Ukraine Riots

[Gulo Blue]

Not US politics, but politics.

As I understand it, the government is corrupt and keeps aligning itself with Putin's Russia while the rioters want to align themselves with the EU. Riots include molotov cocktails and reports of a catapult. People in the vicinity of the riots have been mass text messaged "Dear subscriber, you are registered as a participant in a mass riot." and a law that went into effect Tuesday gets you 15 years in prison for mass rioting. Now there's a picture kicking around that appears to show the riot police lighting a molotov cocktail. Haven't seen that mentioned in any news source yet.

 

[Gulo Blue]

http://rt.com/news/ukraine-catapult-protesters-arming-903/

The trebuchet is shown in this link.

Here's the other picture I mentioned.

 

[Michchamp]

as I am married to a Ukrainian (we were there last June) I am extremely familiar with the situation there.

yes, the current president (Yanukovich) is corrupt, and a complete idiot. His political party (the Party of Regions) originates from the east of the country, where the population is largely ethnic Russian, and favors stronger ties to Russia. After the Orange Revolution a couple years ago (Yanukovich was the guy who lost to Yushenko in that election) the Party of Regions basically came out of nowhere to dominate national politics. a lot of its members are basically thugs, former (or secretly still) Ukrainian mob members, uneducated, bullies.

The Country has some curious features... the western part of the country is ethnically Ukrainian, speaks Ukrainian - exclusively in some cases - HATES the eastern part, and favors stronger European ties. Parts of Western Ukraine were actually part of Poland after WWI.

The official language of the country IS Ukrainian, but people from the eastern part of the country, (Including Ukraine's President! and many elected officials from his party) don't even speak it. they only speak Russian.

another curious fact... the Western part of the country is more educated and cultured, but poorer. The Eastern part has all the heavy industry, much of the nation's wealth and dominates the nation's politics. It would be like if the South in the US wasn't both poorer and dumber than the North.

 

[Michchamp]

The capital of Kiev is in the middle of the nation... the worst riots are occurring there. Kiev has most of the wealth of the country concentrated there... even wealthier people from the east move there or maintain condos or apartments in the city.

in the west the protestors are largely unmolested by the state security forces. As I mentioned above, the west of the country favors stronger European ties, HATES Russia, and wants to move toward the EU. The mayor of Lviv even said that if the Ukrainian gov't starts sending its Bully Boys to his city, he's ordering his own police to fight them.

the east of the country, no one is really protesting... when the few people there have tried, they get the crap kicked out of them.

 

[Michchamp]

I actually have a funny Michigan-football-related story from my trip to Ukraine.

We were walking down a touristy avenue in the city, where lots of street vendors sell old soviet army memorabilia, nesting dolls, and other knick knacks and doohickeys. on one cart, I noticed they had a lot of American-sports themed nesting dolls. My wife asked me if they had a Michigan football one, and I said no, as I hadn't seen one, but the vendor overheard and found one among his stores. Sure enough, it was a Michigan football player! Denard Robinson was the first one, then Gardner, then... I forget, but they had Funchess too. he offered it for 400 grievnas (about $50) but I was a little short on cash because we were buying souvenirs for other people, and it was a pain to go back to the ATM (you can only take out 1000 grievnas at a pop.)

my wife, and her friends started haggling with the guy over the price, and he flipped out... put the nesting dolls away and refused to sell them to me!

I think he was caught off guard because he thought he was dealing with rich Americans, and offended we tried to haggle... Bummer. I wish I would've bought them now.

 

[Michchamp]

where did you find the picture of the cops with the molotov cocktail? it's not on the RT site... no surprise though, as RT news is funded by Moscow, and as such, probably unreliable here.

 

[Gulo Blue]

where did you find the picture of the cops with the molotov cocktail? it's not on the RT site... no surprise though, as RT news is funded by Moscow, and as such, probably unreliable here.

Reddit. That's why I put a weasel word in there. Fake garbage gets posted to reddit often. (and often it gets called out as fake right away too.) This doesn't look fake, but who knows.

link:
http://imgur.com/0KSpQdv

apparently I can't link to livestreams.

Crtl-f and search for the word "streaming" here
http://www.reddit.com/r/pics/comments/1vumy3/ukraine_today/
http://www.***********/channel/euromajdan/pop-out

 

[Gulo Blue]

lot's of links assembled here:http://www.reddit.com/r/europe/comments/1vvhnd/last_news_from_ukraine/

 

[Michchamp]

thanks. the wife has been manning a facebook group for info about the riots.

it's a pretty crazy place. Makes you appreciate urban planning and zoning... also lawn mowers. no one in Ukraine maintains lawns, bushes, or anything like that. and no one smiles in pictures.

the rule of law is also tenuous, and often non-existent, and your rights and privileges are determined entirely by your own wealth and social connections. It's almost medieval with a "nobility" running roughshod over the country.

