Game 2: Lions @ Packers Thread

[mhughes0021]

If the offense only scores 21 point...that will be a problem ALL YEAR long. You need to consistently put up 30+ points a game if you want to win with this defense. And theres going to be like 7-8 times this year that 30 points wont win it.

 

[LKP]

If the offense only scores 21 point...that will be a problem ALL YEAR long. You need to consistently put up 30+ points a game if you want to win with this defense. And theres going to be like 7-8 times this year that 30 points wont win it.

30 points is usually top 2. And some years nobody hits 30 points
1 team in 2019
3 teams in 2018
0 in 2017
1 in 2016
2 in 2015
2 in 2014
1 in 2013
2 in 2012
3 in 2011 (Lions had 29.6 BTW for 4th). Also all weapons and Oline healthy that year. Stafford the finger injury for a few games. Best out after 5.5 games

Offense at 25-26 PPG should be good enough to win alot of games. Defense needs to figure it out and quickly.

21, miss FG and thank Abouishi for killing another promising drive too

Got 14 more games. Last chance for everybody

 

[mhughes0021]

30 points is usually top 2. And some years nobody hits 30 points
1 team in 2019
3 teams in 2018
0 in 2017
1 in 2016
2 in 2015
2 in 2014
1 in 2013
2 in 2012
3 in 2011 (Lions had 29.6 BTW for 4th). Also all weapons and Oline healthy that year. Stafford the finger injury for a few games. Best out after 5.5 games

Offense at 25-26 PPG should be good enough to win alot of games. Defense needs to figure it out and quickly.

21, miss FG and thank Abouishi for killing another promising drive too

Got 14 more games. Last chance for everybody

Right...but we have a historically bad defense that continues to blow double digit leads. And when we score 21 points...we lose by 21. Keep up...

 

[LKP]

18 teams in nfl history have allowed 30 ppg or more

Lions in 2008 and 2009 on that list

Dolphins did last year. 3 games held opponent to under 21. 5 wins on season

Will see if it happens again. Too much talent to do that but we shall see on execution

 

[dubbsco]

18 teams in nfl history have allowed 30 ppg or more

Lions in 2008 and 2009 on that list

Dolphins did last year. 3 games held opponent to under 21. 5 wins on season

Will see if it happens again. Too much talent to do that but we shall see on execution

There's just a complete fundamental disagreement here. There is absolutely NOT too much talent. There is a CLEAR void of talent in this organization.

 

[LKP]

There's just a complete fundamental disagreement here. There is absolutely NOT too much talent. There is a CLEAR void of talent in this organization.

Talent doesn't always mean execution. They have too much talent to give up 30 PPG is the bar. Not too much talent to not be a top 5 defense. Big difference

Okudah, Hand, Walker, Trufant, AO, Collins, Flowers, J Okwara are all very talented defenders. Okudah, Okwara and AO are very young and need to grow and develop. The other team has talent too though so they can beat our talent.

Coleman, Tavai, Shelton, Williams can be solid players too but only for certain things. Coleman wins but he needs pass rush. Shelton a run stuffer that was a 1st round pick. Williams can rush the passer but got hurt already. Tavai can do a little of everything but nothing really well. A younger better version of Christian Jones.

Davis, C Jones, Harris you can work with I guess but its apparent they need upgraded. Davis has the size and speed required but he doesn't execute in his mind well enough and will be gone. He was picked for a different defense so it didn't work out well for him. Much like KVN. Jones is just a utliity guy that they are forcing to be JACK LB now and Will before that. Harris is a thumper that doesn't thump and can't cover.

 

[dubbsco]

Talent doesn't always mean execution. They have too much talent to give up 30 PPG is the bar. Not too much talent to not be a top 5 defense. Big difference

Okudah, Hand, Walker, Trufant, AO, Collins, Flowers, J Okwara are all very talented defenders. Okudah, Okwara and AO are very young and need to grow and develop. The other team has talent too though so they can beat our talent.

Coleman, Tavai, Shelton, Williams can be solid players too but only for certain things. Coleman wins but he needs pass rush. Shelton a run stuffer that was a 1st round pick. Williams can rush the passer but got hurt already. Tavai can do a little of everything but nothing really well. A younger better version of Christian Jones.

Davis, C Jones, Harris you can work with I guess but its apparent they need upgraded. Davis has the size and speed required but he doesn't execute in his mind well enough and will be gone. He was picked for a different defense so it didn't work out well for him. Much like KVN. Jones is just a utliity guy that they are forcing to be JACK LB now and Will before that. Harris is a thumper that doesn't thump and can't cover.

If you think there's enough talent here to be a top 5 defense, then there is nothing else to discuss.

 

[LKP]

If you think there's enough talent here to be a top 5 defense, then there is nothing else to discuss.

I was saying that wasn't the discussion. The discussion was do they have enough talent to not give up 30 PPG. For sure they do.

