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Tigers sign SP Mike Pelfry and release him 3/30/2017

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So, what is your THAC0?

Wait, we're off that now, it is all about the buff/debuff skill-monkey.

For me looking at stats too much feels like work, and I'm not really into doing that.

My point was is we don't change. I remember about 15 years ago, I was 35. Some kid said If I'm (talking about himself) still playing games when I'm your age its over, or something similar. My response was if you're playing games at 15 you're going to play games at 50.

Not any different when it comes to baseball. Stats and baseball go hand in hand and it's what we are.
 
My point was is we don't change. I remember about 15 years ago, I was 35. Some kid said If I'm (talking about himself) still playing games when I'm your age its over, or something similar. My response was if you're playing games at 15 you're going to play games at 50.

Not any different when it comes to baseball. Stats and baseball go hand in hand and it's what we are.


You should've responded, only if you live right will you still be playing at 50.

As for stats and baseball, no you are right, but the stats are a on PEDs compared to how they were 20 years ago.

Not my trip.

Also, that is why I have limited patience for some of the new table top variants, too involved for me. I do have other things to think about.
 
My father started playing Stratomatic in the last 60's, early 70s at the age of around 40. He played variations, including Tony Larussa's Computer game up until his death at age 70. It was the statistics which drew him to playing the game for 30 years. It was statistics that he and I talked about all those years. I have been studying statistics for over 40 years and it is the basis for my discussion with my brother, my sons, my nephews and my friends when it comes to baseball. Not all of them have the same passions as I do and I do not condemn them for it. We each enjoy the game of baseball each in our own way.

We get you cannot stand advance baseball metrics and that it is too sophisticated for you to comprehend.

"We mock what we don't understand."
 
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My father started playing Stratomatic in the last 60's, early 70s at the age of around 40. He played variations, including Tony Larussa's Computer game up until his death at age 70. It was the statistics which drew him to playing the game for 30 years. It was statistics that he and I talked about all those years. I have been studying statistics for over 40 years and it is the basis for my discussion with my brother, my sons, my nephews and my friends when it comes to baseball. Not all of them have the same passions as I do and I do not condemn them for it. We each enjoy the game of baseball each in our own way.

We get you cannot stand advance baseball metrics and that it is too sophisticated for you the comprehend.

"We mock what we don't understand."

LOL what a condescending douche post ....we have proven time and time again " your " way fails more often than not .
 
Micro-league baseball was a favorite of mine "that ball had eyes." Lol. And Earl Weaver baseball. They obviously didn't have really stats so with the Encyclopedia of baseball my best friend and I would go through and look at the best seasons for all teams and input, by hand, all these players into the commodore database before we played. Then after each at bat, we wrote down what happened on paper. Best thing ever.
 
My father started playing Stratomatic in the last 60's, early 70s at the age of around 40. He played variations, including Tony Larussa's Computer game up until his death at age 70. It was the statistics which drew him to playing the game for 30 years. It was statistics that he and I talked about all those years. I have been studying statistics for over 40 years and it is the basis for my discussion with my brother, my sons, my nephews and my friends when it comes to baseball. Not all of them have the same passions as I do and I do not condemn them for it. We each enjoy the game of baseball each in our own way.

We get you cannot stand advance baseball metrics and that it is too sophisticated for you the comprehend.

"We mock what we don't understand."

Hahahaha!
Nice, that is a Spies Like US quote, Dan Aykroyd before he sucked.

Funny, funny stuff.

I could dig in to the stats if I wanted to.* I've the education and intellectual tool set to do it, even very advanced stuff (I'm not a theoretical physicist or mathematician but I did stay in a few Holiday Inns). I just am not looking for too much of that that sort of thinking in baseball, also I think the game is too complex for math.

You are into stats, that is great, BUT you know, there is the rest of the world, right? Like, if you're autistic, that is cool, but just because the whole world isn't like you, that doesn't make the world better or worse than you or vice versa. Difference is just difference.

