@AltNatParkSer

[Gulo Blue]

https://twitter.com/altnatparkser

In case you missed it, Trump has placed a gag order on EPA employees and National Park Service employees. Whoever runs the Badlands National Park twitter account violated the gag order and posted climate facts. After a few hours these posts were deleted. Now there's an unofficial twitter account:

"The Unofficial "Resistance" team of U.S. National Park Service. Not taxpayer subsidised! Come for rugged scenery, fossil beds, 89 million acres of landscape"

 

[biggunsbob]

This administration is going to be so bad for the environment sadly. . Man I hope there is someone in this administration that gives a damn about the future of mankind.

 

[Mitchrapp]

This administration is going to be so bad for the environment sadly. . Man I hope there is someone in this administration that gives a damn about the future of mankind.

Environment is like everything else. Some people are environment conscience, others don't give a shit - and a whole bunch in between.

 

[Gulo Blue]

They are pushing this effort, which appears to be in its infancy.

http://www.scientistsmarchonwashington.com/

 

[Mitchrapp]

Scientists can blow me.

 

[Gulo Blue]

Scientists can blow me.

http://www.314action.org/home

 

[JScottWriter]

Scientists can blow me.

You hate science and facts I see.

 

[Thumb]

You hate science and facts I see.

General ignorance.

 

[Mitchrapp]

You hate science and facts I see.

Do I have a choice? I believe in God, not evolution. No Big Bang Theory, but God. I believe in faith over Science. Not that I don't like anything about Science. Not sure why that makes me a bad guy..

 

[Gulo Blue]

Do I have a choice? I believe in God, not evolution. No Big Bang Theory, but God. I believe in faith over Science. Not that I don't like anything about Science. Not sure why that makes me a bad guy..

Tell it to Georges Lema?tre and Gregor Mendel.

 

[sggatecl]

Do I have a choice? I believe in God, not evolution. No Big Bang Theory, but God. I believe in faith over Science. Not that I don't like anything about Science. Not sure why that makes me a bad guy..

A lot more to science than evolution. I haven't been to church regularly since I was 20 years old so I might be foggy but I don't remember the Bible ever defining things like physics and astronomy. I get that you would hate/disagree with some principle ideas but science in general seems a bit extreme.

Galileo, Isaac Newton, Francis Bacon, and Lise Meitner were all Christians. I'm sure there were probably more.

 

[Mitchrapp]

A lot more to science than evolution. I haven't been to church regularly since I was 20 years old so I might be foggy but I don't remember the Bible ever defining things like physics and astronomy. I get that you would hate/disagree with some principle ideas but science in general seems a bit extreme.

Galileo, Isaac Newton, Francis Bacon, and Lise Meitner were all Christians. I'm sure there were probably more.

My "science blows" remark was more off the cuff snarky response. Like I said previously there are some things I like about science. You mentioned Isaac Newton, something goes up must come down. Of course. Other things I'm not so keen on.

 

[Michchamp]

Environment is like everything else. Some people are environment conscience, others don't give a shit - and a whole bunch in between.

according to the projections I've read, most of us will be dead (or dying) by the time the environmental changes we've wrought start to make themselves really felt. sea level rise, mass extinctions, droughts, loss of arable & habitable land, etc. But our kids will be there to deal with it, whether like you they don't give a shit about the environment or they do.

you can "not give a shit about the environment" ... but unfortunately you still have to live in it.

 

[Gulo Blue]

according to the projections I've read, most of us will be dead (or dying) by the time the environmental changes we've wrought start to make themselves really felt.

Unless you count the coral reefs dying. That's happening now. 1% of the oceans. 25% of the ocean's species. Probably already too late to do anything about it.

Is it fair yet to say "fuck the denialists?" I know they've been lied to, but at this point in the game, I feel like everybody should be able to see how the bullshit spin came from people who need people to believe the lies to make money. Besides, now that Exxon isn't even lying about it anymore, why are people still holding on to BS they sold us?

Why would you still deny climate science in 2017? Are they that unwilling to admit they were wrong? Do they think they can keep lying to themselves for the rest of their lives? Or do they really believe? After even the cigarette companies admit smoking is bad, they refuse to stop parroting the junk science/advertising.

...and just in case anyone is unaware, here's Exxon's position on climate change. It's old news at this point.

http://corporate.exxonmobil.com/en/current-issues/climate-policy/climate-perspectives/our-position

 

[tinselwolverine]

according to the projections I've read, most of us will be dead (or dying) by the time the environmental changes we've wrought start to make themselves really felt.

you can "not give a shit about the environment" ... but unfortunately you still have to live in it.

