Reggie calls Morris dominant

[Thumb]

Considering Morris was the ace of the staff of 3 WS titles and had arguabley the best of 2nd best post season pitching performance ever I think Morris had more success in the post season. As far as Reggie....it kind of proves that stats aren't all that matters. He had a little more success vs. Morris yet he considers him the better pitcher.

Like I said, Reggie probably has a beef with Bert.

you keep bringing up these intangible stats....AS voting is a joke, fans vote for their favorites, not who the better player is...let's at least agree to put that to rest.

Simple fact, and this is based on actual performance, not intangibles, is Blyleven was superior not just in the period that he and Morris pitched, but one of the top 20 pitchers all time. [currently]

I'm in no way disrespecting Morris, but the plain and simple truth to anyone who is not blinded by a boyhood hero's reputation, is Bert Blyleven was not only better than Morris, but much better.


Lets take each players best season, since the totals don't matter to you:

Morris 1983 : 20-13, 293.2 IP, 37 GS, 20 CG, 1 SHO, 232 K, 83 BB, 30 HR, 3.34 ERA, 1.158 WHIP.

Blyleven 1985 : 17-16, 293.2 IP, 37 GS, 24 CG, 5 SHO, 206 K, 75 BB, 23 HR, 3.16 ERA, 1.154 WHIP.

 

[mjsb2]

Anybody who values what people say over stats, is an idiot.

 

[Thumb]

Jackson is just giving his opinion like any of us would. Why are you getting so worked up.

Personally, If in a needed win I'd take Morris. The same way I'd take Isaiah over Jordan on taking the last shot. Just opinion, we all have him. Doesn't mean someone is right or wrong.

Except he isn't Mitch, he's trying to say everyone thinks Morris was better [based on AS votes LOL], and that's just not true.

Having a favorite is one thing, saying said favorite is better and trying to use invisible stats to back it up is not.

And seriously, Isiah over Jordan? I wouldn't even go Isiah over Dumars if I needed a game winning bucket.

 

[Mitchrapp]

Except he isn't Mitch, he's trying to say everyone thinks Morris was better [based on AS votes LOL], and that's just not true.

Having a favorite is one thing, saying said favorite is better and trying to use invisible stats to back it up is not.

And seriously, Isiah over Jordan? I wouldn't even go Isiah over Dumars if I needed a game winning bucket.

I actually didn't read the story, just assumed. Lol.

To the latter, Thomas made all those clutch shots. Jordan made a lot but also missed a lot. Maybe a bit unfair because he shot many more at the end of games and you can't make them all.

This was just from what I saw back then so maybe a bit biased since I watched more Pistons games than I did Bulls but Isiah was clutch.

Like I said, we all have opinions even though 90% of the world would say Jordan, doesn't mean I'm wrong :nod:

 

[tomdalton22]

Except he isn't Mitch, he's trying to say everyone thinks Morris was better [based on AS votes LOL], and that's just not true.

Having a favorite is one thing, saying said favorite is better and trying to use invisible stats to back it up is not.

And seriously, Isiah over Jordan? I wouldn't even go Isiah over Dumars if I needed a game winning bucket.

I didn't only bring up AL appearances but CY votes and MVP votes. So all of the people that vote on those awards are idiots too? Morris was worth an average of 2 more wins per year to his team (average season for Morris was 16-12, Bert was 14-12)

 

[Mitchrapp]

Ut oh, don't bring up wins.

 

[tomdalton22]

Ut oh, don't bring up wins.

I know....we can only use stats that support the other side of the argument.

 

[Thumb]

I didn't only bring up AL appearances but CY votes and MVP votes. So all of the people that vote on those awards are idiots too? Morris was worth an average of 2 more wins per year to his team (average season for Morris was 16-12, Bert was 14-12)

Win are dependent on run support. Blyleven still gave up fewer runs, the Tigers just had more offense than the Twins during that period.

And CY votes, okay fine.

Neither ever placed higher than 3rd, that's really definitive. Finishing out of the top 10 in MVP voting is kinda pushing the argument also.

And those people are not saying Morris is better, you're interpreting that as them saying so.

 

[Thumb]

I know....we can only use stats that support the other side of the argument.

Again, use Wins if you want, but Wins offer almost no indication of a pitchers value.

Ask Felix Hernandez, if he played for a team like Texas he might have won 20-25 game the last 3 years.

 

[Thumb]

I didn't only bring up AL appearances but CY votes and MVP votes. So all of the people that vote on those awards are idiots too? Morris was worth an average of 2 more wins per year to his team (average season for Morris was 16-12, Bert was 14-12)

Also I never called anyone an idiot, so yeah, keep that in mind.

 

[tomdalton22]

Also I never called anyone an idiot, so yeah, keep that in mind.

sorry...that was Mjsb that called me an idiot a few times.

 

[Mitchrapp]

Also I never called anyone an idiot, so yeah, keep that in mind.

But you were thinking of it, lol.

 

[byco42]

Let's throw Mickey Lolich into the debate, because I think he was as good or better than either Blyleven or Morris.

Point: this is a discussion of two very good pitchers, but neither one do I consider as consistently "dominant."