Obviously, the notion that one kind of thinking is the be all end all of intelligence (especially when that kind is the kind one likes best) is one of the clearest signs of idiocy.

Here is a better quote from the movie:
"Did you hear that?"
"Yeah, it's a dickfer."
"What's a dickfer?"
"tapeewith."

My issue with the use of stats, and many others is that you often fail to contextualize them with either other stats or their significance (A), and along with that (B) they are cherry picked ass hell.

Here is a good quote for you:
Chapter I — The One Thing Needful
“NOW, what I want is, Facts. Teach these boys and girls nothing but Facts. Facts alone are wanted in life. Plant nothing else, and root out everything else. You can only form the minds of reasoning animals upon Facts: nothing else will ever be of any service to them. This is the principle on which I bring up my own children, and this is the principle on which I bring up these children. Stick to Facts, sir!”
The scene was a plain, bare, monotonous vault of a schoolroom, and the speaker’s square forefinger emphasized his observations by underscoring every sentence with a line on the schoolmaster’s sleeve. The emphasis was helped by the speaker’s square wall of a forehead, which had his eyebrows for its base, while his eyes found commodious cellarage in two dark caves, overshadowed by the wall. The emphasis was helped by the speaker’s mouth, which was wide, thin, and hard set. The emphasis was helped by the speaker’s voice, which was inflexible, dry, and dictatorial. The emphasis was helped by the speaker’s hair, which bristled on the skirts of his bald head, a plantation of firs to keep the wind from its shining surface, all covered with knobs, like the crust of a plum pie, as if the head had scarcely warehouse-room for the hard facts stored inside. The speaker’s obstinate carriage, square coat, square legs, square shoulders, — nay, his very neckcloth, trained to take him by the throat with an unaccommodating grasp, like a stubborn fact, as it was, — all helped the emphasis.
“In this life, we want nothing but Facts, sir; nothing but Facts!”
The speaker, and the schoolmaster, and the third grown person present, all backed a little, and swept with their eyes the inclined plane of little vessels then and there arranged in order, ready to have imperial gallons of facts poured into them until they were full to the brim.


Mr. Gradgrind eventually learns the failing of his philosophy, as readers knew he would.
Today the failure of his facty approach might not be so easy to take.

Put another way: " Alright. Stop right there... and I'll bring back the sun."
;-P

* Stats aren't really that hard to grasp, very rarely are the beyond the ken of most folk, they are generally just logic. Familiarity with them requires that one be interested in gaining that familiarity in the first place.
 
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Lots of us have made condescending douche post. so what's your point.

I let my .gifs be condescending for me :lmao:

Also, I've loved statistics in EVERY sport since I was a boy. If you want to buy into the theory that more stats became used because of fantasy leagues, then I want to thank whoever created them. More is better, I love it.
 
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Who is "we" and where is all this "proof"?

Cespedes
Kirk Nieuwenhuis
Chris Young
Justin Uptin
Alex Avila
Seth Smith
Ian Kinsler
Omar Infante

Rather have Tyler Collins in left instead of signing Cespedes .

Todd Frazier is a horrible pickup for 7.5 million , but the contract Heyward got was a great pickup ( LMAO )


and thats just off the top of my head
 
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Hahahaha!
Nice, that is a Spies Like US quote, Dan Aykroyd before he sucked.

Funny, funny stuff.

I could dig in to the stats if I wanted to.* I've the education and intellectual tool set to do it, even very advanced stuff (I'm not a theoretical physicist or mathematician but I did stay in a few Holiday Inns). I just am not looking for too much of that that sort of thinking in baseball, also I think the game is too complex for math.

You are into stats, that is great, BUT you know, there is the rest of the world, right? Like, if you're autistic, that is cool, but just because the whole world isn't like you, that doesn't make the world better or worse than you or vice versa. Difference is just difference.

