What a waste...

[Sbee]

The way he has been used this year I would agree. But look in the second half of the UM game when he went down on the block. I think it was probably Matthews who was guarding him, I'm not sure. But he scored on about 3 separate occasions doing that and he made it look easy. It's too bad that by that point UM had kind of taken control of the game. That is what he should have been doing vs college small forwards all season. Is the reason he hasn't because he has been too content to float on the outside (and try to showcase his NBA skills at the 3), or because of the way the offense has been designed? Certainly teams are not going to sit still and let that happen all game, so they'd probably bring a big to help, but if you've spaced things properly (like the way UM does) that is harder to do. And if they do, well then that is going to open things up for other people anyway (Bridges if doubled in the post may not be a great passer, but I am willing to bet he is better in that area than Ward).

Really thinking about it, even removing the issue of whether Ward is in the game and there as another post option or in the doghouse, Bridges and JJJ should have an advantage in the post against just about anyone they're matched up with. Other teams might be able to match up at 1 of those positions, but they are very unlikely to be able to match up in both. And the one that might not have the post advantage can just go outside since either of them can hit 3's. It seems like they haven't taken advantage of those sort of things often enough this year.

When Ward was playing well early on, we were unstoppable, the offense moved inside out and we almost scored at will. When we play outside in, we're stagnant. We need to get Ward going, hard to do when he plays 10 minutes a game. I know Wagner is a tough cover for any traditional 5 but Ward also draws fouls at a record pace, I would have liked to see him get the ball in the post more in that game (not all his fault, put some on the guards).

JJJ had some big rebounds and put backs early but was just awful on defense late. they went with JJJ at the 5 on Wagner and Miles at the 4, I liked the lineup but JJJ was playing rec league defense.

 

[MSUMatt28]

So with Michigan winning. Is it possible Purdue UM and MSU are all 3 seeds?

In the latest projections Palm has both us and Purdue as 2's and UM as a 4. Lunardi has Purdue as a 2, both us and UM as 3's with UNC bumping us off the 2 line. I'd have a bit of an issue with that given that our game vs UNC was never close. I get that that game was quite awhile ago, but weighing heavily results in November and December has never stopped them before.

And I am not convinced that Purdue is really a 2 anymore, though I'm not going to argue if they remain so. They seem to be limping to the finish line ever since that loss to OSU. They lost to us, then at Wisconsin, struggled to beat PSU at home and struggled in both wins in the BTT.

 

[SpartyNash]

In the latest projections Palm has both us and Purdue as 2's and UM as a 4. Lunardi has Purdue as a 2, both us and UM as 3's with UNC bumping us off the 2 line. I'd have a bit of an issue with that given that our game vs UNC was never close. I get that that game was quite awhile ago, but weighing heavily results in November and December has never stopped them before.

And I am not convinced that Purdue is really a 2 anymore, though I'm not going to argue if they remain so. They seem to be limping to the finish line ever since that loss to OSU. They lost to us, then at Wisconsin, struggled to beat PSU at home and struggled in both wins in the BTT.

I think there?s a 75% chance we end up as a 3 seed. Purdue will be a 2-3, Michigan a 3-4.

Regarding UNC, I?ve happened to watch several of their games, I guess I?m missing why a team that will likely have 10 losses is going to be a 2-3 seed. They score a good amount of points but their offense is absolutely awful at stretches and they are atrocious defensively.

 

[boogerlovejoy]

In the latest projections Palm has both us and Purdue as 2's and UM as a 4. Lunardi has Purdue as a 2, both us and UM as 3's with UNC bumping us off the 2 line. I'd have a bit of an issue with that given that our game vs UNC was never close. I get that that game was quite awhile ago, but weighing heavily results in November and December has never stopped them before.

And I am not convinced that Purdue is really a 2 anymore, though I'm not going to argue if they remain so. They seem to be limping to the finish line ever since that loss to OSU. They lost to us, then at Wisconsin, struggled to beat PSU at home and struggled in both wins in the BTT.