If you thought the U.S. was bad... this kid wouldn't even have had to sit for trial in Ukraine, let alone get slapped on the wrist with probation.

 

[Gulo Blue]

The Europe group is all over this.

http://www.reddit.com/r/europe/

 

[KAWDUP]

It would be like if the South in the US wasn't both poorer and dumber than the North.

Very interesting set of stories. Had me rapt trying visualize everything you were saying, and then you make some stupid ass comment, that shows complete ignorance and even worse stereotyping.

Good bait job champ - got me.

 

[byco42]

I say let Michchamp's sectional-stereotype biases fester and dangle. I think he's John Pendelton Kennedy reincarnated.

 

[Michchamp]

Very interesting set of stories. Had me rapt trying visualize everything you were saying, and then you make some stupid ass comment, that shows complete ignorance and even worse stereotyping.

Good bait job champ - got me.

Oh, so sorry one comment ruined the whole post for you. I'd take byco's advice.

 

[Michchamp]

I say let Michchamp's sectional-stereotype biases fester and dangle. I think he's John Pendelton Kennedy reincarnated.

I don't get it:

John Pendleton Kennedy (October 25, 1795 ? August 18, 1870) was an American novelist and Whig politician who served as United States Secretary of the Navy from July 26, 1852 to March 4, 1853, during the administration of President Millard Fillmore, and as a U.S. Representative from the Maryland's 4th congressional district.

 

[KAWDUP]

Oh, so sorry one comment ruined the whole post for you. I'd take byco's advice.

No thanks. Too much fun to insult you.

I am quite interested in your stories, don't get me wrong, but I wouldn't let that comment pass unchallenged - it just isn't in me. I am American, and I really believe that all men are created equal - and that includes all your unnecessary stereotypes.

BTW - It didn't ruin the whole post. Sometime I will regale you with the story of how I was in China working at the Beijing airport when the US government "accidently" bombed the Chinese Embassy. It might be similarly interesting.

 

[Gulo Blue]

Opposition leader said the President must talk to them tomorrow or they'll attack instead of just protest.

Allegedly, (I can't read Russian) what this video shows is the gov getting tanks ready tonight.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NSQ989fCrbU

 

[Gulo Blue]

Is a "Titushka" someone aligned with the government? The US embassy is surrounded by Titushkas.

Googling it, it looks like a Titushka is a thug, hired by the government. I'm glad we don't have a word for that.

 

[Michchamp]

Is a "Titushka" someone aligned with the government? The US embassy is surrounded by Titushkas.

Googling it, it looks like a Titushka is a thug, hired by the government. I'm glad we don't have a word for that.

yep. mostly from the south and east of the country.

basically rounding up our equivalent of racist, blue collar rednecks, sending them to NY and DC (Kiev is both in Ukraine) and telling them to beat the shit out of the liberal elitists protesting (who are always a bunch of rich college kids with their ipads doing it for shits and giggles, and a couple bitch investigative journalists who don't know their place)

 

[Michchamp]

my wife said there's no way the army and navy side with the president and attack the people. I'm not so sure. maybe not the whole army and navy, but he'll call out someone.

she said she thinks Russia is paying for the titushkas and the other guys (they also have some Russian/Ukrainian name)

side note: I've been trying to learn to speak Russian for a while. It was either Russian or Ukrainian and since her family all speaks Russian anyway, and it's the more useful of the two languages (neither are really useful though) I settled on that one. I haven't exactly been giving it a great effort, but it is a fucking hard language to learn. I have the alphabet down and can read it, but the words are so long and hard to pronounce. they conjugate nouns as well as verbs, and they never had their own version of a Dr. Johnson producing a standard Russian dictionary, so spelling is a mess. if you translate Russian directly to English, it sounds really stupid as well, since they don't use articles... no "a, an, or the" to specify nouns. makes me long for the days of Spanish or French class. I remember hating having to take a second language, but both of those were simple by comparison to Russian

 

[byco42]

I don't get it:

John Pendleton Kennedy (October 25, 1795 ? August 18, 1870) was an American novelist and Whig politician who served as United States Secretary of the Navy from July 26, 1852 to March 4, 1853, during the administration of President Millard Fillmore, and as a U.S. Representative from the Maryland's 4th congressional district.

He wrote a book titled Swallow Barn. A forgotten book today, but it was all the rage in the early 1830s.