More alternative facts

[tinselwolverine]

Religion, morality, and knowledge, being necessary to good government and the happiness of mankind, schools and the means of education shall forever be encouraged.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/just_so_stevie/2635832930

What is that a picture of? The State House of Ohio?

 

[Michchamp]

It won't; and states and municipalities control their own schools vastly more so than the Federal Government does.

EDIT: Below is from a website named "encyclopedia." I'm not familiar with it but it follows what I understand; the article is pretty expansive with a lot of links to citations:

The right to a free public education is found in the various state constitutions and not in the federal constitution. Every state has a provision in its constitution, commonly called the "education article," that guarantees some form of free public education, usually through the twelfth grade.

The full article.

Public education is the purview of each individual state, and the states aren't going to get rid of it.

So don't sweat it.

well, they'll still have to provide public education, it'll just be a lot shittier because more of the money will be diverted to private sector, charter school shareholders. the issue with charter schools isn't merely privatisation... it's finding a way for for-profit charter schools to muscle in on public education funding.

gutting teachers' unions is a means to an end; if they can kill unions, teachers lose job security and the power to collectively bargain... so less of public school funding can go to teachers and more to the charter schools' shareholders.

the results of charter schools are... mixed at best. some performed okay (not better than adequately funded public schools though.) other times charter schools were disastrous (look up what happened in Muskegon, MI)

I've read a lot about this in Chicago, where charters performed better than neighborhood schools in bad neighborhoods only, but that was more or less because there charter schools could expel problem kids; publics had to accept them.

also... NONE of the rich people pushing charter schools in Chicago sent their own kids their. they either used their clout to send them to good, unionized! city public schools, or private non-profits (like catholic schools). I'm guessing you'd see the same thing everywhere else.

Religion, morality, and knowledge, being necessary to good government and the happiness of mankind, schools and the means of education shall forever be encouraged.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/just_so_stevie/2635832930

Angell Hall... never noticed or thought about the blatant 1st Amendment issue (religion necessary?!) before.

 

[Michchamp]

What is that a picture of? The State House of Ohio?

Far from it...

 

[tinselwolverine]

Tinsel, as someone who works in education and has at all levels, saying "don't sweat it" is misguided. If she does what she says and puts a new focus on these private and charter schools, lots of money will be going away from state funded schools to those private ones.

The bigger scare is that she had NO CLUE what the ADA was.

I didn't watch her confirmation so I don't know about her not knowing what the ADA is - that's pretty bad.

I was replying to the statement "the privatization of public schools will start tomorrow soon."

That's not true; and given that every state constitution has a guarantee for public education, I would say that that is misguided.

 

[dubbsco]

Yes, I agree with that. But long term, her business plan scares the life out of me.

 

[tinselwolverine]

Yes, I agree with that. But long term, her business plan scares the life out of me.

We'll see.

I don't think there's going to be a long term for her.

We've certainly had charter schools here in Los Angeles for quite some time, and opinions of their efficacy and fairness vary substantially.

 

[mhughes0021]

c'mon, this is clear overreacting to a tweet and reading into it what you want to read. The point isn't whether he was able to follow through with it or not, the point is that it happened and it's not an isolated incident. These attacks are happening pretty regularly in Europe, no matter how much the press downplays them.

Then Europe should build a wall! Its a proven fact that people cant go below, thru or over walls. Buld that wall and all those bad sand hombres are fucked.

 

[dubbsco]

Whoops, Trump just claimed crime rate is highest that its been in 45 years...

But like everything else in this clown show. He lied.
http://time.com/4663050/president-trump-murder-rate-claim/

 

[tomdalton22]

Tinsel, as someone who works in education and has at all levels, saying "don't sweat it" is misguided. If she does what she says and puts a new focus on these private and charter schools, lots of money will be going away from state funded schools to those private ones.