We're gonna be a 2 or 3......to me it doesn't matter. We won't be playing the 2nd weekend if we don't get our shit straight no matter what our seeding.

Normally an Izzo coached team is rolling right now and I would say this layoff would hurt us. But we're playing like shit.....have been for a month.....and this 10 days off can do nothing but help.

 

[Spartanmack]

The way he has been used this year I would agree. But look in the second half of the UM game when he went down on the block. I think it was probably Matthews who was guarding him, I'm not sure. But he scored on about 3 separate occasions doing that and he made it look easy. It's too bad that by that point UM had kind of taken control of the game. That is what he should have been doing vs college small forwards all season. Is the reason he hasn't because he has been too content to float on the outside (and try to showcase his NBA skills at the 3), or because of the way the offense has been designed? Certainly teams are not going to sit still and let that happen all game, so they'd probably bring a big to help, but if you've spaced things properly (like the way UM does) that is harder to do. And if they do, well then that is going to open things up for other people anyway (Bridges if doubled in the post may not be a great passer, but I am willing to bet he is better in that area than Ward).

Really thinking about it, even removing the issue of whether Ward is in the game and there as another post option or in the doghouse, Bridges and JJJ should have an advantage in the post against just about anyone they're matched up with. Other teams might be able to match up at 1 of those positions, but they are very unlikely to be able to match up in both. And the one that might not have the post advantage can just go outside since either of them can hit 3's. It seems like they haven't taken advantage of those sort of things often enough this year.

I hear and agree with a lot of what you're saying. I just don't think he's a solid first option the way he plays. I definitely think he could be if he consistently did all the things we're talking about. But when I see him repeatedly being behind the ball on the breakouts and often the 4th or 5th guy down the floor and his outside first approach to offense (Izzo's fault too of course), coupled with the lazy or sloppy handling of the ball I think there are better options to run the offense through. I'm not saying we'd be better off without him or anything crazy like that - and at times he is by far the best player on the floor - he has the ability to take over games and he's shown he wants the ball in critical situations. My main point is, it would take more than Izzo changing his approach to how he utilizes Bridges - Bridges has to be consistently more assertive.

also, I'm not discounting the possibility that the way Izzo has used him has made Bridges this way.

edit: I also don't want to put this all on Bridges' shoulders - I was expecting this team to get out and run way more than they seem to. Is that an unfair criticism - do they run more than I'm giving them credit for? I feel like they should be able to run on just about anyone.

 

[Spartan23MSU]

I don't understand the bridges as the #1 option argument anymore. the more I watch, the more I think the guy is just kinda lazy. he should be catching 30 foot lobs on fast breaks, grabbing rebounds, making layups, dunks or assists off the dribble and destroying rims but he lags the ball on breakouts, hangs out on the 3 point line, makes lazy dribble turnovers, stupid passes mixed in with a game that seems limited to step back 3s and pull up jumpers from 17'.

Spot on!

He settles for jump shots inside the 3 point line. Hes a great free throw shooter so why doesnt he drive and draw a foul? ive been wondering this all year. When hes off hes OFF! At that point take it to the hole and get some sort of confidence going. This team and coach are frustrating to watch knowing they should be so much better. Its odd to look at the record and be disappointed but thats how I feel.

 

[Sbee]

In the latest projections Palm has both us and Purdue as 2's and UM as a 4. Lunardi has Purdue as a 2, both us and UM as 3's with UNC bumping us off the 2 line. I'd have a bit of an issue with that given that our game vs UNC was never close. I get that that game was quite awhile ago, but weighing heavily results in November and December has never stopped them before.

And I am not convinced that Purdue is really a 2 anymore, though I'm not going to argue if they remain so. They seem to be limping to the finish line ever since that loss to OSU. They lost to us, then at Wisconsin, struggled to beat PSU at home and struggled in both wins in the BTT.

