I just voted.

[tinselwolverine]

Check this one out, I know the right winger on here won't read it

essentially McDonalds blatantly pushes employees to get on public assistance to subsidize their low wages.

I shouldn't have to flip part of the bill so someone McDonalds can report higher earnings

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/...orker-a-budget-solution-Apply-for-food-stamps

You continue to slam a company that actually goes out of its way to provide employees a toll free McResources hotline?

The company didn't have to do that; it was a voluntary benefit the company provided out of its own generosity and sense of duty.

 

[Spartanmack]

Check this one out, I know the right winger on here won't read it

essentially McDonalds blatantly pushes employees to get on public assistance to subsidize their low wages.

I shouldn't have to flip part of the bill so someone McDonalds can report higher earnings

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/...orker-a-budget-solution-Apply-for-food-stamps

Is this supposed to be the big ah-ha? Is it supposed to prove something or reveal the man behind the curtain? The smoking gun that proves McDonald's is using the government to subsidize their cost of labor?

 

[Sbee]

Is this supposed to be the big ah-ha? Is it supposed to prove something or reveal the man behind the curtain? The smoking gun that proves McDonald's is using the government to subsidize their cost of labor?

You respond by failing to respond

are you ok with that? We flip the bill so they can profit more and keep the cost of their shitty food artificially low?

 

[Spartanmack]

false equivalency there, I'm talking about McDonalds with almost 500k employees and Walmart with over 2 million. I know you can point to some small sample size as a retort.

Are the southern manufacturers making $8 an hour and using our tax dollars to make ends meet?

It's not a false equivalency. I'm talking about doing the things to bring back high value manufacturing jobs and showing that it can be done because it is being done. You're talking about socialist policies to guarantee every job in America, no matter the skill involved pays enough to raise a family, put a roof overhead and food on the table.

And no, southern autoworkers are earning a competitive wage and benefit package, are happier than their union counterparts (although that could be due to the fact that they don't endure Detroit winters or dodge bullets on their way home from work) and not paying unions dues.

 

[tinselwolverine]

So anyways, the traveling salesman continues on his sojourn, and comes up another farm that has a particular curiosity about it - there is a pig hobbling about with one wooden leg.

So the salesman asks, the farmer, he asks "so how did that pig come to have a wooden leg?"

And the farmer says, he says, "well, sir, that is no ordinary pig - that is one special pig.

"A couple years back, my little daughter fell down into the well, and she was about to drown, but that pig, he lowered himself down into the well, and saved her life.

"Then, about a year or so ago, I was up on the tractor, and I fell off, and the tractor was about to run over my head, but that pig jumped up on that tractor, and put on the brake, and saved my life.

"Then, just earlier this year, the house was on fire, and the pig rushed in, an squealed and woke us all up, and saved all of their lives."

So the salesman says, he says "so how does that explain the wooden leg?"

And the farmer says, "well, when you got a special pig like that, you're not gonna just eat it all at once..."

 

[Sbee]

It's not a false equivalency. I'm talking about doing the things to bring back high value manufacturing jobs and showing that it can be done because it is being done. You're talking about socialist policies to guarantee every job in America, no matter the skill involved pays enough to raise a family, put a roof overhead and food on the table.

And no, southern autoworkers are earning a competitive wage and benefit package, are happier than their union counterparts (although that could be due to the fact that they don't endure Detroit winters or dodge bullets on their way home from work) and not paying unions dues.

not really relevant to the discussion here since they are being paid decent wages. You're missing the whole argument, pay fast food workers decent wages and we wouldn't have the problem.

I asked you before and you failed to answer, are you ok with fast food companies keeping wages low so full time employees have to get on public assistance?

 

[Spartanmack]

You respond by failing to respond

are you ok with that? We flip the bill so they can profit more and keep the cost of their shitty food artificially low?

I've already responded to this same point several times. I didn't see the point in doing it again but if you insist, here you go. Labor prices are primarily driven by supply and demand. Food stamps/welfare are at best a second order effect. Low skill jobs should not be priced according to profitability of the firm, regardless of the size of the firm. Small mom and pop firms would get killed even more than they already are because the price of their labor would have to go up inline w/ the big companies and then you would bitch even more about Walmart/McD etc. sticking it to the little guy.

 

[Spartanmack]

not really relevant to the discussion here since they are being paid decent wages. You're missing the whole argument, pay fast food workers decent wages and we wouldn't have the problem.