The lions have good amount of talent. Talent doesn't mean execution and a bunch of good players isn't enough. You need some great on both sides of the ball. Other than Stafford we don't have that. See San Fran losing Bosa and Sherman being 0-2.

Talent is good but lacking great for Detroit. Patricia couldn't make a bunch of good players work in his defense so far. Because you need great.

 

[dubbsco]

I was saying that wasn't the discussion. The discussion was do they have enough talent to not give up 30 PPG. For sure they do.

The lions have good amount of talent. Talent doesn't mean execution and a bunch of good players isn't enough. You need some great on both sides of the ball. Other than Stafford we don't have that. See San Fran losing Bosa and Sherman being 0-2.

Talent is good but lacking great for Detroit. Patricia couldn't make a bunch of good players work in his defense so far. Because you need great.

So, you have said two different things:
-They have the talent to be a top 5 defense.
-They have enough talent to not give up 30 PPG.

Do you see the difference in these two statements?

 

[Mitchrapp]

Its sad that the discussion is do have have talent not to give up 30 a game.

 

[mhughes0021]

Im just trying to project when we WONT give up 30 points?

27 to the shitty bears. 42 to Arod.
Ari....30+ is most likely
Saints....if michael thomas is back 40+ is most likely
Atlanta...yup they will hit 30.
Texans, Pack, Bucs...yes yes yes.


So maybe the Jags and Colts struggle to get all the way to 30.

But i think theres a very good chance opposing teams avg 30 points this year. Hate to beat a dead horse but it matters zero how many pieces you have when you cant create pressure.

 

[boogerlovejoy]

Im just trying to project when we WONT give up 30 points?

27 to the shitty bears. 42 to Arod.
Ari....30+ is most likely
Saints....if michael thomas is back 40+ is most likely
Atlanta...yup they will hit 30.
Texans, Pack, Bucs...yes yes yes.


So maybe the Jags and Colts struggle to get all the way to 30.

But i think theres a very good chance opposing teams avg 30 points this year. Hate to beat a dead horse but it matters zero how many pieces you have when you cant create pressure.

Not one DL hit Rodgers last week. Not one hit. So in theory it would have been more effective to drop 11.

That’s how bad our front 4 is. And the best pass rushing solution we had for the ENTIRE off season, J Okwara, was a healthy scratch.

WTF is Quinn doing?

 

[LKP]

So, you have said two different things:
-They have the talent to be a top 5 defense.
-They have enough talent to not give up 30 PPG.

Do you see the difference in these two statements?

I didnt say the first thing if you read it properly

 

[dubbsco]

I didnt say the first thing if you read it properly

Yep my fault.

Regardless, we just don't think alike. I think they are seriously lacking talent.

 

[LKP]

Yep my fault.

Regardless, we just don't think alike. I think they are seriously lacking talent.

I think talent doesnt mean exeution. They have good but they need a few great mixed in

 

[tomdalton22]

I think talent doesnt mean exeution. They have good but they need a few great mixed in

The defense is terrible. They don't have a single unit that is above average (D Line, LBS or secondary) Offensively, I think they can be good but they don't seem to have an identity. They invested a lot into the RBs but none seem to be any good.

 

[mhughes0021]

The defense is terrible. They don't have a single unit that is above average (D Line, LBS or secondary) Offensively, I think they can be good but they don't seem to have an identity. They invested a lot into the RBs but none seem to be any good.

Golladay: Im here to perform a magic trick. Im going to turn Andy Dalton into a top 5 qb.

POOF!

 

[LKP]

Golladay: Im here to perform a magic trick. Im going to turn Andy Dalton into a top 5 qb.

POOF!

Stafford has had great years without Golladay too. See 2011, 2016, 2017. 2016/2017 without Calvin or Golladay

Run blocking is improved. Still missing the RT hurt too and now Dahl hurt for Aboushi which is downgrade. Jackson showing good flashes too at RG as a rook. Decker and Ragnow good

RBs all talented. KJ is health, Swift is a rook but showed improvement in game 2.

Plenty of weapons but Golladay is the best one. I think all times and all QBs would like to have their top WRs. Watson is missing Hopkins already

 

[tomdalton22]

Stafford has had great years without Golladay too. See 2011, 2016, 2017. 2016/2017 without Calvin or Golladay

Run blocking is improved. Still missing the RT hurt too and now Dahl hurt for Aboushi which is downgrade. Jackson showing good flashes too at RG as a rook. Decker and Ragnow good

RBs all talented. KJ is health, Swift is a rook but showed improvement in game 2.

Plenty of weapons but Golladay is the best one. I think all times and all QBs would like to have their top WRs. Watson is missing Hopkins already

Stafford has always had good receiving targets.

2016
Tate, Jones, Boldin
2017
Tate, Jones, Golladay

 

[LKP]

Stafford has always had good receiving targets.

2016
Tate, Jones, Boldin
2017
Tate, Jones, Golladay

2012, 2013 had Calvin but banged up Calvin plus many other injuries. Some of his worst years then for sure. And pre getting fixed by Caldwell for picks