the OTHER kind of affirmative action

[Michchamp]

Okay, you have two unrelated things going on in this this thread. The OP is about the Kushner donation to Harvard, and then in post 4, you move to Affirmative Action and Rush Limbaugh.

yeah... it's related to affirmative action. and it's one of those political footballs that has been kicked around again.

I guess it's a topic for another thread, but it's kinda shocking how hands-off the DOJ has been with respect to white collar crime. and lest you think I'm being partisan here, this problem really got bad under Obama, when he nominated Eric Holder - as hands off as they come in terms of letting white collar criminals skate. Bush's DOJ threw the Enron scumbags in jail and brought down Andersen for signing off on it.

now seeing their focus is on low level drug bullshit (weed) and something that's not even criminal (affirmative action) looks like it will only continue to get worse.

 

[byco42]

JFK himself was a bought-and-paid-for Haaavaddd Man. His application essay:

The reasons that I have for wishing to go to Harvard are several. I feel that Harvard can give me a better background and a better liberal education than any other university. I have always wanted to go there, as I have felt that it is not just another college, but is a university with something definite to offer. Then too, I would like to go to the same college as my father. To be a "Harvard man" is an enviable distinction, and one that I sincerely hope I shall attain.

JFK, 28 April 1935

 

[Michchamp]

JFK himself was a bought-and-paid-for Haaavaddd Man. His application essay:

The reasons that I have for wishing to go to Harvard are several. I feel that Harvard can give me a better background and a better liberal education than any other university. I have always wanted to go there, as I have felt that it is not just another college, but is a university with something definite to offer. Then too, I would like to go to the same college as my father. To be a "Harvard man" is an enviable distinction, and one that I sincerely hope I shall attain.

JFK, 28 April 1935

yeah.

I never said, nor do I think bias and privilege playing a role in college admissions is a new thing.

But, I would draw a meaningful (at least I think it's meaningful) distinction between JFK following Joe to Harvard, and Kushner Sr. - who had no connections to Harvard - calling them up when Jared decided he wanted to apply there and just writing them 10 $250,000 checks to get him in.

 

[Spartanmack]

There is a clear distinction. At least the Kushner's had to pay something of value which could then be used to finance the education expenses of less fortunate students at Harvard.

 

[byco42]

yeah.

I never said, nor do I think bias and privilege playing a role in college admissions is a new thing.

But, I would draw a meaningful (at least I think it's meaningful) distinction between JFK following Joe to Harvard, and Kushner Sr. - who had no connections to Harvard - calling them up when Jared decided he wanted to apply there and just writing them 10 $250,000 checks to get him in.

Is it against the law? Yes, it stinks, but that's life, right? The person who did not get into Harvard because of this injustice? Well ... who wants to go to Harvard anyway?

 

[tinselwolverine]

yeah... it's related to affirmative action. and it's one of those political footballs that has been kicked around again.

I don't see how the two are reference...related I mean.

Events of elite privilege are rare, random and micro in their nature.

Affirmative Action policies are macro in their nature.

 

[tinselwolverine]

Is it against the law? Yes, it stinks, but that's life, right? The person who did not get into Harvard because of this injustice? Well ... who wants to go to Harvard anyway?

Kushnar is a minority too, anyway.

 

[tomdalton22]

yeah.

I never said, nor do I think bias and privilege playing a role in college admissions is a new thing.

But, I would draw a meaningful (at least I think it's meaningful) distinction between JFK following Joe to Harvard, and Kushner Sr. - who had no connections to Harvard - calling them up when Jared decided he wanted to apply there and just writing them 10 $250,000 checks to get him in.

Right now Harvard costs about $67K per year....back then a little less. Let's say tuition room and board for one student for 4 years was about $250K. Maybe those 10 $250K checks went towards scholarships for 10 poor minorities that got in ahead of deserving white kids.

One rich kid gets in and pays for 10 poor kids. Sounds about right

 

[byco42]

Kushnar is a minority too, anyway.

You dern right. He's got a daddy with money to burn.

 

[tinselwolverine]

You dern right. He's got a daddy with money to burn.

Yeah that too. Pretty small minority right there.