But you just said we won't have to...because we'll all be dead...

 

[Michchamp]

But you just said we won't have to...because we'll all be dead...

that last part was more metaphorically speaking.

I always wondered what was going through the minds of mining, oil, and manufacturing execs as they sign off on dumping shit right into the ground or lakes and rivers, or pumping shit right into the atmosphere... like maybe you think you can live away from the worst of it, or only drink bottled water, etc. but what about everyone else you care about?

maybe they DON'T care about anyone else? sometimes I think that's a prereq to do a "job" like that.

Or maybe they believe that Biblical nonsense about "god giving us the Earth to use as we see fit"?

 

[Gulo Blue]

that last part was more metaphorically speaking.

I always wondered what was going through the minds of mining, oil, and manufacturing execs as they sign off on dumping shit right into the ground or lakes and rivers, or pumping shit right into the atmosphere... like maybe you think you can live away from the worst of it, or only drink bottled water, etc. but what about everyone else you care about?

maybe they DON'T care about anyone else? sometimes I think that's a prereq to do a "job" like that.

Or maybe they believe that Biblical nonsense about "god giving us the Earth to use as we see fit"?

We're all using tons of resources because it's normal. What we grew up with. It's not fundamentally different to sign off on dumping or to consume the products that require that dumping, same thing to different degrees.

 

[biggunsbob]

that last part was more metaphorically speaking.

I always wondered what was going through the minds of mining, oil, and manufacturing execs as they sign off on dumping shit right into the ground or lakes and rivers, or pumping shit right into the atmosphere... like maybe you think you can live away from the worst of it, or only drink bottled water, etc. but what about everyone else you care about?

maybe they DON'T care about anyone else? sometimes I think that's a prereq to do a "job" like that.

Or maybe they believe that Biblical nonsense about "god giving us the Earth to use as we see fit"?

Profits over people sadly .

 

[Michchamp]

We're all using tons of resources because it's normal. What we grew up with. It's not fundamentally different to sign off on dumping or to consume the products that require that dumping, same thing to different degrees.

Yeah, I know. I recently read an article comparing the avg. daily electricity use of a Nigerian vs. an American, and even though I should not have been, was still surprised by the disparity.

But some are MORE guilty of it than most. The avg. American wasn't given a choice of how much energy their lifestyle would use... we grew up with it. and our infrastructure was built to more or less force most of us into it. We didn't have a say when massive freeways were built if we'd rather have had that money go to rail and bus transit.

and if the choice is there in a more abstract way, it's certainly not presented clearly and starkly to allow most people to understand what they're choosing.

In the end that "Hey we're ALL to blame for our energy usage/waste" line of thinking let's those off the hook who are more to blame for our situation, and who stand to lose if we fix our energy usage and go more green and more energy conservative. It's a self-serving line of thinking being pushed on the rest of us.

 

[Gulo Blue]

Yeah, I know. I recently read an article comparing the avg. daily electricity use of a Nigerian vs. an American, and even though I should not have been, was still surprised by the disparity.

But some are MORE guilty of it than most. The avg. American wasn't given a choice of how much energy their lifestyle would use... we grew up with it. and our infrastructure was built to more or less force most of us into it. We didn't have a say when massive freeways were built if we'd rather have had that money go to rail and bus transit.

and if the choice is there in a more abstract way, it's certainly not presented clearly and starkly to allow most people to understand what they're choosing.

In the end that "Hey we're ALL to blame for our energy usage/waste" line of thinking let's those off the hook who are more to blame for our situation, and who stand to lose if we fix our energy usage and go more green and more energy conservative. It's a self-serving line of thinking being pushed on the rest of us.

I get what you're saying and you're right that there's a danger to framing it in a way that could be interpreted as 'everybody does it'. But I believe that the answer to your question 'what are they thinking?' is that they really aren't thinking that differently from the rest of us. It's a matter of degrees, or being MORE guilty as you said. It's not that they don't care, they just don't care enough to give up their job or make a decision that will hurt their career. "We hear about environmental disasters all the time. What's one more if it puts food on my table?" "This is how it's always been done. Why should I be the one that has to do it differently?" In the case of rich people, I suspect the attitude is "Somebody is going to do it anyway, I might as well be the one making money."

I don't mean to let them off the hook, but I think it is the answer to your question.