Colin Cowherd : Stafford vs Rodgers

[Mitchrapp]

Give me a break, he had a sore hand. You make it sound like it was busted up bad. In football terms it was barely a scratch. It was a boo boo. But it was bigger than Watt, and AP and all of GB, Dallas, Seattle and Atl. injuries combined? Lol.

 

[LKP]

Give me a break, he had a sore hand. You make it sound like it was busted up bad. In football terms it was barely a scratch. It was a boo boo. But it was bigger than Watt, and AP and all of GB, Dallas, Seattle and Atl. injuries combined? Lol.

It was a huge injury that affected accuracy and strength of throws. Just look at the stats. Stud year at 100.5 rating before the injury. It changed the entire NFL season. Lions were firmly in first place and then Stafford got hurt. Packers get lucky once again.

 

[Mitchrapp]

Or the fact he played better teams. But no, had to be his boo boo. It's not difficult to throw 3 yards..

 

[kalinecountry]

tsk, tsk, smhairftab Shaking my head as I reach for the aspirin bottle.

In the past 15 months while reading and posting the Lions notes, watching and talking more Lions football than I have done since Barry's years,
I have learned for me, quite alot. I still have much to learn and understand about the game, unlike my vast knowledge (modesty to the backseat), of baseball.

But, when I read some posts that defend Lions players in-game or not due to injuries, and the same for the team overall, and comparing to other teams and players I become befuddled and confused.

Being an over the top apologists for players, team personnel and front office, day after day, thread after thread just becomes tiresome for all who read.
A few/some defenses of them are understandable, but with such a large percentage of all other posts 'coming to the defense of everything Lions' makes the person basically an island unto himself,

All of this has turned much that is posted here into baiting/sarcasm/trolling back and forth bomb tossing and it hijacks many threads. The few times I posted to stop or enjoy a time out, it would but then find it in another thread that same day/evening or next day/evening.

It begs the question for Mitch, myself, and any other moderator, what to do.
Recent post(s) here just come off to me as twilight zone and this is from myself, a football light weight, in comparision to most everyone here.
Mitch, after posting with you last night in the private/conference room, and thinking how this has gone downhill after a good return, but only for a short time, even earlier in the season some of the same stuff ; then, with the end of the year losing and out of the playoffs, and back and forth drama/trauma on the board, we need to figure this out and agree to fix for everyone.

There is alot of passion on this board from one end of the positive, to the other end of the negative, regarding Lions players/team. Discussing merits of each is great, until the fantasy world stuff gets it off the tracks.

Mitch, lets hopefully come up with something by the end of the week.

Stepping out for a short time.

 

[LKP]

Packers 113.1 yards per game rushing average since 2011. Lions are 93.7 including 84 yards per game average the last 3 seasons (Packers 113 yards per game). 20 yards per game difference is huge and 30 yards per game the last 3 seasons. Rodgers much more run support. It's proven. Fact. No debate.


Pressure %. Rodgers has had less pressure % every season since 2012. Sometimes by 8-10% less pressure than Stafford. Rodgers much more protection. It's proven. Fact. No debate


Packers defense forced 157 turnovers since 2011. Lions 132. 25 more turnovers forced by Packers defense. This helps the offense. 4 more per season average. Rodgers gets more turnover support. It's proven. Fact. No debate.


Drives starting in opponent territory. 139 for Packers, 95 for Lions since 2011. 44 easier drives for Rodgers. 7.3 more average per season for Packers. Packers have easier drives to go less distance than Lions. Rodgers gets better field position support. It's proven. Fact. No debate.


Weapons. 2011-2013 the Packers had much better weapons. It's been even since 2014 with the Tate/Ebron/Riddick additions.

 

[dubbsco]

"Add JPP and Kawan Short and win the next 3 Super Bowls or more."

You should be banned for a month for this comment alone.

 

[LKP]

"Add JPP and Kawan Short and win the next 3 Super Bowls or more."

You should be banned for a month for this comment alone.

LOL for an opinion. A valid one. You better stop telling people should be banned. That's a total cop out by you.

Ansah, Short, Ngata/Robinson, JPP, Hyder. That would be the best Dline in the league. Good secondary already , solid LBs and good offensive talent with Abdullah, Riddick and Swanson returning.

 

[UMRules06]

Packers 113.1 yards per game rushing average since 2011. Lions are 93.7 including 84 yards per game average the last 3 seasons (Packers 113 yards per game). 20 yards per game difference is huge and 30 yards per game the last 3 seasons. Rodgers much more run support. It's proven. Fact. No debate.


