Religion in politics

[Gulo Blue]

Good for them. It's definitely much better PR to just have isolated atrocities rather than all out wars, maybe they learned their lesson from the Crusades.

It also helps that all countries that have declared Christianity it's official (or state) religion aren't in a position to go war mongering.

Who is in a position to go war mongering?

 

[tinselwolverine]

I believe there may be a higher power. I just think organized religion is awful and I have no interest in it.

Requesting guidance from a higher power is a fundamental tenet of 12-step addiction recovery.

Some observers claim that the 12 step program is itself a de facto religion.

I don't know that any countries have ever gone to war in the name of the 12 step program, however.

 

[Michchamp]

aren't the wars prosecuted in the name of religion (particularly christianity) in the past enough to discredit it forever? I mean, it's not like that was a separate religion, right? you can't claim thousands of years of religious tradition, but selectively disavow any connection to the past only when it suits you.

well, you CAN, I suppose, but that hurts your credibility... and people that care about things like honesty, consistency, & integrity won't follow you.

and for the record, you can probably chalk up a large part of the persecutions, massacres, and takings from native peoples around the world, including America, over the last 250 years to religion. at least religion was one of the major reasons used to justify fucking those people over. they were "heathens" "savages" (insert slur here) and therefore their lives and rights were not valid.

 

[byco42]

aren't the wars prosecuted in the name of religion (particularly christianity) in the past enough to discredit it forever? I mean, it's not like that was a separate religion, right? you can't claim thousands of years of religious tradition, but selectively disavow any connection to the past only when it suits you.

well, you CAN, I suppose, but that hurts your credibility... and people that care about things like honesty, consistency, & integrity won't follow you.

and for the record, you can probably chalk up a large part of the persecutions, massacres, and takings from native peoples around the world, including America, over the last 250 years to religion. at least religion was one of the major reasons used to justify fucking those people over. they were "heathens" "savages" (insert slur here) and therefore their lives and rights were not valid.

*STALKS OUT OF THE ROOM*

 

[Michchamp]

"The Crusades? The Thirty Years War? Inquisition? Counter-reformation? Centuries of oppressing native peoples while paying lip service to 'christianizing' them? No no no, that was a different catholic church. We're new. We haven't done anything like that. We're the flawless representation of God's omnipotent, benevolent authority on Earth. You should listen to us!"

-signed,
late 20th/early 21st century apologists for the disappearing, and increasingly irrelevent catholic church

 

[byco42]

"The Crusades? The Thirty Years War? Inquisition? Counter-reformation? Centuries of oppressing native peoples while paying lip service to 'christianizing' them? No no no, that was a different catholic church. We're new. We haven't done anything like that. We're the flawless representation of God's omnipotent, benevolent authority on Earth. You should listen to us!"

-signed,
late 20th/early 21st century apologists for the disappearing, and increasingly irrelevent catholic church

We are not all that interested in hearing the transcripts of the shower arguments you stage.

 

[Gulo Blue]

aren't the wars prosecuted in the name of religion (particularly christianity) in the past enough to discredit it forever? I mean, it's not like that was a separate religion, right? you can't claim thousands of years of religious tradition, but selectively disavow any connection to the past only when it suits you.

well, you CAN, I suppose, but that hurts your credibility... and people that care about things like honesty, consistency, & integrity won't follow you.

and for the record, you can probably chalk up a large part of the persecutions, massacres, and takings from native peoples around the world, including America, over the last 250 years to religion. at least religion was one of the major reasons used to justify fucking those people over. they were "heathens" "savages" (insert slur here) and therefore their lives and rights were not valid.

Crazy talk.

Try applying your line of thinking to anything other than religion that's been pushed to go to war.

 

[Michchamp]

We are not all that interested in hearing the transcripts of the shower arguments you stage.

not my shower arguments, but the shower arguments of everyone else who posts here are okay?

 

[Michchamp]

Crazy talk.

Try applying your line of thinking to anything other than religion that's been pushed to go to war.

just taking issue with the argument that religion wasnt the cause of any war in the past 250 years, which is false.

 

[Gulo Blue]

just taking issue...

Just taking issue...and expressing it with batshit crazy talk.

 

[byco42]

just taking issue with the argument that religion wasnt the cause of any war in the past 250 years, which is false.

Religion is not the cause of war. It has never caused a war. The primary cause of war is fear.

 

[Thumb]

Religion is not the cause of war. It has never caused a war. The primary cause of war is fear.

History disagrees with you.

EDIT: I guess this was addressed already, but for some reason someone is still insisting the bolded part. *shrug*

 

[byco42]

History disagrees with you.

EDIT: I guess this was addressed already, but for some reason someone is still insisting the bolded part. *shrug*

Fear is the root cause of all wars. And there's a lot of research that demonstrates the Crusades were waged to blunt Muslim aggression on Christian territory, and to free enslaved Christians. If you want to attempt to inject 21st-century social and cultural mores on 12th-century men, good luck.

 

[Gulo Blue]

Fear is the root cause of all wars. And there's a lot of research that demonstrates the Crusades were waged to blunt Muslim aggression on Christian territory, and to free enslaved Christians. If you want to attempt to inject 21st-century social and cultural mores on 12th-century men, good luck.

Typically, power drives the elite to use fear to drive the masses to war.

 

[byco42]

Typically, power drives the elite to use fear to drive the masses to war.

And what are the powerful afraid of? "We must not have a mine-shaft gap!" or sentiments to that effect.

 

[Michchamp]

Typically, power drives the elite to use fear to drive the masses to war.

is this one of those situations where aggression from an Islamic nation/Muslim person is a sign that Islam and its adherents are particularly violent, but if a Christian nation/individual commits an aggressive act, well the religion was just a cover for ulterior motives?

 

[Gulo Blue]

is this one of those situations where aggression from an Islamic nation/Muslim person is a sign that Islam and its adherents are particularly violent, but if a Christian nation/individual commits an aggressive act, well the religion was just a cover for ulterior motives?

What do you think?

Have I ever said anything that would suggest I'd go that route?

 

[Gulo Blue]

If you're going to stereotype me, stereotype me as Catholic.

http://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/p...hy-he-doesnt-discuss-islamic-violence-n620551

Pope Francis said he doesn't like singling out violence carried out by Muslims because people of all religions are guilty of deadly crimes.

 

[sggatecl]

Who here is surprised a thread about religion has turned into an argument of why Christianity is better/more peaceful than others? Yeah, not me.

I was however impressed to see someone mention the Crusades as little more than Europe 'blunting Muslim aggression' and to free some slaves. How foolish of history to think that Christians would actually go to war over their religion! I'm sure someone will eventually show..err..mention 'research' that shows the Inquisition was just a way to root out pedophiles, rapist, and murderers but had nothing to do with religion.

 

[sggatecl]

If you're going to stereotype me, stereotype me as Catholic.

http://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/p...hy-he-doesnt-discuss-islamic-violence-n620551

He has been a breath of fresh air when it comes to religious leaders. Will be sad when he passes.