What are Gun Owners Afraid of?

[MAIZEandBLUE09]

I deleted the post because I forgot to quote you. I was going to quote you and then repost it, but I see you could tell that it was for you.

I am pretty sure that the potential looters passed on looting the place when they saw the 30 armed fuckers on the ground. I doubt that they even noticed that uzi fucker on the roof.

Either way, the gun was used to protect the stores and THAT is it's intended use in our society. No matter how infrequent the need for them is.

 

[redandguilty]

Ok, then you disagree but my comment from before is right in line with what I'm saying now and despite what you tried to imply, isn't hypocritical.

No. I still think the M&B that understands the performance advantages of assault weapons needs to go tell the other M&B why it would make a difference in a massacre because that guy thinks it would make absolutely no difference at all. He's absolutely certain.

 

[tinselwolverine]

Either way, the gun was used to protect the stores and THAT is it's intended use in our society. No matter how infrequent the need for them is.

Very few people are talking about not allowing 99% of the guns those guys had.

 

[tinselwolverine]

No. I still think the M&B that understands the performance advantages of assault weapons needs to go tell the other M&B why it would make a difference in a massacre because that guy think it would make absolutely no difference at all. He's absolutely certain.

For the record, he did later concede to be only 99.9% certain.

 

[redandguilty]

For the record, he did later concede to be only 99.9% certain.

That's right...you talked him down from 100%.

 

[TheVictors]

noter dame sucks

 

[MAIZEandBLUE09]

No. I still think the M&B that understands the performance advantages of assault weapons needs to go tell the other M&B why it would make a difference in a massacre because that guy thinks it would make absolutely no difference at all. He's absolutely certain.

It wouldn't because in a classroom full of unarmed children, the difference between kill 20 with an assault rifle and killing 20 with a shotgun is a matter of seconds. Unless there is someone else armed in that scenario, those seconds are to no advantage to the unarmed people, especially kids. If you're up against another weapon, those seconds are all that's needed to kill the assailant.

 

[MAIZEandBLUE09]

Very few people are talking about not allowing 99% of the guns those guys had.

And technically no one is talking about banning Uzi's either. As long as the uzi had a 10 round magazine, our stupid laws consider them a pistol and therefor legal. So you'd still be able to buy the semi-auto form of them. So technically no one's talking about banning any of the weapons in the video's we both posted.

But this is a great example of why banning "assault rifles" is stupid.

 

[redandguilty]

It wouldn't because in a classroom full of unarmed children, the difference between kill 20 with an assault rifle and killing 20 with a shotgun is a matter of seconds. Unless there is someone else armed in that scenario, those seconds are to no advantage to the unarmed people, especially kids. If you're up against another weapon, those seconds are all that's needed to kill the assailant.

Seconds matter when people are hiding and barricading doors.

 

[lostleader]

You all know a shotgun loaded with 00 buck shot is a hell of a lot more deadly in close quarters than any AR. If this lunatic would of been using a Remington 870 loaded with perfectly legal shells the results could of been much worse.

A 00 buck shot shell holds roughly 9 pellets, that are the same size as a 9mm. Maybe not with the precision as an AR, but we are talking less than 25 yards. It won't matter much.

Also like to add there is minimal training need with a shotgun. Just point and shoot. In close quarters like a class room, you'll hit whatever you want and then some.
DC 33

 

[redandguilty]

You all know a shotgun loaded with 00 buck shot is a hell of a lot more deadly in close quarters than any AR. If this lunatic would of been using a Remington 870 loaded with perfectly legal shells the results could of been much worse.

A 00 buck shot shell holds roughly 9 pellets, that are the same size as a 9mm. Maybe not with the precision as an AR, but we are talking less than 25 yards. It won't matter much.

Also like to add there is minimal training need with a shotgun. Just point and shoot. In close quarters like a class room, you'll hit whatever you want and then some.
DC 33

No disagreement here. I'm not arguing that it couldn't have been worse, just that the idea that weapons don't matter is wrong.

 

[Michchamp]

Actually, I would disagree with that. A remington 870 holds 5 shells, and reloading it isnt as easy as slamming a new magazine on it. No way you cause as much carnage in these sorts of situations. For one thing victims have a chance to run or rush the shooter when he reloads

 

[rumseyhouse77]

You all know a shotgun loaded with 00 buck shot is a hell of a lot more deadly in close quarters than any AR. If this lunatic would of been using a Remington 870 loaded with perfectly legal shells the results could of been much worse.

A 00 buck shot shell holds roughly 9 pellets, that are the same size as a 9mm. Maybe not with the precision as an AR, but we are talking less than 25 yards. It won't matter much.

Also like to add there is minimal training need with a shotgun. Just point and shoot. In close quarters like a class room, you'll hit whatever you want and then some.
DC 33

First off, it seems to me that you and M&B09 have put a disturbing amount of careful consideration into the merits of one gun over another for shooting unarmed kindergarteners at close range. Very disturbing.

Second, I believe that Lanza had access to a number of different types of guns including shotguns, but he selected the bushmaster with a high capacity clip. But I am sure if he had put a little more thought into it, like you have, he would have selected one of the shotguns.

Third, there must be reasons that assualt weapons were invented and perfected over the years, and are used by the military. What could those reasons be? Let me make a wild guess that they were invented and perfected for use in military assualt situations where having a reliable, light weight, yet powerful, weapon that can kill as many of the enemy as possible in the shortest amount of time were important considerations.

 

[MAIZEandBLUE09]

Seconds matter when people are hiding and barricading doors.

Not in 2 one room classrooms. Once he's in the door everyone is dead. Hiding under a desk is pointless.

 

[rumseyhouse77]

Not in 2 one room classrooms. Once he's in the door everyone is dead. Hiding under a desk is pointless.

Yeah, I remember when I was in grade school we practiced getting under our desks and covering our heads in case the Russkies decided to drop a nuclear bomb on us. Pointless! They should have just given us extra recess time!

 

[redandguilty]

Not in 2 one room classrooms. Once he's in the door everyone is dead. Hiding under a desk is pointless.

He could have been limited to just 1 room then.

 

[MAIZEandBLUE09]

No disagreement here. I'm not arguing that it couldn't have been worse, just that the idea that weapons don't matter is wrong.

Weapons do matter, just not in that situation.

 

[MAIZEandBLUE09]

He could have been limited to just 1 room then.

How so? The kids weren't running, they hid. He could have walked into any room and just found a bunch of kids hiding. It wouldn't matter.

 

[MAIZEandBLUE09]

Actually, I would disagree with that. A remington 870 holds 5 shells, and reloading it isnt as easy as slamming a new magazine on it. No way you cause as much carnage in these sorts of situations. For one thing victims have a chance to run or rush the shooter when he reloads

One of the 8 year olds rushing an armed shooter? Right.....

 

[redandguilty]

How so? The kids weren't running, they hid. He could have walked into any room and just found a bunch of kids hiding. It wouldn't matter.

Not the kids, the teachers. Some of them took action and saved lives in spite of your 99.9% certainty.