By:
Advanced search…

Welcome to Detroit Sports Forum!

By joining our community, you'll be able to connect with fellow fans that live and breathe Detroit sports just like you!

Get Started
  • If you are no longer able to access your account since our recent switch from vBulletin to XenForo, you may need to reset your password via email. If you no longer have access to the email attached to your account, please fill out our contact form and we will assist you ASAP. Thanks for your continued support of DSF.

BBWAA do not elect any player to HOF

Rebbiv said:
Career .281 BAVG

Career .275 BAVG Away (.288 Home)

Career .274 BAVG Grass (.293 Art. Turf)


Biggio was a very good player. Health, home park and longevity does wonders for stats. Just ask Cal Ripken.
Click to expand...

I think if you adjust for time periods and position played I think Tram is every bit the player that Biggio was. You are the stat guy....how do they compare taking era into consideration.
 
tomdalton22 said:
I think if you adjust for time periods and position played I think Tram is every bit the player that Biggio was. You are the stat guy....how do they compare taking era into consideration.
Click to expand...

Biggio played 20 years from 88-07. He did not become a 2B until 1992 and spent over 400 games at C and another 363 in the OF. Only once did he finish in the top 10 for defensive WAR for 2B, yet won 4 Gold Gloves.

Trammell played 20 years from 77-96. He spent his entire career as a SS, with 33 GS at 3B. 9 years he finished in the top 10 for defensive WAR and he won 4 Gold Gloves.


IMHO, Biggio's 1997 season was better than Trammell's 1987 season. Biggio stole 47, hit 22 HRs, hit .309/.415/.501 WITHOUT hitting into a double play.

As a hitter, I would rank Biggio higher than Trammell. As an all-around player, I would put them in the same league.

Trammell's issue is the number of games lost due to injuries and/or strikes (81, 94, 95). In his last 9 seasons, Trammell played more than 128 games in a season just once, 1990 (146). 458 games in his final 6 seasons alone.

Before turning age 33:

Trammell 6702 AB 1929 Hits .288 BAVG

Biggio 5750 AB 1680 Hits .292 BAVG

Trammell played 6 more years after 32 and would have had to average 179 hits a year to reach 3,000, he averaged 72.7. Biggio played 9 more years after 32 and only had to average 147 hits per year. He averaged 153.3 per year.

Played in 134 games or more

Biggio 17 of possible 18

Trammell 10 of possible 17
 
Rebbiv said:
Biggio played 20 years from 88-07. He did not become a 2B until 1992 and spent over 400 games at C and another 363 in the OF. Only once did he finish in the top 10 for defensive WAR for 2B, yet won 4 Gold Gloves.

Trammell played 20 years from 77-96. He spent his entire career as a SS, with 33 GS at 3B. 9 years he finished in the top 10 for defensive WAR and he won 4 Gold Gloves.


IMHO, Biggio's 1997 season was better than Trammell's 1987 season. Biggio stole 47, hit 22 HRs, hit .309/.415/.501 WITHOUT hitting into a double play.

As a hitter, I would rank Biggio higher than Trammell. As an all-around player, I would put them in the same league.

Trammell's issue is the number of games lost due to injuries and/or strikes (81, 94, 95). In his last 9 seasons, Trammell played more than 128 games in a season just once, 1990 (146). 458 games in his final 6 seasons alone.

Before turning age 33:

Trammell 6702 AB 1929 Hits .288 BAVG

Biggio 5750 AB 1680 Hits .292 BAVG

Trammell played 6 more years after 32 and would have had to average 179 hits a year to reach 3,000, he averaged 72.7. Biggio played 9 more years after 32 and only had to average 147 hits per year. He averaged 153.3 per year.

Played in 134 games or more

Biggio 17 of possible 18

Trammell 10 of possible 17
Click to expand...

Thanks....I feel they are pretty equal players as well.

With Biggio's great health and good production after the age of 33 and given the era in which he played I wonder if he had any "help"?
 
Three things...

1. Voters refuse to vote in 1st timers unless they are like Ripken, Gwynn, etc. That is stupid. No difference in Biggio in 2013 or 2014.

2. Steroids obviously hurt a number of players. I have no problem with that in Palmeiro, Sosa, Clemens, Bonds, and McGwire's cases. However, there is nothing on Piazza or Bagwell.

3. Morris got screwed! He did tick up 1%, but not enough. Tom Gage had a nice piece on him. Jack's overall wins and Ks are better than many in the HOF.

http://www.detroitnews.com/article/20130109/SPORTS0104/301090425/1129/rss15
 
The non ped users or the ones not tied to ped use in any way are getting screwed because they're being tied in with the ped era.
 
tycobb420 said:
Three things...

1. Voters refuse to vote in 1st timers unless they are like Ripken, Gwynn, etc. That is stupid. No difference in Biggio in 2013 or 2014.

2. Steroids obviously hurt a number of players. I have no problem with that in Palmeiro, Sosa, Clemens, Bonds, and McGwire's cases. However, there is nothing on Piazza or Bagwell.

3. Morris got screwed! He did tick up 1%, but not enough. Tom Gage had a nice piece on him. Jack's overall wins and Ks are better than many in the HOF.

http://www.detroitnews.com/article/20130109/SPORTS0104/301090425/1129/rss15
Click to expand...

#1 should be all the old voters should die and make way for a newer younger group of voters that realize steroids wer part of the game for over 20 years and probably even much further than that. For ALL of those years the MLB didnt give a shit about testing for those drugs or keeping the game clean....so why should the fan base care if the Hall is clean? Regardless, the steroid era belongs in the hall....one way or another. Its part of baseball history.
 
Last edited:
mhughes0021 said:
#1 should be all the old voters should die and make way for a newer younger group of voters that realize steroids wer part of the game for over 20 years and probably even much further than that. For ALL of those years the MLB didnt give a shit about testing for those drugs or keeping the game clean....so why should the fan base care if the Hall is clean? Regardless, the steroid era belongs in the hall....one way or another. Its part of baseball history.
Click to expand...

Something we agree on? lol
 
http://www.baseballamerica.com/today/majors/column/2012/2614540.html
Hall Vote Hurts Everyone.
from Baseball America

http://www.dugoutcentral.com/?p=2638
Team HOF vs. Team Reject.
from Dugout Central

http://fivethirtyeight.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/01/12/in-cooperstown-a-crowded-waiting-room/
In Cooperstown, a Crowded Waiting Room.
from Nate Silver's 538blog

http://espn.go.com/mlb/story/_/id/8831305/hall-famers-glad-barry-bonds-roger-clemens-denied
Webvideo No Players Elected To Hall Of Fame.
Tim Kurkjian, Buster Olney, Howard Bryant and Pedro Gomez react to the news that Baseball Hall of Fame voters didn't elect any candidates for induction into the Hall.
 
Last edited:
I never understood how writers got to keep their vote for voting for horseshit players. That's worse than leaving a guy off because you believe in no first ballot HOF. I mean, several votes for Sandy Alomar? Aaron Sele? And so forth..
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

About Us

Founded in 2011, Detroit Sports Forum is a community of fanatics dedicated to teams like the Lions, Tigers, Pistons, Red Wings, Wolverines, and more. We live and breathe Detroit sports!

Stay Connected

Forum statistics

Threads
35,031
Messages
1,131,172
Members
981
Latest member
harmony

Affiliates

    Discussion Hub
Back
Top