UNC has 9 losses, including a home loss to Wofford in late December. It's as if wins matter, but losses don't, if that's the case, St Johns should be on the 2 line

 

[Sbee]

Spot on!

He settles for jump shots inside the 3 point line. Hes a great free throw shooter so why doesnt he drive and draw a foul? ive been wondering this all year. When hes off hes OFF! At that point take it to the hole and get some sort of confidence going. This team and coach are frustrating to watch knowing they should be so much better. Its odd to look at the record and be disappointed but thats how I feel.

the reason he doesn't drive a lot is that he's not great with his handle and also he's playing the 3, he doesn't have the same quickness advantage as he did playing the 4 last year. I remember early in the season thinking that we were a better team at that time with bridges at the 4, but for the team to be better long term we needed him at the 3 so Jackson and Ward could get minutes. Maybe it's time to give up on that experiment and go with Miles at the 4, Ward/Jackson sub in for each other at the 5.

 

[MSUMatt28]

the reason he doesn't drive a lot is that he's not great with his handle and also he's playing the 3, he doesn't have the same quickness advantage as he did playing the 4 last year. I remember early in the season thinking that we were a better team at that time with bridges at the 4, but for the team to be better long term we needed him at the 3 so Jackson and Ward could get minutes. Maybe it's time to give up on that experiment and go with Miles at the 4, Ward/Jackson sub in for each other at the 5.

Lack of wing depth makes doing that harder. For that to work you need both McQuaid and Langford playing well as they'd get the bulk of the minutes at the 2 and 3. And the pattern seems to be either one or the other there plays well. The other option is playing Winston and Tum Tum together which brings it's own set of problems. Worth looking at doing more than who do, depending on the mathups.

Again, I think one can use Bridges in the post more often on offense than we do, even from the 3. Him guarding opposing 3's shouldn't be a problem and JJJ can step out and hit 3's (though he's to be streaky there of late). But whichever one of them has the best matchup, they should be feeding inside, and then put the other outside to space the floor.

 

[Spartanmack]

the reason he doesn't drive a lot is that he's not great with his handle and also he's playing the 3, he doesn't have the same quickness advantage as he did playing the 4 last year. I remember early in the season thinking that we were a better team at that time with bridges at the 4, but for the team to be better long term we needed him at the 3 so Jackson and Ward could get minutes. Maybe it's time to give up on that experiment and go with Miles at the 4, Ward/Jackson sub in for each other at the 5.

then where are Goins' minutes gonna come from? He can't play the 5 and Izzo won't bench Bridges like he does Ward and Jackson. He did hit a couple big (miracle) 3s late in the season, maybe he can take Langford's spot at the 2.

#sarcasm

 

[Spartanmack]

Lack of wing depth makes doing that harder. For that to work you need both McQuaid and Langford playing well as they'd get the bulk of the minutes at the 2 and 3. And the pattern seems to be either one or the other there plays well. The other option is playing Winston and Tum Tum together which brings it's own set of problems. Worth looking at doing more than who do, depending on the mathups.

Again, I think one can use Bridges in the post more often on offense than we do, even from the 3. Him guarding opposing 3's shouldn't be a problem and JJJ can step out and hit 3's (though he's to be streaky there of late). But whichever one of them has the best matchup, they should be feeding inside, and then put the other outside to space the floor.

yeah, I've always been a bit skeptical of JJJ from 3. Yeah, he's shooting .397 on the season which would put him somewhere around 78th but at 38 for 96 he's not even in the top 128 for attempts. He's good and he has the confidence to take big shots at key points in close games. I'm not saying take that option away from him but I don't love his mechanics - I don't think he should be taking more 3s than he already does. I'd much rather see him getting the ball around 15' and driving or posting up, grabbing rebounds and dunking on people. He has a nice spin move, decent with the ball against 5s - he has a nice touch, he should develop the sky hook. And Ward should be watching film of Juwan Howard in the NBA where he developed that drop step.

