Tigers vs. athletics Game Thread August 29

[Rebbiv]

Drew Sharp is a (sic) idiat (sic). A tweet from today.

Drew Sharp‏@drewsharp
Leyland should consider keeping Hunter in sixth spot in batting order, compensating for Peralta loss.
Worse, some people agreed with him.

"TOTALLY AGREE"

"would you put Infante in the 2 hole? I like the thinking but don't like Andy in the 2."

Some liked the idea but had a question:

"would work except no one capable on the team to bat second"

Some were not that supportive:

"Yeah, ya f**ing moron, let's take away at-bats from a guy who is the team's second best hitter. Just f**king take an acid bath"

"Stick to what you know. Which is criticizing things you don't know about. Dumbest. Idea. Ever. Since the JOA."

Only someone who is ignorant would find this plausible.

 

[Rebbiv]

Dirks' OBP is only 24 points below Hunter's and thats with sporadic playing time.. meaning Hunter doesn't get on base often either, so why not let him do what he does best(drive in runs) in the 6 hole behind the 3 guys with the best chance of getting on base. It doesn't even have to be Dirks batting 2nd, but he has the best OBP of the 6-9 hitters. Dirks' career OBP is .332 while Hunter's is .335. Dirks is not a guy who drives in runs. He hits singles and takes walks and can also steal a base. Those are the guys you want on in front of Cabrera and Fielder. You want the medium power hitters(Hunter, Martinez) behind the bashers to clean up messes they can't at times. Just because Hunter hits .300 doesn't mean hes great at getting on base. As bad as Dirks has been this year, he gets on base almost as well as Torii.

Oops...should have kept reading.

I will address it from the opposite standpoint. You have to have men on in front of you to get RBIs chances, especially RISP.

Last 2 Years Men On
Dirks 340 PA 52 RBI 6.54 PA/RBI
Hunter 521 PA 138 RBI 3.78 PA/RBI

Last 2 Years RISP
Dirks 187 PA 44 RBI 4.25 PA/RBI
Hunter 312 PA 120 RBI 2.60 PA/RBI

% of Men On versus Total Plate Appearances
Dirks 45.8%
Hunter 46.1%

% RISP out of Men On
Dirks 55.0%
Hunter 59.9%

The assumption being made is that somehow batting #6 means more RBI opportunities, which isn't necessarily the case. Additionally, Hunter has seen more RISP from the #2, then Dirks has batting all over the place. Clearly Hunter is better driving in runs, but he will get the same or more opportunities from the #2 spot. There is nothing wrong with HIM driving in Jackson from 2B, then Cabrera or Fielder.

Next. As pointed out, there is a huge difference in getting on base. It isn't just the additional 13-14 times a year. It is the fact that Hunter has a better chance of putting himself into scoring position (.361 Slugging versus .474). Thus allowing Cabrera or Fielder quality RBI chances.

FYI,,,this notion is akin to dropping Victor Martinez from the #5 hole to the #9 hole, to "increase" the opportunities Miggy has when he comes to the plate. Think about that one for a minute.

 

[Rebbiv]

Also, if both Dirks and Hunter each had 508 ABs(like Hunter does) Hunter would only have gotten on base 13 more times through the entire season to this point.
And protection is about more than just giving the guy ahead of you better pitches to hit. It's also about being able to drive in runs that the guy before you fails to.

At Bats??? It is all about Plate Appearances.

 

[Rebbiv]

Some things are hard to prove, and protection is hard to prove. Your theory is well represented and I respect that. However, I think it's all in the numbers. Cabrera may have seen the same number of fastballs and breaking balls or whatever.. but the fact is that more of them were in the strike zone. Less walks shouldn't even his value when those walks are turning into HR's. That theory in the first article is retarded.

Protection is hard to prove, because it doesn't exist. If it did, Fielder would be having a better year this year with Victor hitting behind him, than Delmon Young. Jackson would be having a better year with Hunter hitting behind him, other than Berry/Dirks/Boesch. So on, and so on. Protection, if it did exist, would apply to all hitters, not just the middle of the order hitters. Players that bat 8th in the NL, come to the AL and without a pitcher hitting behind them, basically perform to their career norms.

http://www.sabernomics.com/sabernomics/index.php/2004/09/the-protection-externality-it-doesnt-exist/

 

[Mitchrapp]

Drew Sharp is a (sic) idiat (sic). A tweet from today.

Drew Sharp‏@drewsharp
Leyland should consider keeping Hunter in sixth spot in batting order, compensating for Peralta loss.
Worse, some people agreed with him.

"TOTALLY AGREE"

"would you put Infante in the 2 hole? I like the thinking but don't like Andy in the 2."

Some liked the idea but had a question:

"would work except no one capable on the team to bat second"

Some were not that supportive:

"Yeah, ya f**ing moron, let's take away at-bats from a guy who is the team's second best hitter. Just f**king take an acid bath"

"Stick to what you know. Which is criticizing things you don't know about. Dumbest. Idea. Ever. Since the JOA."

Might be the best response ever. Acid bath :lmao:

 

[kalinecountry]

http://detroit.cbslocal.com/2013/08...s-the-tigers-walk-off-winner-by-torii-hunter/
Dan Dickerson Recaps The Tigers Walk-off Winner By Torii Hunter.
CBSDetroit

Scroll down to bottom of link for Dan's Call on Victor's single and Torii's Walkoff 3 Run Homer.

 

[Thundercats]

Protection is hard to prove, because it doesn't exist. If it did, Fielder would be having a better year this year with Victor hitting behind him, than Delmon Young. Jackson would be having a better year with Hunter hitting behind him, other than Berry/Dirks/Boesch. So on, and so on. Protection, if it did exist, would apply to all hitters, not just the middle of the order hitters. Players that bat 8th in the NL, come to the AL and without a pitcher hitting behind them, basically perform to their career norms.

http://www.sabernomics.com/sabernomics/index.php/2004/09/the-protection-externality-it-doesnt-exist/

your arguments are valid. When I think about it, I'm not even sure why I thought it was a good idea.. might have just been in a argumentative mood.

 

[manchild98]

http://detroit.cbslocal.com/2013/08...s-the-tigers-walk-off-winner-by-torii-hunter/
Dan Dickerson Recaps The Tigers Walk-off Winner By Torii Hunter.
CBSDetroit

Scroll down to bottom of link for Dan's Call on Victor's single and Torii's Walkoff 3 Run Homer.

That was worth the wait. Great call.

 

[Mitchrapp]

I haven't listened to Dickerson in forever. I might have to more often..