Obviously, the notion that one kind of thinking is the be all end all of intelligence (especially when that kind is the kind one likes best) is one of the clearest signs of idiocy.

Here is a better quote from the movie:
"Did you hear that?"
"Yeah, it's a dickfer."
"What's a dickfer?"
"tapeewith."

My issue with the use of stats, and many others is that you often fail to contextualize them with either other stats or their significance (A), and along with that (B) they are cherry picked ass hell.

Here is a good quote for you:
Chapter I — The One Thing Needful
“NOW, what I want is, Facts. Teach these boys and girls nothing but Facts. Facts alone are wanted in life. Plant nothing else, and root out everything else. You can only form the minds of reasoning animals upon Facts: nothing else will ever be of any service to them. This is the principle on which I bring up my own children, and this is the principle on which I bring up these children. Stick to Facts, sir!”
The scene was a plain, bare, monotonous vault of a schoolroom, and the speaker’s square forefinger emphasized his observations by underscoring every sentence with a line on the schoolmaster’s sleeve. The emphasis was helped by the speaker’s square wall of a forehead, which had his eyebrows for its base, while his eyes found commodious cellarage in two dark caves, overshadowed by the wall. The emphasis was helped by the speaker’s mouth, which was wide, thin, and hard set. The emphasis was helped by the speaker’s voice, which was inflexible, dry, and dictatorial. The emphasis was helped by the speaker’s hair, which bristled on the skirts of his bald head, a plantation of firs to keep the wind from its shining surface, all covered with knobs, like the crust of a plum pie, as if the head had scarcely warehouse-room for the hard facts stored inside. The speaker’s obstinate carriage, square coat, square legs, square shoulders, — nay, his very neckcloth, trained to take him by the throat with an unaccommodating grasp, like a stubborn fact, as it was, — all helped the emphasis.
“In this life, we want nothing but Facts, sir; nothing but Facts!”
The speaker, and the schoolmaster, and the third grown person present, all backed a little, and swept with their eyes the inclined plane of little vessels then and there arranged in order, ready to have imperial gallons of facts poured into them until they were full to the brim.


Mr. Gradgrind eventually learns the failing of his philosophy, as readers knew he would.
Today the failure of his facty approach might not be so easy to take.

Put another way: " Alright. Stop right there... and I'll bring back the sun."
;-P

* Stats aren't really that hard to grasp, very rarely are the beyond the ken of most folk, they are generally just logic. Familiarity with them requires that one be interested in gaining that familiarity in the first place.

What does that really mean?

Runs Created/Per 650 Plate Appearances is used along with On Base Percentage and Slugging Percentage. When available, I use wRC+ (also a runs created stat) and wOBA. I also like to show walk rate. What other stat would contextualize those stats? And why would you even need to contextualize them, unless you were putting them in a park neutral setting, which I do. Or in a base situation (Runners On, Bases Empty, RISP, etc, etc), which most baseball websites offer without much effort.

Statistics are used in most sports. We keep track of plus/minus in hockey, how many block shots in basketball and yards per carry in football. When an announcer regurgitates these stats, we immediately get a sense of how well they performed, or at least in the context of that season or game. Sports like soccer offer very few statistics for the fan to digest, hence why they probably have an issue catching on in the USA. I am sure NASCAR has some statistics, but then again, that is a sport where you cannot just know a driver's stats and be aware of how much better he is against the rest. In baseball, when Miguel Cabrera has an 1.000 OPS, people familiar with the stat immediately recognize the significance. They are not asking themselves in what context did he get that 1.000 OPS or what other stat can you show me that would help digest that 1.000 OPS.
 
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Cespedes
Kirk Nieuwenhuis
Chris Young
Justin Uptin
Alex Avila
Seth Smith
Ian Kinsler
Omar Infante

Rather have Tyler Collins in left instead of signing Cespedes .

