Game 35 - Tigers vs. Orioles - May 13, 7:05 PM, Camden Yards

[tigermud]

But this year like last year those numbers are inflated by our big showings and help hide when we actually have anemic days. Aside from 2 swings today by Miggy and Victor, today's performance was lackluster, but when the other team only scores once because of solid pitching, we don't notice as much.

Consistency is not a word I would use to describe this offense. I would call it Volcanic. Often dormant but always capable of erupting in great waves of devastation.

Thank you for that thumb I was trying to reply to this also but you said it perfectly

 

[Thumb]

to be fair the tigers have 6 players in the top 24 for batting average

5 in the top 30 for .OPS [AL] 2 in top 30 MLB

I hate batting average because it does not count all plate appearances, only at bats.

 

[Thumb]

Baltimore is brining up rookie Kevin Gausman to go againts JV tommorrow instead of Chen
FSD reports this is at least in part due showalter not wanting to throw a left hander againts the tigers offense as the stat data shows they haven't been as good againts righties so far this year..

The TV guys on MASN mentioned during the game that Showalter is doing it because Chen he not been able to pitch deep into games, and his spot in the rotation is in jeopardy.

Looking at his game logs seems like his PC gets up fast, the Tigers would surely be the cure for that! :lmao:

His splits show he's Coke like vs. lefties, but not terrible vs. RHB.

I think Balt. is making a mistake not starting him. [Wei-Yin Chen]

 

[Doak37]

5 in the top 30 for .OPS [AL] 2 in top 30 MLB

I hate batting average because it does not count all plate appearances, only at bats.

Batting average is almost garbage altogether. OPS is the best measure of a hitter.

Remember when Deivi Cruz led our team in batting average in 2000 with a .302 or something like that? Whatever it was, he was still by no means helpful on offense for us. I'd rather have a guy that hits .230 but draws walks and hits for a bit of power.

 

[tigermud]

The TV guys on MASN mentioned during the game that Showalter is doing it because Chen he not been able to pitch deep into games, and his spot in the rotation is in jeopardy.

Looking at his game logs seems like his PC gets up fast, the Tigers would surely be the cure for that! :lmao:

His splits show he's Coke like vs. lefties, but not terrible vs. RHB.

I think Balt. is making a mistake not starting him. [Wei-Yin Chen]

Interesting two different reasons given then between FSD and MASN sounds like, turth prolly somewhere in the middle, I'm just hoping Rod didn't jinx em again already by mentioning tonight that JV has never lost at Baltimore, he said something similar about the twins last week at home then 6 batters later...I wish he wouldn't do that. Lol

 

[Thumb]

Batting average is almost garbage altogether. OPS is the best measure of a hitter.

Remember when Deivi Cruz led our team in batting average in 2000 with a .302 or something like that? Whatever it was, he was still by no means helpful on offense for us. I'd rather have a guy that hits .230 but draws walks and hits for a bit of power.

Oh I know, I hate when people start raving about a players .BAvg because it's such a hollow stat. Just didn't want to open that can of worms at the time. People love to rave about Kinsler and rant about Avila based on .BAvg, but Avila gets on base at a higher rate, people need to look at more then just the old box score numbers to get a true understanding, and this can be done without becoming as many like to call us "Sabernerds".

 

[SouthOfMackinac]

But this year like last year those numbers are inflated by our big showings and help hide when we actually have anemic days. Aside from 2 swings today by Miggy and Victor, today's performance was lackluster, but when the other team only scores once because of solid pitching, we don't notice as much.

Consistency is not a word I would use to describe this offense. I would call it Volcanic. Often dormant but always capable of erupting in great waves of devastation.

The offense went dormant MORE often at this point last season, that was the point.

If anything last season had more big games. May 13th, 2013 the Tigers had one more game played and had scored 195 runs - this year's team has scored 169.

Last year's team scored 3 runs or less in a game 11 times by May 13th. This year's team has scored 3 runs or less in a game 12 times. Should I infer you did not think last year's offense was consistent either?

 

[Rebbiv]

Prior to last night's game.

