Morris, Tram 2013 ballot

[tycobb420]

http://www.mlb.com/news/article.jsp...c_id=mlb&partnerId=aw-6984205669396466021-997

 

[tycobb420]

If I had a vote:
Bagwell, Biggio, Morris, Piazza, Raines, Schilling, Trammell

 

[boogerlovejoy]

If I had a vote:
Bagwell, Biggio, Morris, Piazza, Raines, Schilling, Trammell

Bagwell, Biggio, Paizza.......mmmmmmmmmmaaaaaaybe Morris.

I'd like it to remain the Hall of Fame....not the Hall of Very Good.

 

[Thumb]

I think Ty is right, I think Morris and Tram make it because voters will snub Bonds, Clemens, and Sosa.

But I somewhat agree with Booger, I dunno if Morris has the stats to back up the idea of Hall of Fame.

 

[Mitchrapp]

Morris is so close. Even with the snubs I doubt Tram gets many votes at all, maybe 12%

 

[kalinecountry]

Morris is so close. Even with the snubs I doubt Tram gets many votes at all, maybe 12%

Trammell jumped from 24% to 36.8% last year.

 

[tomdalton22]

If I had a vote:
Bagwell, Biggio, Morris, Piazza, Raines, Schilling, Trammell

I would vote Morris, Piazza, Trammell & Bonds

 

[Mitchrapp]

Trammell jumped from 24% to 36.8% last year.

I didn't know that, I still get pissed knowing Ozzie Smith had over 90% on his first ballot and its taken so long for Tram to get his. And because of what, a freakin' flip.

 

[boogerlovejoy]

I didn't know that, I still get pissed knowing Ozzie Smith had over 90% on his first ballot and its taken so long for Tram to get his. And because of what, a freakin' flip.

Chica had to write this. No way anyone else on this board is that dumb.

 

[boogerlovejoy]

I would vote Morris, Piazza, Trammell & Bonds

Listen, Tram was my first favorite player. Loved him. Played SS and wore #3 all the way through Little League.

I don't think he is a HOF'er. I just don't see it. Top to middle of the order hitter on some good offensive teams with only a few seasons of good run production. Good defender, not great. Good hitter, not great. Only 2 or 3 HOF seasons.

Baseball Reference has Tram's most similar player as Jim Fregosi, Jay Bell and Jimmy Rollins for almost ALL of his productive years. Jim Fregosi, Jay Bell and Jimmy Rollins........NOT HOFers either.

Someone convince me with something else than their heart.....I want to believe......I just don't see it.

 

[kalinecountry]

Alan Trammell:
Gray Ink Batting - 48 (522), Average HOFer ≈ 144
Hall of Fame Monitor - Batting - 118 (121), Likely HOFer ≈ 100
Hall of Fame Standards - Batting - 40 (160), Average HOFer ≈ 50

JAWS Shortstop (11th place), 67.1 career WAR/43.3 7yr-peak WAR/55.2 JAWS
Average HOF SS (out of 21) = 63.1 career WAR/41.1 7yr-peak WAR/52.1 JAWS

Similar Batters
View Similar Player Links in Pop-up
Compare Stats to Similars
1.Edgar Renteria (917)
2.Barry Larkin (914) *
3.Jay Bell (876)
4.Lou Whitaker (868)
5.Ray Durham (866)
6.Tony Fernandez (865)
7.B.J. Surhoff (860)
8.Ryne Sandberg (859) *
9.Pee Wee Reese (850) *
10.Jimmy Rollins (849)
* - Signifies Hall of Famer

I have thought that part of this low vote % Tram has received is because of playing for Detroit as a mid market team. I think if he played for an east coast team he would have made it several years ago. Sure Larkin is from a mid market as well, but overall did have some better numbers, average and power, it's small but still a little better.

My thoughts when he retired was, if he had finished with a more round number of hits over 2500 it wouldn't have been as difficult. jmo.

Monday on MLB Network, getting props from Barry Larkin will help some.

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Age
21.Elvis Andrus (979) 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 C
22.Elvis Andrus (962) 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 C
23.Elvis Andrus (959) 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 C
24.Buddy Kerr (956) 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 C
25.Jim Fregosi (948) 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 C
26.Jim Fregosi (944) 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 C
27.Jim Fregosi (948) 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 C
28.Jim Fregosi (947) 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 C
29.Jim Fregosi (924) 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 C
30.Jimmy Rollins (902) 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 C
31.Jimmy Rollins (899) 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 C
32.Craig Biggio (895) 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 C
33.Edgar Renteria (901) 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 C
34.Jay Bell (915) 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 C
35.Jay Bell (908) 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 C
36.Craig Biggio (901) 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 C
37.Jay Bell (886) 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 C
38.Barry Larkin (900) * 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 C

 

[tycobb420]

Listen, Tram was my first favorite player. Loved him. Played SS and wore #3 all the way through Little League.

