The Official MSU vs ][V][ichigan Game Thread

[tinselwolverine]

I agree, no Spartan or anyone else should never accuse Bo of not winning a National Championship - because he never won one. But like Tinsel intimated, Bo seems to have the right attitude about what was basically a meaningless title so even if a Spartan, or someone else did, Bo probably wouldn't care - unless he was just saying that because he couldn't win one.

In either his last or one of his last year as the Michigan coach, I heard Bo?s wife Millie on a radio interview saying that she thought maybe Bo secretly wanted to win a national championship, but he just didn?t wanna say it-so who knows?

In his last game as the Michigan coach, a Rose Bowl against USC, there was some talk that were Michigan to win that game, the coaches would change their vote and award him the national championship, not entirely unlike what happened with Tom Osborne in 1997.

But keeping with tradition, Bo went ahead and lost the Rose Bowl that year.

So we?ll never know.

 

[hungry]

Come on man, are you really criticizing me for looking up and presenting facts to back up my arguments? I admit it - I didn't know Meyer's exact records year by year but I did know it didn't take him 3 years to rebuild. I also didn't know the exact number of B1G championship games or how many Wisconsin has played in, but I knew they played in more than half of them. I also didn't know how many years PSU has been in the B1G but I knew they didn't have many championships. I like to back up what I say with facts, so I actually looked them up and presented them.

Of course MC has presented none, but you're making an ass of yourself trying to defend his obviously wrong theory. I suppose I could just post my opinion mixed in with an intentional misspelling of Harbaugh - that seems to be the type of argument you find most persuasive.



I do have a theory for why MSU has fallen on hard times, we discuss it all the time on the MSU board. But it's not relevant or needed in order to prove what you and mc have said here is wrong. But since you keep asking, I think it's because he can't consistently recruit 4 and 5 star kids and the model of recruiting under the radar talent 3 stars or coaching up lesser talent isn't a sustainable model for consistent success. I think he's lost some really good assistants and replaced them with busts that he refuses to fire.There are a number of other things we can't know that can be contributing factors, but those seem like the biggest issues to me - it's why I think he is a good but not great coach. It's also possible that he's lost interest or the game has passed him by.

I also think it's asinine to say that a good coach's success isn't legitimate because it's not sustained.The Red Wings don't win the Cup every year, in fact right now they suck - but no one would say their success from the mid 90s to about '07 was because their competitors were "blowing up". It's an incorrect and obviously indefensible argument and you're acting as if saying it makes it a fact that needs to be disproved and then when it is disproved by facts, you say it wasn't disproved because his success wasn't sustained. That's just dumb. It's also got nothing to do with the actual argument - the fact that he's not having success now does nothing to prove the assertion that the only reason he had success was because his top 4 competitors were down.



Finally you got something right - assuming you're being sarcastic about him righting the ship but given your track record, I don't want to assume anything.

Now I remember the 4th team! It is Illinois!! You know! The team with Brandon Peters. How could I forget?

Seriously, though, this isn't even MChamp's or my argument. This is the same thing that they were talking about in the studio immediately after Michigan destroyed MSU. I'm sure you were probably tired of football at that point, but those guys were making excuses for Dantonio and saying that the rise of Michigan and Penn State, the stronger than ever Ohio State program (their words, because let's face it, they've pretty much always been good, but they weren't blowing out everyone by 30,) and the rise of certain other programs like Cincinnati, just darn near make it impossible for Dantonio to succeed at Michigan State.

I disagreed with them and still disagree with them. The fall of Dantonio and MSU came from inside the program. The ol' "it's just too hard to get 4 and 5 star recruits to go to MSU" is a bunch of crap and it's just a failure of Dantonio to recruit, not something inherent in the program or the location.

 

[hungry]

3 and 2 is not a bad start. Would have been 4 and 2 if not for a muffed punt and a lame brained Australian punter not just falling on the ball or throwing the ball out of bounds. Does Sparty think their team will tie it up next year? I don't. I see 4 and 2 next year, and then 5 and 2 the year after that.....

Bad math, bro. It would be 4-1 without the "trouble with the snap." MSU would have never won the big 10 that year and they most certainly wouldn't have made the playoffs to get blown out 42-0.

Let's not forget, it's 2 in a row and the most recent one was a blow-out and MSU is getting worse next year (losing 7 of 11 starters on that shitty defense) and Michigan will most likely be better next season.

 

[hungry]

"might" have been - we still get the ball inside the 40 with time on the clock and near game-winning FG range. But as I'm sure you recall, it wasn't.

no, I don't think we will win next year, but again that's got nothing to do with what we're talking about.

Michigan would've got the ball right about the 40 with about 6 seconds left. I doubt very much they hit a 57 yard fg or hit a hail-mary, but I guess there might've been a chance. The way it went down was a fluke. Only MSU fans would think it wasn't.