1st Inning (0-3)
.198 BAVG .248 OBP .314 SLG .562 OPS (13th in AL, last year 2nd)

1st Batter of the Game (0-1)
.219 BAVG .265 OBP .281 SLG .546 OPS (13th in AL, last year 9th)

Leading Off An Inning (3-9, Martinez, Hunter and Avila)
.246 BAVG .289 OBP .377 SLG .666 OPS (12th in AL, last year 10th)

1st First Pitch Swinging
2nd RISP
3rd Men On3rd XBH %
t3rd OPS
5th Runs per game
7th Pitches Per PA
t11th in seeing 3-0 counts
t11th SB%
t11th XBT (Extra Base Taken)
13th in Walk %

The weakness for the Tiger's offense is taking a walk and/or working the count. We don't have patient hitters. We have hitters that can hit "mistake" pitches or what is in their typical zone. When an opposing pitcher is hitting his marks, we make most anyone look like Cy Young. It is when they start to tire and not hit their marks that we take advantage.

2013-2014 Walk Rates

2014 AL AVG 12.2 PA/BB

2013 AL AVG 13.1 PA/BB

2014 DET
Avila 6.7 PA/BB (8.2 PA/BB career)
A. Jackson 9.1 PA/BB (11.8 PA/BB career)
Romine 9.3 PA/BB (13.1 PA/BB career)
D. Kelly 12.3 PA/BB (14.4 PA/BB career)

J.D. Martinez 15.5 PA/BB (15.7 PA/BB career)
M. Cabrera 21.0 PA/BB (11.3 PA/BB career)
Kinsler 22.0 PA/BB (10.7 PA/BB career)
R. Davis 22.4 PA/BB (18.1 PA/BB career)
V. Martinez 27.0 PA/BB (12.4 PA/BB career)
Castellanos 29.5 PA/BB (13.3 PA/BB career minors)
T. Hunter 32.0 PA/BB (15.5 PA/BB career)

Those are some horrible walk rates by the bottom 6 players. Consistency comes from walk rates. When a team goes into a hitting slump, and all teams do, then they still get on base via the walk and still makes the opposing pitcher work and throw strikes.

The achilles heal for DET last year was hitting in Close/Late and anything after the 6th inning. They have reversed that this year.

 

[gotime909]

Prior to last night's game.

1st Inning (0-3)
.198 BAVG .248 OBP .314 SLG .562 OPS (13th in AL, last year 2nd)

1st Batter of the Game (0-1)
.219 BAVG .265 OBP .281 SLG .546 OPS (13th in AL, last year 9th)

Leading Off An Inning (3-9, Martinez, Hunter and Avila)
.246 BAVG .289 OBP .377 SLG .666 OPS (12th in AL, last year 10th)

1st First Pitch Swinging
2nd RISP
3rd Men On3rd XBH %
t3rd OPS
5th Runs per game
7th Pitches Per PA
t11th in seeing 3-0 counts
t11th SB%
t11th XBT (Extra Base Taken)
13th in Walk %

The weakness for the Tiger's offense is taking a walk and/or working the count. We don't have patient hitters. We have hitters that can hit "mistake" pitches or what is in their typical zone. When an opposing pitcher is hitting his marks, we make most anyone look like Cy Young. It is when they start to tire and not hit their marks that we take advantage.

2013-2014 Walk Rates

2014 AL AVG 12.2 PA/BB

2013 AL AVG 13.1 PA/BB

2014 DET
Avila 6.7 PA/BB (8.2 PA/BB career)
A. Jackson 9.1 PA/BB (11.8 PA/BB career)
Romine 9.3 PA/BB (13.1 PA/BB career)
D. Kelly 12.3 PA/BB (14.4 PA/BB career)

J.D. Martinez 15.5 PA/BB (15.7 PA/BB career)
M. Cabrera 21.0 PA/BB (11.3 PA/BB career)
Kinsler 22.0 PA/BB (10.7 PA/BB career)
R. Davis 22.4 PA/BB (18.1 PA/BB career)
V. Martinez 27.0 PA/BB (12.4 PA/BB career)
Castellanos 29.5 PA/BB (13.3 PA/BB career minors)
T. Hunter 32.0 PA/BB (15.5 PA/BB career)

Those are some horrible walk rates by the bottom 6 players. Consistency comes from walk rates. When a team goes into a hitting slump, and all teams do, then they still get on base via the walk and still makes the opposing pitcher work and throw strikes.

The achilles heal for DET last year was hitting in Close/Late and anything after the 6th inning. They have reversed that this year.

So you complained last year because of their lack of offense after the 6th inning. Now this year it's their start of the game offense. Some people just need to always have something to bitch about I guess.

 

[tomdalton22]

But this year like last year those numbers are inflated by our big showings and help hide when we actually have anemic days. Aside from 2 swings today by Miggy and Victor, today's performance was lackluster, but when the other team only scores once because of solid pitching, we don't notice as much.