Todd Frazier is a horrible pickup for 7.5 million , but the contract Heyward got was a great pickup ( LMAO )


and thats just off the top of my head



So, you got nothing?
 
I don't understand why posters are harassing rebbiv. It seems to be personal? He posts logical statistics to back his claims. There are many ways to look at things. I am old school and use my eyes mostly but he has always added more to the view, which I am open minded about. He has as much right to his opinion as anyone else here and probably brings a lot more to the table with it. It also takes some time to do what he does and I think it adds a great deal of value. I don't always agree with him but I personally want to thank him for expanding my love for the game.
 
I don't understand why posters are harassing rebbiv. It seems to be personal? He posts logical statistics to back his claims. There are many ways to look at things. I am old school and use my eyes mostly but he has always added more to the view, which I am open minded about. He has as much right to his opinion as anyone else here and probably brings a lot more to the table with it. It also takes some time to do what he does and I think it adds a great deal of value. I don't always agree with him but I personally want to thank him for expanding my love for the game.

And to top it off it is coming from a guy who once started a thread calling Miggy a "super cocky dbag" for the way he plays the game. I guess he laughs too much and talks to too many guys during the game. He also has a thread about Johhny Manziel and how the Lions should get him as a back up, defending his actions. Top notch troll IMO. How can people take him seriously??
 
What does that really mean?


It means that stats are only part of the story, as the pros will tell you. The amateurish conversations fans have about stats are not amateurish because of their failure to understand or deploy stats, but because fans only know half the story. The baseball part is far more complex than all the stats in the world can actually capture.

Also, it means that I was hoping you were quoting spies like us to indicate that you don't really take yourself and your stats that seriously.

So, I pulled out the Dickens to show a historical movement surrounding facts often thought of as stats these days.
What did humans do before the invention of statistics? How did we understand the world before numbers ruled our lives as they do today?
 
I don't understand why posters are harassing rebbiv. It seems to be personal? He posts logical statistics to back his claims. There are many ways to look at things. I am old school and use my eyes mostly but he has always added more to the view, which I am open minded about. He has as much right to his opinion as anyone else here and probably brings a lot more to the table with it. It also takes some time to do what he does and I think it adds a great deal of value. I don't always agree with him but I personally want to thank him for expanding my love for the game.

I am personally quoting this post as a reminder to all who just come on here to trollbait a poster and not have any redeeming facts to back up what they have. At this point in time, this excludes JC.

I sit back and read, not just this forum, all of them.
Posters are certainly allowed to have arguments on both sides of the fence on topics as in this instance stats counting and saber. If a poster can only resort to name calling, directly or indirectly as one or two other posters do, that is, only to come on here irregularly to smear a poster and not bring anything else, well ....... as before, you give a person enough rope they will eventually run out and be on the outside looking in.

There are a few posters here who have posted about the high salaries of say Miggy and Verlander, and how it has turned the team into stars and scrubs in the past. I agree to a degree, but also keeps HOF calibre players with the Tigers. Alot of salaries have gone higher recent years because the WAR values are worth more than a few years ago, such as Magglio, etc. I agree to disagree and move on.

All the mods show restraint in the fact it takes alot to 'earn' a ban for short or long durations. But also a few of those posters who have been dealt with in the past and return for some reason after a short time of civility return to the ways that got them in trouble.
As for a 2 way street, I also do not like to see sarcasm from those who are smeared, take the higher ground.
and lastly, I stay in the background most of the time, hoping these things work themselves out. But when posts are reported, and or posters write to me, it means it is creating an uncomfortable place to read about our teams and the majority having to have their eyes read personal attacks, which is the reason for my post.
 
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Or if you're not interested there are other threads to read. That's a great thing about American, we can pick and choose.

Just saying that I can't think of one banning that didn't start with a person differing with rebbivs point of view.

Personally, I'm fine with his postings. But it shouldn't be illegal to differ, which I feel it is sometimes.
 
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