The bigger scare is that she had NO CLUE what the ADA was.

maybe that's a good thing...it seems like a lot of the public school systems around the country are doing a shitty job.

 

[Gulo Blue]

Angell Hall... never noticed or thought about the blatant 1st Amendment issue (religion necessary?!) before.

For those unfamiliar, it's from the Northwest Ordinance, which is considered to be the piece of legislation that drove the establishment of the Catholepistemiad of Michigania.

 

[Gulo Blue]

What is that a picture of? The State House of Ohio?

Ha!

 

[Michchamp]

maybe that's a good thing...it seems like a lot of the public school systems around the country are doing a shitty job.

that's by design.

 

[Michchamp]

For those unfamiliar, it's from the Northwest Ordinance, which is considered to be the piece of legislation that drove the establishment of the Catholepistemiad of Michigania.

neat.

 

[Gulo Blue]

My understanding is that wealthy public school are as good as or better than wealthy charter schools while poor charter schools outperform poor public schools and the argument is over how much of the poor charter schools' performance is over getting some say in who attends vs. other factors (run better/they actually work, more engaged parents...)

 

[sggatecl]

maybe that's a good thing...it seems like a lot of the public school systems around the country are doing a shitty job.

A large part of that is due to lack of funding. Taking away more funding doesn't seem like a remedy to me.

It's no coincidence that if you look at districts with higher local taxes, you'll find schools that test/grade better than average. You get what you pay for.

 

[sggatecl]

Whoops, Trump just claimed crime rate is highest that its been in 45 years...

But like everything else in this clown show. He lied.
http://time.com/4663050/president-trump-murder-rate-claim/

 

[tinselwolverine]

A large part of that is due to lack of funding. Taking away more funding doesn't seem like a remedy to me.

It's no coincidence that if you look at districts with higher local taxes, you'll find schools that test/grade better than average. You get what you pay for.

Nice.

So what good is the federal government doing in ANY of this?

 

[sggatecl]

Nice.

So what good is the federal government doing in ANY of this?

The bulk of the federal government's role in K-12 education lies within Title I (poor districts) and IDEA (kids with disabilities). Anything beyond that falls to the state and local governments. I think the number in which federal government contributes is around 10%~ of all funding of a state's education budget.

K-12 responsibility has always been left to the states primarily, pretty sure it's in the Constitution but I'm not sure. So to answer your question, unless Devos makes some sweeping changes to some long standing laws, not much (on the K-12 level that is).

 

[Spartanmack]

A large part of that is due to lack of funding. Taking away more funding doesn't seem like a remedy to me.

It's no coincidence that if you look at districts with higher local taxes, you'll find schools that test/grade better than average. You get what you pay for.

that's not really true. There at 839 school districts in Michigan and the Detroit Public Schools rank 43rd (top 5%) in per pupil funding (from all sources) - higher than affluent communities like Birmingham (44th), Grosse Pointe (80th) and West Bloomfield (105th). I doubt any of those less well funded districts were even close to as bad as the Detroit public schools.

http://mdoe.state.mi.us/SAMSStatusReports/Others/b1014_16 FINAL.pdf

 

[sggatecl]

that's not really true. There at 839 school districts in Michigan and the Detroit Public Schools rank 43rd (top 5%) in per pupil funding (from all sources) - higher than affluent communities like Birmingham (44th), Grosse Pointe (80th) and West Bloomfield (105th). I doubt any of those less well funded districts were even close to as bad as the Detroit public schools.

http://mdoe.state.mi.us/SAMSStatusReports/Others/b1014_16 FINAL.pdf

I don't think using a (corrupt) city that recently declared bankruptcy because it can't manage it's finances is a fair example. But I will concede that there are exceptions, especially when misplaced/misallocated funds due to error/greed have been known to take place.

I would be willing to bet that when plotted on a graph, while it obviously won't be sloped perfectly, the data would support my comments. If I have time later, I might try to make one. Data is beautiful.