Consistency is not a word I would use to describe this offense. I would call it Volcanic. Often dormant but always capable of erupting in great waves of devastation.

last year at this time they were shut out 3 times. This year they have been shut out one time.

 

[Rebbiv]

So you complained last year because of their lack of offense after the 6th inning. Now this year it's their start of the game offense. Some people just need to always have something to bitch about I guess.

And some people tend to always comment after another's post.

Some people complain about a bad bullpen and I don't see you jumping all over their nuts.

I am pointing out facts. Both last year and this year. If you don't like it, you don't have to address/comment on it.

 

[SouthOfMackinac]

Lots of numbers are really neat. I don't consider myself "old school" because I love stats, but you can NEVER replace the most important stat for me - the FINAL score.

There is no disputing that last year's Tiger team left the park without scoring runs more often than this season's team. The number of wins they had last season that were "pile on" wins was amazing.

To summarize the important statistic.

May 13th, 2013 21-15
May 13th, 2014 23-12

Games take different turns depending on the score. Situations arise in a 3-2 game that don't in a 10-3. That's the problem with numbers. You need human appraisal as they are being generated to make them relevant for a given situation. I would contend that last year's team hit so well late in games because they were often up by large leads and facing the other team's mop-up guy or the manager left a guy to finish off the mess in those situations. It still doesn't answer for the number of days their offense was anemic or worse.

I also think pitchers hit their spots more often against the Tigers. They prepare for this team so they don't get mauled. We've seen some guys have days against the Tigers (Keuchel and Hughes come to mind) where they looked like pitchers they aren't. Do we say it is the fault of the Tigers or do we credit a pitcher now and again?

K's are up all over baseball and the patience we grew up with is a thing of the past. Remember when a guy had little chance of making the majors until his K:BB ratio was at least 1:1?

 

[UMRules06]

I agree with Reb, if the Tigers are to become more consistent from game to game they've got to start increasing their walk rate to add that extra on-base element. Offense seems like it's been trending down in general across baseball the past few years, so I don't think what we're seeing is a uniquely Tigers problem.

 

[biggunsbob]

Just my opinion but I think Mario would be alot better if he wasn't paired with Rod Allen, I think he sounds bored because Rod Allen is so boring himself and repetitive.

Craig Monroe might be the worst Detroit sports analyst i've seen, but the Pistons have Mateen Cleaves who is cringe worthy as well. Tough to say who's worse out of those two.

Come on... C Moe is rocking a bow tie!!!!!

 

[manchild98]

last year at this time they were shut out 3 times. This year they have been shut out one time.

I'm not sure how much info we get from the shut out stat. Last year we were shut out 12 times in the regular season. Boston was shut out 11 times. Both if us were playoff teams and obviously, they went on to win the world series.

 

[Thumb]

last year at this time they were shut out 3 times. This year they have been shut out one time.

What does being shut out have to do with anything?

If we score 0 runs and lose or if we score only 1 or 2 runs and lose against weak pitching my point still remains.

Is there some consolation in losing but being able to say at least we weren't shut out? Because all losses are the same in the standings whether it's by 20 or 1.

 

[gotime909]

And some people tend to always comment after another's post.

Some people complain about a bad bullpen and I don't see you jumping all over their nuts.

I am pointing out facts. Both last year and this year. If you don't like it, you don't have to address/comment on it.

The fact is, every team is gonna have situations where they're near the bottom. Whether it be by the way the team is build or just luck. You seem to get hung up on one bad area and beat that dead horse silly.

Also, it's a message board, I'll address whoever the fuck I want.

 

[tomdalton22]

What does being shut out have to do with anything?

If we score 0 runs and lose or if we score only 1 or 2 runs and lose against weak pitching my point still remains.

Is there some consolation in losing but being able to say at least we weren't shut out? Because all losses are the same in the standings whether it's by 20 or 1.

If you don't score a run you can't win. Being shut out 3 times means there is no chance to win those games. Also, in the post season they were shut out 1-0 twice.

 

[Rebbiv]

The fact is, every team is gonna have situations where they're near the bottom. Whether it be by the way the team is build or just luck. You seem to get hung up on one bad area and beat that dead horse silly.

Also, it's a message board, I'll address whoever the fuck I want.

Yes it is a message board. Stop being the fucking message board police.

 

[gotime909]

Yes it is a message board. Stop being the fucking message board police.

Damn, somebody's got their manties in a bunch today