 

[hungry]

There was a AP and a UPI champion. You don?t understand. Those NCs are as valid as the ones now, and no one disputed them they way they are disputed now.

Also, there was a Big Ten no-repeat rule for the RB until 1975-76. And no Big Ten team was eligible for any other bowl but the Rose Bowl until that season.

USC (3) and ND (3) won a combined six AP (writers?) poll from 1950 to 2010. #research

This guy probably doesn't even realize that Bo went undefeated and tied with Ohio State, only to get voted out of the Rose Bowl by MSU.

 

[hungry]

I?ve been through all the iterations of determining a National Champion, and none of them were more compelling than the Pre-BCS era.



So, like, Tinsel intimated, no Spartan, then, should never accuse Bo of not winning a National Championship.



The writers and the coaches generally got it right and no one cared that they often picked different teams. Now a select board and ?technology? picks four teams and the consternation is more distracting than the actual teams selected.

Yep. I agree Byco.

The way the national championships were decided pre-BCS were the best and I won't feel any differently until they start the 8 team play-off. Anything in between is just a complete joke and they make it more about the process than the games. It's all about junk shows to get commercial money now. Tune in this tuesday to see who we think is in the top 4 this week!!!

I think most people think that the NCAA is a corrupt, money grubbing institution, so why should we all of a sudden care that they only recognize certain national championships?

 

[byco42]

In either his last or one of his last year as the Michigan coach, I heard Bo?s wife Millie on a radio interview saying that she thought maybe Bo secretly wanted to win a national championship, but he just didn?t wanna say it-so who knows?

In his last game as the Michigan coach, a Rose Bowl against USC, there was some talk that were Michigan to win that game, the coaches would change their vote and award him the national championship, not entirely unlike what happened with Tom Osborne in 1997.

But keeping with tradition, Bo went ahead and lost the Rose Bowl that year.

So we?ll never know.

The holding call on the fake punt still gets me. Chris Stapleton could have been a household name. But Jim Hemmerling had other ideas.

 

[byco42]

This guy probably doesn't even realize that Bo went undefeated and tied with Ohio State, only to get voted out of the Rose Bowl by MSU.

Bert Smith. A Michigan Grad who became the MSU AD. A traitor?s-traitor. The no-repeat rule had just been rescinded, otherwise Michigan would have gone outright. Bo believed that Big Ten Commissioner Wayne Duke was orchestrating an OSU outcome.

 

[thewolverines24]

Power 5 versus Power 5. FCS teams on a schedule disqualifies from consideration.

On a schedule? Care to elaborate?

FBS basically does nothing that matters from Thanksgiving weekend until Jan 1. I feel like they could squeeze in a 12 team playoff.

FCS starts their playoff on Nov 30 this year and it's done on Jan 11. That's with the semi-finals occurring on Dec 21. So they get in a 24 team playoff with a 3 week break between the semis and the championship.

FBS can't do that because?

 

[GoBlueInAtlanta]

On a schedule? Care to elaborate?

FBS basically does nothing that matters from Thanksgiving weekend until Jan 1. I feel like they could squeeze in a 12 team playoff.

FCS starts their playoff on Nov 30 this year and it's done on Jan 11. That's with the semi-finals occurring on Dec 21. So they get in a 24 team playoff with a 3 week break between the semis and the championship.

FBS can't do that because?

I took that to mean that if an FBS team has an FCS team on their schedule that disqualifies them from the playoff. And I agree.

 

[thewolverines24]

I took that to mean that if an FBS team has an FCS team on their schedule that disqualifies them from the playoff. And I agree.

Ah ok. Thanks for clarifying!

Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk

 

[rumseyhouse77]

Bad math, bro. It would be 4-1 without the "trouble with the snap." MSU would have never won the big 10 that year and they most certainly wouldn't have made the playoffs to get blown out 42-0.

Let's not forget, it's 2 in a row and the most recent one was a blow-out and MSU is getting worse next year (losing 7 of 11 starters on that shitty defense) and Michigan will most likely be better next season.

Yes, please see post 346.

 

[Spartanmack]

Michigan would've got the ball right about the 40 with about 6 seconds left. I doubt very much they hit a 57 yard fg or hit a hail-mary, but I guess there might've been a chance. The way it went down was a fluke. Only MSU fans would think it wasn't.

Michigan State would have gotten the ball with enough time to run a play for the endzone or possibly 1 to the sideline for FG range. Sure, the odds would have been against them but before that snap, the odds were against them and they still won. Nobody said it wasn't a crazy play. Only a uofm fan would boil that game down to 1 play and say MSU didn't play well enough to win.

 

[byco42]

Well, had Brown been called for tripping Howard or Stewart been called for holding Larry Foote, that’s at least one more W for M.

 

[Spartanmack]

Well, had Brown been called for tripping Howard or Stewart been called for holding Larry Foote, that?s at least one more W for M.

not if the refs didn't miss calling Howard out of bounds on the earlier TD.