 

[Sbee]

then where are Goins' minutes gonna come from? He can't play the 5 and Izzo won't bench Bridges like he does Ward and Jackson. He did hit a couple big (miracle) 3s late in the season, maybe he can take Langford's spot at the 2.

#sarcasm

Goins could guard the 3 depending on the opponent. I know you're joking about Goins playing and we've gone back and forth on this but he makes sense in some circumstances. You don't need 5 scorers on the floor at all times, Goins shoots 56% from the floor mainly as a garbage guy. Having a forward that can't create his offense is different than having a PG like Tum who can't create. You can have a very good team playing Cash, Langford or McQuaid, Goins, Bridges, Jackson/Ward

 

[Spartanmack]

Goins could guard the 3 depending on the opponent. I know you're joking about Goins playing and we've gone back and forth on this but he makes sense in some circumstances. You don't need 5 scorers on the floor at all times, Goins shoots 56% from the floor mainly as a garbage guy. Having a forward that can't create his offense is different than having a PG like Tum who can't create. You can have a very good team playing Cash, Langford or McQuaid, Goins, Bridges, Jackson/Ward

i agree there are times where goins makes sense but to me those times are when we need to give fouls. I'm not blown away by his defense - he may be better than Davis, but he's not a great defender - he's no Kenny Redfield or Mike Griffin.

In general I'd prefer an offensive option that's maybe not as good a defender most of the time - at least until late in the game where the incrementally better defense (and fouls) become more valuable and the ball is going to your best players on offense every possession. And if Izzo has to bench Bridges, Ward or Jackson I'd much rather have Schilling over Goins at down 6 with 15 minutes left in the second half.

I don't know what the deal is with Ben Carter - maybe his recovery didn't go so well or maybe he just doesn't fit in with the system or whatever - but I can't help thinking not having the contribution we thought we'd get from him has probably hurt as well.

 

[johnny2x2x]

If this team doesn't make the Final 4 I will consider it a waste, not before then though. Big Ten Champs, 29-4, I don't care who we played, those are good accomplishments.

team has to play the next 6 games with their hair on fire, they do that and they could still win it all.

 

[LuciousGameWinner]

The Bridges from Villanova is the real deal!!!!!

 

[SpartyNash]

The Bridges from Villanova is the real deal!!!!!

Miles can?t even claim he?s the best Bridges in college basketball for gods sake

?I love bridges, Golden Gate, London, Mackinac, Jeff? - Bill Walton

 

[Sbee]

If this team doesn't make the Final 4 I will consider it a waste, not before then though. Big Ten Champs, 29-4, I don't care who we played, those are good accomplishments.

team has to play the next 6 games with their hair on fire, they do that and they could still win it all.

my hope is that getting out of the big ten will help us and allow us to get the running game going. Big ten teams have designed concepts to take our transition game away, getting in outlet passing lanes, etc, some complex schemes that take more than a few days to execute well. Let's hope that's the case this year.

 

[Spartanmack]

my hope is that getting out of the big ten will help us and allow us to get the running game going. Big ten teams have designed concepts to take our transition game away, getting in outlet passing lanes, etc, some complex schemes that take more than a few days to execute well. Let's hope that's the case this year.

there's probably some truth to this with the possible exception of Virginia but there are other problems we will face like the fact that a lot of the teams are better offensively than we've faced in the B1G. Also unless we play our best ball control and toughest front court games, we're vulnerable TO and rebound margins that will cost us against teams - it will be tough to get passed dook if they don't improve there.

it would be really nice to see Izzo make some late season adjustments like let Winston take over games - reign him in when he's out of control, but give him more freedom to create or move Bridges down low when he's being guarded by smaller men he can't beat with the dribble. Bridges also has to be more assertive - didn't michigan have their point guard guarding him and shutting him down?