I don't think he is a HOF'er. I just don't see it. Top to middle of the order hitter on some good offensive teams with only a few seasons of good run production. Good defender, not great. Good hitter, not great. Only 2 or 3 HOF seasons.

Baseball Reference has Tram's most similar player as Jim Fregosi, Jay Bell and Jimmy Rollins for almost ALL of his productive years. Jim Fregosi, Jay Bell and Jimmy Rollins........NOT HOFers either.

Someone convince me with something else than their heart.....I want to believe......I just don't see it.

Rollins might get in someday. It would not surprise me.

 

[tycobb420]

Advanced metrics and the Larkin comparisons will help Tram, but it might not be enough. We will see. I think he suffers from playing opposite Ripken and Yount the way Santo suffered in Brooks Robinson's shadow.

 

[tomdalton22]

Listen, Tram was my first favorite player. Loved him. Played SS and wore #3 all the way through Little League.

I don't think he is a HOF'er. I just don't see it. Top to middle of the order hitter on some good offensive teams with only a few seasons of good run production. Good defender, not great. Good hitter, not great. Only 2 or 3 HOF seasons.

Baseball Reference has Tram's most similar player as Jim Fregosi, Jay Bell and Jimmy Rollins for almost ALL of his productive years. Jim Fregosi, Jay Bell and Jimmy Rollins........NOT HOFers either.

Someone convince me with something else than their heart.....I want to believe......I just don't see it.

Compare Trammell to Ozzie Smith. They played virtually during the exact time period.

Trammell (1977-1996) Smith (1978-1996) career numbers

BA .285 > .262
OBP .352 > .337
OPS .767 > .666
HR 185 > 28
RBI 1003 > 793

The only thing that Smith had on Trammell was flashy defense. I think the only reason Trammell isn't in the HOF is because of the lack of awards. Tram was cock blocked by Cal Ripkin for most of his career. If Smith is a no brainer HOF Tram has to get in.

 

[kalinecountry]

http://www.cbssports.com/mlb/blog/da...l-of-fame-void
Kirk Gibson makes pitch for 1984 Tigers to fill a Hall of Fame void.
from cbssports

 

[kalinecountry]

http://www.detroitnews.com/article/...exclusion-1984-Tigers-players-great-injustice
Hall of Fame exclusion for 1984 Tigers players is great injustice.
from the detnews

 

[kalinecountry]

http://www.cbssports.com/mlb/blog/e...itaker-best-all-around-double-play-combo-ever
Were Trammell and Whitaker best all-around double-play combo ever?
from cbssports

 

[Mitchrapp]

Listen, Tram was my first favorite player. Loved him. Played SS and wore #3 all the way through Little League.

I don't think he is a HOF'er. I just don'mt see iTop to middle of the order hitter on some good offensive teams with only a few seasons of good run production. Good defender, not great. Good hitter, not great. Only 2 or 3 HOF seasons.

Baseball Reference has Tram's most similar player as Jim Fregosi, Jay Bell and Jimmy Rollins for almost ALL of his productive years. Jim Fregosi, Jay Bell and Jimmy Rollins........NOT HOFers either.

Someone convince me with something else than their heart.....I want to believe......I just don't see it.

He was better in all important offensive stats than Ozzie. He might not have had the defense but Tram was pretty good. Won some GG and if not for Ripken would have won a whole bunch more. In the end Tram was the better player, just couldn't do a back flip.

Its a travesty Ozzie got over 90% vote and Trams not in.

 

[kalinecountry]

http://www.cbssports.com/mlb/blog/e...13-hall-of-fame-candidates-no-7-alan-trammell
Ranking the 2013 Hall of Fame candidates: No. 7, Alan Trammell.
from cbssports

http://www.freep.com/article/201212...-double-play?odyssey=tab|topnews|text|Detroit Tigers
Tigers' Alan Trammell, Lou Whitaker the best double-play combo of all time?
from the freep

 

[byco42]

Bagwell, Biggio, Paizza.......mmmmmmmmmmaaaaaaybe Morris.

I'd like it to remain the Hall of Fame....not the Hall of Very Good.

Too late for that.

Signed, Phil Rizzuto, Ozzie Smith and Waite Hoyt