Pressure %. Rodgers has had less pressure % every season since 2012. Sometimes by 8-10% less pressure than Stafford. Rodgers much more protection. It's proven. Fact. No debate


Packers defense forced 157 turnovers since 2011. Lions 132. 25 more turnovers forced by Packers defense. This helps the offense. 4 more per season average. Rodgers gets more turnover support. It's proven. Fact. No debate.


Drives starting in opponent territory. 139 for Packers, 95 for Lions since 2011. 44 easier drives for Rodgers. 7.3 more average per season for Packers. Packers have easier drives to go less distance than Lions. Rodgers gets better field position support. It's proven. Fact. No debate.


Weapons. 2011-2013 the Packers had much better weapons. It's been even since 2014 with the Tate/Ebron/Riddick additions.

All of your "facts" do not suddenly make one arrive at the conclusion that Stafford must be better than Rodgers. They are pieces of the puzzle to consider, but when everything is analyzed at once, 99.99% of NFL fans, GMs, coaches, players, and their cousins would tell you Rodgers is better than Stafford. Just because Rodgers might have "more help" in your opinion, doesn't automatically make Stafford better. That's a ridiculous notion. Any player on a great team basically get penalized then because they have other good players around them by your logic. Jerry Rice must not be all that special because he had Joe Montana and Steve Young throwing to him right?

This is not any sort of knock on Stafford. I still think he is very good. Who cares if I don't think he's better than Rodgers? Just accept this for what it is and agree to disagree good lord. How many endless threads do you want to make about this? As KC said you're so over the top it's ridiculous, and that's why I believe you're doing this on purpose.

Nobody agrees with you. Move on.

 

[LKP]

tsk, tsk, smhairftab Shaking my head as I reach for the aspirin bottle.

In the past 15 months while reading and posting the Lions notes, watching and talking more Lions football than I have done since Barry's years,
I have learned for me, quite alot. I still have much to learn and understand about the game, unlike my vast knowledge (modesty to the backseat), of baseball.

But, when I read some posts that defend Lions players in-game or not due to injuries, and the same for the team overall, and comparing to other teams and players I become befuddled and confused.

Being an over the top apologists for players, team personnel and front office, day after day, thread after thread just becomes tiresome for all who read.
A few/some defenses of them are understandable, but with such a large percentage of all other posts 'coming to the defense of everything Lions' makes the person basically an island unto himself,

All of this has turned much that is posted here into baiting/sarcasm/trolling back and forth bomb tossing and it hijacks many threads. The few times I posted to stop or enjoy a time out, it would but then find it in another thread that same day/evening or next day/evening.

It begs the question for Mitch, myself, and any other moderator, what to do.
Recent post(s) here just come off to me as twilight zone and this is from myself, a football light weight, in comparision to most everyone here.
Mitch, after posting with you last night in the private/conference room, and thinking how this has gone downhill after a good return, but only for a short time, even earlier in the season some of the same stuff ; then, with the end of the year losing and out of the playoffs, and back and forth drama/trauma on the board, we need to figure this out and agree to fix for everyone.

There is alot of passion on this board from one end of the positive, to the other end of the negative, regarding Lions players/team. Discussing merits of each is great, until the fantasy world stuff gets it off the tracks.

Mitch, lets hopefully come up with something by the end of the week.

Stepping out for a short time.

You need to discuss this with me. Not him. Valid opinions shouldn't be stifled. Injuries can effect outcomes in games. I have valid support for all my opinions (stats, description of plays etc). And it is a debate with many different view points. That is the point of a message board, not for everyone to agree that the Lions suck (which boggles my mind on a Lions message board that would be the majority opinion). The post traffic is super low without valid debate.

I've seen the negative posters make way bigger outrageous claims. I'm the only one who calls them out because it's many on here have a negative opinion that they'll accept any negative opinion they see (no matter how outlandish).

 

[LKP]

All of your "facts" do not suddenly make one arrive at the conclusion that Stafford must be better than Rodgers. They are pieces of the puzzle to consider, but when everything is analyzed at once, 99.99% of NFL fans, GMs, coaches, players, and their cousins would tell you Rodgers is better than Stafford. Just because Rodgers might have "more help" in your opinion, doesn't automatically make Stafford better. That's a ridiculous notion. Any player on a great team basically get penalized then because they have other good players around them by your logic. Jerry Rice must not be all that special because he had Joe Montana and Steve Young throwing to him right?

This is not any sort of knock on Stafford. I still think he is very good. Who cares if I don't think he's better than Rodgers? Just accept this for what it is and agree to disagree good lord. How many endless threads do you want to make about this? As KC said you're so over the top it's ridiculous, and that's why I believe you're doing this on purpose.

Nobody agrees with you. Move on.

