Iglasias fight

[biggunsbob]

Look I really like Iggy a lot. But we are all lying to ourselves if you don't think he is all about the flash SOMETIMES. We all know he is a hot dog. Its ok for guys to call each other out on a MLB team. We need more vocal leaders. I Guess McCann hates losing more.. Heck I do not know but I like that fire in him... He is much better then Alex right now.. Looks like AA is freaking shot right now..

 

[Rebbiv]

Look I really like Iggy a lot. But we are all lying to ourselves if you don't think he is all about the flash SOMETIMES. We all know he is a hot dog. Its ok for guys to call each other out on a MLB team. We need more vocal leaders. I Guess McCann hates losing more.. Heck I do not know but I like that fire in him... He is much better then Alex right now.. Looks like AA is freaking shot right now..

NOTE: This isn't all directed against you Bob.


Whether or not Iggy needed to be called out isn't really being debated. It was the time and place and especially by a rookie.

Secondly, McCann is great hitting against LHP, that's it. He does not walk and he is the worst Tiger at grounding into double plays. He calls a horrid game. Throwing out runners is a small aspect of being a catcher. Heck, most will tell you you steal on the pitcher, not on the catcher. But that is another debate.

McCann is 25. At that age, most ballplayers are what they are.



2012-2014

vs LHP .277 BAVG .345 OBP .408 SLG .753 OPS 11.8 PA/BB .311 BABIP

vs RHP .268 BAVG .306 OBP .372 SLG .678 OPS 26.0 PA/BB .325 BABIP

Away .272 BAVG .314 OBP .380 SLG .694 OPS 20.1 PA/BB .319 BABIP


2015

vs LHP .371 BAVG .409 OBP .645 SLG 1.054 OPS 17.0 PA/BB .465 BABIP

vs RHP .263 BAVG .291 OBP .366 SLG .657 OPS 29.1 PA/BB .318 BABIP

Away .280 BAVG .323 OBP .398 SLG .721 OPS 18.3 PA/BB .348 BABIP

McCann's stats against LHP in 2015 is unrepeatable, just by looking at the BABIP. His walk rate is atrocious, which indicates inability to maintain any positive growth. 2015 just might be his "career" year, because there isn't much growth in 25 year old players. His 2016 numbers will regress just on any normal data against LHP.

McCann is by all accounts having a very good year, in particular batting against LHP. But let's not get carried away. He is not better than Avila defensively and certainly not better against RHP.

 

[biggunsbob]

We all know McCann is the next coming of Johnny Bench but It appears we have no other catcher in the system that will hit the club soon. Pina has a great arm but been around minor league teams since 2008. Gonzalez's has also been around since 2008.. He stinks.. He know Halladay is just fodder.. I guess there is Green at AA.. But he us unexciting.. I did not look at west Michigan as any player there is a few years away.

I have always liked Alex but he is far and removed from the All-star season he had.. Alex does call a decent game but to me he appears a shell of his all-star season.. Numbers aside Alex looks like a platoon player right now as he has only 3 hits in 29 at bats verses LHP.. His .348 OBP is really his only good stat verses RHP.. 21 hits in 107 at bats (132 PA) verses RHP just will not cut it.. Hopefully he can regroup and be better next season..

 

[Thundercats]

Avila is horrendous offensively. Im not going to get excited about a decent OBP from my number 7 or 8 hitter, because there is nobody behind him to drive him in.. and from first base, no less. I'll take extra base potential with a slightly lower OBP all day long. OBP is most valuable at the top of the order. If you're a slow ass runner on first base, what good is he when we have no pop at the bottom or even top of our order? I'm not saying McCann is an all-star or even good player. I think he is superior to Avila overall at this point. His game calling will improve with big league experience. If it doesn't, we go out and get a replacement. Avila can't be trusted to stay in the lineup due to health concerns, and also because he has regressed quickly at the plate every year.

 

[gotime909]

Avila is horrendous offensively. Im not going to get excited about a decent OBP from my number 7 or 8 hitter, because there is nobody behind him to drive him in.. and from first base, no less. I'll take extra base potential with a slightly lower OBP all day long. OBP is most valuable at the top of the order. If you're a slow ass runner on first base, what good is he when we have no pop at the bottom or even top of our order? I'm not saying McCann is an all-star or even good player. I think he is superior to Avila overall at this point. His game calling will improve with big league experience. If it doesn't, we go out and get a replacement. Avila can't be trusted to stay in the lineup due to health concerns, and also because he has regressed quickly at the plate every year.

