between Berry and Hamilton is - Berry is a Jorneyman piece of cannon fodder (one trick pony type). Hamilton is a highly touted blue chip top 10 prospect. He has speed to burn, can take a walk, and get base hits.

With austin jackson only stealing 8 bases last year we are desperate at the lead off position.

The tigers were dead last in SB'S WITH A PATHETIC 30. I personally think the day of the SB is back. There is a huge demand for it. The problem is there are hardly any bigtime base stealers out there. That is why I put such a huge premium on Hamilton.
 
1. He doesn't need to hit for power, he just needs to get on base, .350 OBP in 2258 plate appearances(5 years). This team has plenty of power Tied for 7th in all of baseball in HR'S with 176. Also finishing 2nd in all of baseball in total bases and RBI.

2. Hamilton walks 0.43 times a game to Jacoby Ellsbury's 0.31 and strike outs are 2013 season Hamilton 0.83 to Ellsbury's 0.68 a game. Austin Jackson's walks per game 0.38 and 2013 strike outs per game 1.0 (I used Ellsbury cause he is supposed to be the best lead off man in the game)

3. Hamilton is not an injury risk he has had a season stealing 133 bases in 135 games.Also 395 SB'S in 502 games The wear and tear of stealing that many bases means he has the body and the toughness and make up of a big time base stealer. A la Ricky Henderson, Vince Coleman, Tim Raines.

4. He did have a lot of errors at SS but his range factor was in the 4.50 range. The logical choice was to move him to move to CF. Billy did have 7 errors this year in CF, but he also had 8 OF assists which is excellent. 2nd base is not an option, keep him in the OF


5. My school of thought is if a guy can play CF he should be able to play LF with out any hiccups. With the cannon arm he has he could develop into an Alex Gordon, Carl Crawford type LF

The difference between Berry and Hamilton is - Berry is a Jorneyman piece of cannon fodder (one trick pony type). Hamilton is a highly touted blue chip top 10 prospect. He has speed to burn, can take a walk, and get base hits.

With austin jackson only stealing 8 bases last year we are desperate at the lead off position.

The tigers were dead last in SB'S WITH A PATHETIC 30. I personally think the day of the SB is back. There is a huge demand for it. The problem is there are hardly any bigtime base stealers out there. That is why I put such a huge premium on Hamilton.

2011-2013 AVG AL
77.36 RC/650 .257 BAVG .322 OBP .410 SLG .732 OPS 13.15 PA/BB 36.27 PA/HR 49.37 PA/GIDP

2011-2013 AVG DET
84.95 RC/650 .277 BAVG .341 OBP .431 SLG .772 OPS 13.01 PA/BB 36.85 PA/HR 41.78 PA/GIDP

2011-2013 DET without Cabrera?s stats
78.91 RC/650 .270 BAVG .330 OBP .410 SLG .740 OPS 13.60 PA/BB 42.90 PA/HR 44.29 PA/GIDP

You take Cabrera out of the lineup, and this team is at the bottom for power. Sure, add another weak hitter that strikeouts.

2013 AAA.256 BAVG .308 OBP .343 SLG .651 OPS

His Triple A stats are very telling when faced with advanced pitching. And, Outfield Assists are not a gauge for arm strength. Kenny Lofton was known for having a noodle arm and had 23 Outfield Assists one year.
 
2011-2013 AVG AL
77.36 RC/650 .257 BAVG .322 OBP .410 SLG .732 OPS 13.15 PA/BB 36.27 PA/HR 49.37 PA/GIDP

2011-2013 AVG DET
84.95 RC/650 .277 BAVG .341 OBP .431 SLG .772 OPS 13.01 PA/BB 36.85 PA/HR 41.78 PA/GIDP

2011-2013 DET without Cabrera’s stats
78.91 RC/650 .270 BAVG .330 OBP .410 SLG .740 OPS 13.60 PA/BB 42.90 PA/HR 44.29 PA/GIDP

You take Cabrera out of the lineup, and this team is at the bottom for power. Sure, add another weak hitter that strikeouts.

2013 AAA.256 BAVG .308 OBP .343 SLG .651 OPS

His Triple A stats are very telling when faced with advanced pitching. And, Outfield Assists are not a gauge for arm strength. Kenny Lofton was known for having a noodle arm and had 23 Outfield Assists one year.

There are more talented players in AA. So I tend to put more stock into AA than AAA. AAA is loaded with dead weight type players like Quinten Berry and pitchers like Jeremy Bondeman and so on. Any MLB GM will tell you that. You gotta admit I got you on that one.

Billy's HR production also went up to 6 which still isn't much but it is better than 2 or 3. Move Austin Jackson down in the bottom 3rd of the order and let him relax and concentrate on hitting for power
 
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Seriously, you thought you "got me on something"?

So, what you are saying is that we should get Hamilton because he did well against AA, but didn't do well against Bonderman-type pitchers? I guess I don't hold that value.
 
2011-2013 AVG AL
77.36 RC/650 .257 BAVG .322 OBP .410 SLG .732 OPS 13.15 PA/BB 36.27 PA/HR 49.37 PA/GIDP

2011-2013 AVG DET
84.95 RC/650 .277 BAVG .341 OBP .431 SLG .772 OPS 13.01 PA/BB 36.85 PA/HR 41.78 PA/GIDP

2011-2013 DET without Cabrera?s stats
78.91 RC/650 .270 BAVG .330 OBP .410 SLG .740 OPS 13.60 PA/BB 42.90 PA/HR 44.29 PA/GIDP

You take Cabrera out of the lineup, and this team is at the bottom for power. Sure, add another weak hitter that strikeouts.

2013 AAA.256 BAVG .308 OBP .343 SLG .651 OPS

His Triple A stats are very telling when faced with advanced pitching. And, Outfield Assists are not a gauge for arm strength. Kenny Lofton was known for having a noodle arm and had 23 Outfield Assists one year.

Spot on.

Cabrera hit 25% of our HRs last year.

If Fielder can bounce back and hit 35-40 HRs this year it would make our lineup so much more formidable.

Would love to be able to add another player who can hit 20+ out of park to the lineup.

The fact that we're gonna be replacing Peralta's bat with Iglesias only makes matters worse.

This lineup needs another power threat in the lineup badly.
 
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