Stafford has done very well with less help. The difference in the stats is attributed to Rodgers protection, run game support, field position support and drive support. If you watch the game tape on both, Stafford is the better QB. Rodgers crumbled the one year he faced 35% pressure (even with a run game and good field position support that year). One weapon injury to Nelson killed him even with Cobb, Adams, Lacy and Rogers in the fold.


This year Nelson played entire regular season and Adams and Cook and Cobb (at points) stepped up for him. The protection for him has been great. He still has a run game with Montgomery over 100 yard per game (and 5 games with Lacy to start the year).

 

[UMRules06]

LOL for an opinion. A valid one. You better stop telling people should be banned. That's a total cop out by you.

Ansah, Short, Ngata/Robinson, JPP, Hyder. That would be the best Dline in the league. Good secondary already , solid LBs and good offensive talent with Abdullah, Riddick and Swanson returning.

Considering no team has ever won 3 straight Super Bowls and nobody has even won 2 straight since the 03/04 Patriot teams, no it's not a valid opinion. It's you making a stupid statement again on purpose to keep pointless arguments going.

 

[LKP]

Considering no team has ever won 3 straight Super Bowls and nobody has even won 2 straight since the 03/04 Patriot teams, no it's not a valid opinion. It's you making a stupid statement again on purpose to keep pointless arguments going.

The Lions are very talented. Adding those two players and they could win 3 in a row with a monster defense. You under value the Lions current players is the problem.

 

[UMRules06]

Stafford has done very well with less help. The difference in the stats is attributed to Rodgers protection, run game support, field position support and drive support. If you watch the game tape on both, Stafford is the better QB. Rodgers crumbled the one year he faced 35% pressure (even with a run game and good field position support that year). One weapon injury to Nelson killed him even with Cobb, Adams, Lacy and Rogers in the fold.


This year Nelson played entire regular season and Adams and Cook and Cobb (at points) stepped up for him. The protection for him has been great. He still has a run game with Montgomery over 100 yard per game (and 5 games with Lacy to start the year).

So Jerry Rice wasn't very good because he had Joe Montana and Steve Young throwing to him. Got it.

 

[UMRules06]

The Lions are very talented. Adding those two players and they could win 3 in a row with a monster defense. You under value the Lions current players is the problem.

It's never happened before but the 9-7 Lions with the 30th ranked front 7 on defense, and giving up a record passing completion percentage just need to add 2 or 3 players and they're a dynasty....

Got it. Carry on

 

[LKP]

So Jerry Rice wasn't very good because he had Joe Montana and Steve Young throwing to him. Got it.

Rice was good. Made Montana and Young look good. As did a running game and defenses that forced turnovers. QBs need support. Stafford doesn't get that much. A lot of it due to key injuries on offense. Some was lack of talent (2013 weapons not named Calvin), 2014/2015 Oline at times, RB before Abdullah and after Best injury, Lombardi coaching.

 

[LKP]

It's never happened before but the 9-7 Lions with the 30th ranked front 7 on defense, and giving up a record passing completion percentage just need to add 2 or 3 players and they're a dynasty....

Got it. Carry on

Short and JPP are very good. Ansah is very good. Ngata and Robinson are good. Hyder is a good backup. It would be the best defensive line in the league

 

[UMRules06]

*Shrugs* this is too transparent. Anyone who thinks this guy isn't trolling on purpose at this point I don't know what to tell you.

Do what you will. Have fun

 

[LKP]

*Shrugs* this is too transparent. Anyone who thinks this guy isn't trolling on purpose at this point I don't know what to tell you.

Do what you will. Have fun

I'm not. I'm discussing football with valid opinions, stats, facts and play descriptions.

You say this like once a week. Then say carry on. Either carry on or discuss football. Stop bringing this up when it is not true.

 

[UMRules06]

I'm not. I'm discussing football with valid opinions, stats, facts and play descriptions.

You say this like once a week. Then say carry on. Either carry on or discuss football. Stop bringing this up when it is not true.

Yes I do because talking to you is like talking to a robot. You don't discuss football, you argue just to argue and regurgitate the same responses all the time as if they will suddenly sway somebody's opinion. You never change your stance, or use a give and take approach or agree to disagree like rational functioning adults do. You are a troll who only knows one way to operate. You stick to your gimmick like your life depends on it. Hence the "carry on". It's also my way of avoiding derailing the threads any further, by trying to end things.

That's my valid opinion on the matter.

 

[tomdalton22]

guys, it depends on what LKP is arguing. If he is trying to make a case that the Lions are a SB caliber team he says the team is loaded with talent. If he is trying to explain that Stafford is the best QB in the league he says he doesn't get support from his defense, OL and running game which would mean a shitty team around Stafford.

He is a troll that talks out of both sides of his mouth.