This

 

[Mitchrapp]

So how does McCann .287 OBP vs RHP fit into that? If no ones driving in Avila and his higher OBP how are they driving in McCann. Be truthful here, you only look at his average overall, eh? It's okay.. Plus Alex is the better catcher.

Superior? Hardly, inferior. Look at the numbers..

 

[Thundercats]

So how does McCann .287 OBP vs RHP fit into that? If no ones driving in Avila and his higher OBP how are they driving in McCann. Be truthful here, you only look at his average overall, eh? It's okay.. Plus Alex is the better catcher.

Superior? Hardly, inferior. Look at the numbers..

No, I look at everything, including health. In the future, I'd rather have a young guy capable of hitting a little bit instead of striking out every time with a few walks mixed in. Alex is the better catcher, but once again, we're comparing 6 years of experience to less than 1. You Avila supporters fail to realize that Avila is only useful against RHP, and that's when he's healthy. Yeah, let's go ahead and give him the job over a young guy capable of making his starts and improving. Some of you need to realize that drawing a walk sometimes isn't what's best for a team, especially batting in front of poor hitters. Avila is batting behind our best hitters, where we should have guys who can drive the ball and make steady contact. Avila can do neither anymore. Yeah, that .348 OBP against RHP is not even good, especially when he's slugging less than .300. That's a .647 OPS from his "good" side of the plate, and .374 against LHP. I believe McCann is .657 against RHP, and 1.054 against LHP. He's better from his "poor" side than Avila is on his "good' side. What the **** more do you people need? Oh yeah, HES A GODDAMN ROOKIE, TOO!! Those are the numbers to look at. So maybe you should take a gander before trying to make a point.

 

[Rebbiv]

Avila is horrendous offensively. Im not going to get excited about a decent OBP from my number 7 or 8 hitter, because there is nobody behind him to drive him in.. and from first base, no less. I'll take extra base potential with a slightly lower OBP all day long. OBP is most valuable at the top of the order. If you're a slow ass runner on first base, what good is he when we have no pop at the bottom or even top of our order? I'm not saying McCann is an all-star or even good player. I think he is superior to Avila overall at this point. His game calling will improve with big league experience. If it doesn't, we go out and get a replacement. Avila can't be trusted to stay in the lineup due to health concerns, and also because he has regressed quickly at the plate every year.

I love your superlatives, but you have nothing to back it up. Nothing. Citing where a player hits isn't his doing, it is the manager's and really is grasping at straws. Just like the fact that Brad has been using him at 1B.

2012-2014 MLB Catchers vs RHP (32 players qualify with 600 PAs)

Avila
7th in OBP
9th in wRC+
10th in wOBA
12th in OPS


2015 vs RHP

wRC+
Avila 90
McCann 78

wOBA
Avila .303
McCann .286

OPS
McCann .657
Avila .648


The following IS NOT excuses, but information regarding Avila. Unlike any Tiger other than Victor batting Left, Avila has an extreme shift on him by all teams. That shift wasn't present to this degree in 2011, his best year.

Avila Batted Balls

Line Drives

2010 = 21.5%
2011 = 21.7%
2012 = 23.8%
2013 = 28.0%
2014 = 25.0%
2015 = 29.3% (McCann 25.3%)

Pull%

2010 = 38.4%
2011 = 33.4%
2012 = 33.7%
2013 = 42.8%
2014 = 52.1%
2015 = 38.6%(McCann 39.5%)The data for 2015 is limited. Although he has been hitting line drives, the results aren't there. Reminds me of Victor's start to 2013. Avila could get it going, but it is rough when he hasn't started more than 3 consecutive games since April.

 

[Rebbiv]

No, I look at everything, including health. In the future, I'd rather have a young guy capable of hitting a little bit instead of striking out every time with a few walks mixed in. Alex is the better catcher, but once again, we're comparing 6 years of experience to less than 1. You Avila supporters fail to realize that Avila is only useful against RHP, and that's when he's healthy. Yeah, let's go ahead and give him the job over a young guy capable of making his starts and improving. Some of you need to realize that drawing a walk sometimes isn't what's best for a team, especially batting in front of poor hitters. Avila is batting behind our best hitters, where we should have guys who can drive the ball and make steady contact. Avila can do neither anymore. Yeah, that .348 OBP against RHP is not even good, especially when he's slugging less than .300. That's a .647 OPS from his "good" side of the plate, and .374 against LHP. I believe McCann is .657 against RHP, and 1.054 against LHP. He's better from his "poor" side than Avila is on his "good' side. What the **** more do you people need? Oh yeah, HES A GODDAMN ROOKIE, TOO!! Those are the numbers to look at. So maybe you should take a gander before trying to make a point.