 

[Michchamp]

I'm seeing a lot of stuff continuing to come out due to the big admissions bribery trials going on. Time to update this thread a bit.

This one about hedge fund founder David Shaw is fun:

Starting in 2011, when the oldest of their three children was about two years away from applying to college, the Shaw Family Endowment Fund donated $1 million annually to Harvard, Yale, Princeton and Stanford and at least $500,000 each to Columbia and Brown. The pattern persisted through 2017, the most recent year for which public filings are available, with a bump in giving to Columbia to $1 million a year in 2016 and 2017.
​

His kids went to Yale.

 

[tomdalton22]

I'm seeing a lot of stuff continuing to come out due to the big admissions bribery trials going on. Time to update this thread a bit.

This one about hedge fund founder David Shaw is fun:

Starting in 2011, when the oldest of their three children was about two years away from applying to college, the Shaw Family Endowment Fund donated $1 million annually to Harvard, Yale, Princeton and Stanford and at least $500,000 each to Columbia and Brown. The pattern persisted through 2017, the most recent year for which public filings are available, with a bump in giving to Columbia to $1 million a year in 2016 and 2017.
​

His kids went to Yale.

assholes giving their money away to institutions of higher learning. How sad.

 

[Michchamp]

assholes giving their money away to institutions of higher learning. How sad.

Only when they're trying to give their kids an advantage 99% of Americans don't have...

 

[Michchamp]

another one, this from a study:

Using publicly released reports, we examine the preferences Harvard gives for recruited athletes, lega- cies, those on the dean?s interest list, and children of faculty and staff (ALDCs). Among white admits, over 43% are ALDC. Among admits who are African American, Asian American, and Hispanic, the share is less than 16% each. Our model of admissions shows that roughly three quarters of white ALDC admits would have been rejected if they had been treated as white non-ALDCs. Removing preferences for athletes and legacies would significantly alter the racial distribution of admitted students, with the share of white admits falling and all other groups rising or remaining unchanged.
​

 

[Michchamp]

I'm guessing these "athletes" include a large number of individuals from sports like fencing, rowing, tennis, squash, skiing, sailing, badminton, and water polo.

 

[Michchamp]

I'm guessing these "athletes" include a large number of individuals from sports like fencing, rowing, tennis, squash, skiing, sailing, badminton, and water polo.

in the admission's scandal stuff from USC, I think the "dean's interest list" translated as: "gave us A LOT money, and the dean is interested in that."

 

[Michchamp]

Link:

In reality, 43% of Harvard?s white students are either recruited athletes, legacy students, on the dean?s interest list (meaning their parents have donated to the school) or children of faculty and staff (students admitted based on these criteria are referred to as ?ALDCs?, which stands for ?athletes?, ?legacies?, ?dean?s interest list? and ?children? of Harvard employees). The kicker? Roughly three-quarters of these applicants would have been rejected if it weren?t for having rich or Harvard-connected parents or being an athlete.
​

According to Harvard's numbers, 44% of their admitted class of 2025 are white (1,023), out of a total class size of 2,320.

43% of 1,023 is 439. So out of a class of 2,320, a full 439 of the white kids got in just by being rich, legacies, or by being athletes. I'm guessing most of those athletes were also rich (?)

And some portion of those minority admittees are also privileged:

This dynamic is inherently racialized, with almost 70% of all legacy applicants at Harvard being white. According to the study, a white person?s chances of being admitted increased seven times if they had family who donated to Harvard. Meanwhile in stark contrast, African American, Asian American and Hispanic students make up less than 16% of ALDC students.
​

 

[Spartanmack]

For it disclose the % of nonwhite, non-Asian and non ALDCs wud have gotten rejected if not for their minority status?

 

[tinselwolverine]

ALDC sounds like a learning disability.

Harvard - like the other Ivies - don?t offer no athletic scholies. I guess admissions think academic qualifying applicants who participated in sports are well rounded - that?s what a lookaround the interwebs shows people are saying.

Reporting that legacy and families with money gives a leg up is like reporting that water is wet.

 

[sggatecl]

Was this always stickied? If so, why?