No we aren't. We have maintained that all along. Your hatred for Avila is second only to Iglesias. You won't look at facts.

So what if McCann is a rookie. He is 25 and there is nothing from his minor league numbers that suggest that he will be anything more than what he is. He isn't "improving". He is what he is. Maybe less next year because he will be hard pressed to repeat the success against LHP.

 

[Thundercats]

No we aren't. We have maintained that all along. Your hatred for Avila is second only to Iglesias. You won't look at facts.

So what if McCann is a rookie. He is 25 and there is nothing from his minor league numbers that suggest that he will be anything more than what he is. He isn't "improving". He is what he is. Maybe less next year because he will be hard pressed to repeat the success against LHP.

I already cited the numbers. McCann has been better vs. both sides than Avila.

 

[gotime909]

No we aren't. We have maintained that all along. Your hatred for Avila is second only to Iglesias. You won't look at facts.

So what if McCann is a rookie. He is 25 and there is nothing from his minor league numbers that suggest that he will be anything more than what he is. He isn't "improving". He is what he is. Maybe less next year because he will be hard pressed to repeat the success against LHP.

Yeah, you're right. A .330/.364/.491/.855 stat line for his last 30 games definitely says he's getting worse.

 

[Rebbiv]

Yeah, you're right. A .330/.364/.491/.855 stat line for his last 30 games definitely says he's getting worse.

And who exactly has he been hitting against? LHP maybe?

 

[Rebbiv]

I already cited the numbers. McCann has been better vs. both sides than Avila.

What are are you talkin bout Willis?

 

[kalinecountry]

I don't like either of our catchers. I think they both have more weaknesses/negatives than positives to their games offensively or defensively. But we're stuck with them.
Lots of talk about Avila's obp which the numbers show is better than General McCann, but he can't run. Avila is nearly as bad as Victor, station to station.
The reason McCann is facing more RHP is because Avila is below the Mendoza line.

This won't go over well with some here, but I wouldn't mind the Tigers letting Avila go and signing or trading for another catcher preferably a lefty bat catcher to platoon with McCann.

But it won't happen.

 

[Rebbiv]

I don't like either of our catchers. I think they both have more weaknesses/negatives than positives to their games offensively or defensively. But we're stuck with them.
Lots of talk about Avila's obp which the numbers show is better than General McCann, but he can't run. Avila is nearly as bad as Victor, station to station.
The reason McCann is facing more RHP is because Avila is below the Mendoza line.

This won't go over well with some here, but I wouldn't mind the Tigers letting Avila go and signing or trading for another catcher preferably a lefty bat catcher to platoon with McCann.

But it won't happen.

There isn't a lot of lefty hitting catchers out there. You could over pay for Wieters or trade for someone like Vogt.

 

[kalinecountry]

There isn't a lot of lefty hitting catchers out there. You could over pay for Wieters or trade for someone like Vogt.

I was thinking Wieters, don't know much about Vogt. The cost would be alot $$ for the first and probably alot in minor leaguers for the other guy.

 

[Mitchrapp]

I prefer to get a whole new full time catcher. In any event, McCann shouldn't get more than 200 or so at bats against LHP. That's assuming he gets better behind the plate. Unfortunately for our catcher needs, getting one is not easy.

Plus, I'll wait until McCann has more than 70 PA before I consider him even in a platoon role..

 

[Mitchrapp]

Btw, 2nd half McCann doesn't have one walk. Not even one lousy walk.

 

[bdemil1]

Mlb commentator

One of the commentators Burns just lambasted Iglesias. Has Iggy been that lazy all year?

 

[tomdalton22]

Btw, 2nd half McCann doesn't have one walk. Not even one lousy walk.

Avila has 6 hits (2 XBH) and 8 walks since the ASB.

McCann has 20 hits (6 XBH) since the ASB

20 hits with 6 XBH > 6 hits and 8 walks