I asked you before and you failed to answer, are you ok with fast food companies keeping wages low so full time employees have to get on public assistance?

if you think it's not relevant to the discussion, then you're having a different discussion. Pay fast food workers decent or living wages and we would have tremendous problems. It won't work. Instead, focus on attracting higher value, higher paying jobs back and then less people would have to try to make ends might manning a register somewhere. If you think that's not an answer, fine. I'm done answering the same stupid question over and over.

 

[Sbee]

I've already responded to this same point several times. I didn't see the point in doing it again but if you insist, here you go. Labor prices are primarily driven by supply and demand. Food stamps/welfare are at best a second order effect. Low skill jobs should not be priced according to profitability of the firm, regardless of the size of the firm. Small mom and pop firms would get killed even more than they already are because the price of their labor would have to go up inline w/ the big companies and then you would bitch even more about Walmart/McD etc. sticking it to the little guy.

ok, then don't bitch about the large welfare state then. Smile as you pay additional taxes to keep the cost of a cheeseburger under a dollar, their shareholders thank you.

 

[grandy]

Regardless of how you feel about minimum wage, do you think the people of this country should be able to vote on both the establishment of a minimum wage as well as any increases?

 

[TheVictors]

It's already happened Red. The "ditch diggers" comment.

Only today it's not ditch diggers, it's service employees. The US job force/economy is increasingly made up of service workers like Starbucks and other restaurants and hotel/hospitality.

Not taken as literally digging ditches any longer, the world will always have tiered employment and pay.

The most overpaid job - BY FAR - in my opinion, are realtors. Why the fuck these ass clowns think they "earn" 6% of the sale price of a home for doing nothing more than the internet does is beyond me.

And with the recent boom here again in real estate, you hear plenty of bragging coming from that job type.

What a waste b

 

[TheVictors]

The firm is over 100 people and we have several quant trading teams that all do different things. 2 of them have astro-physics PhDs on their team, one team has a nuclear physicist and another is headed by a guy that led a team that built super computers at IBM. Not sure if he's technically a rocket scientist, but he could be if he chose that path. The 5th guy is just a math PhD (we have a few of those) but he's been described by others as being like C3PO except he speaks more languages. And we're just one firm. When I was on the sell side, the guy that ran the algorithmic trading business had a PhD in astro-physics from MIT and had worked at NASA and he hired mostly technical people with top tier academic pedigrees.

Point is there are lots of incredibly smart people working on Wall St but in Michchump's world, we're just a bunch of meatheads, sticking it to Main St and using pension money to fund steak dinners and strip clubs every night - and squandering insider trading profits on hookers, ferraris and midget tossing parties on private jets.

Yeah, I don't know too many idiots who are truly successful on Wall Street. Take the schmuck selling annuities to old people and compare him with Bill Gross and it's apples to oranges. Unfortunately most of "Main Street" interaction with Wall Street is by way of said annuity selling schmuck

 

[tinselwolverine]

Regardless of how you feel about minimum wage, do you think the people of this country should be able to vote on both the establishment of a minimum wage as well as any increases?

Well, we sort of do, in our representative democracy, just like the way we sort of vote on everything else...

 

[Spartanmack]

ok, then don't bitch about the large welfare state then. Smile as you pay additional taxes to keep the cost of a cheeseburger under a dollar, their shareholders thank you.

Again, it's not one or the other. There are other ways to fix this and introducing that into the discussion is not a false equivalent and it's not changing the subject. So until we pursue those other solutions, I'll continue to bitch about the large welfare state.

 

[Spartanmack]

Yeah, I don't know too many idiots who are truly successful on Wall Street. Take the schmuck selling annuities to old people and compare him with Bill Gross and it's apples to oranges. Unfortunately most of "Main Street" interaction with Wall Street is by way of said annuity selling schmuck

Or Barney Frank telling them via MSNBC that Wall St is evil.

 

[tinselwolverine]

Hey, I'm listening on the radio, and some group is doing report on the best place to live for liberals and conservatives.

Ann Arbor and Berkeley are way up on the list for liberals.

Sparks Nevada, Muncie Indiana, Boise Idaho, Gainesville Fl...Indio, California (that's out in the Palm Springs area) are the places for conservatives, the article states.

Bend Oregon is on the conservatives list; that's a little surprising...

 

[grandy]

Well, we sort of do, in our representative democracy, just like the way we sort of vote on everything else...

I'm talking ballot measures, like in this past election.

 

[TheVictors]

Bend is conservative, Eugene is liberal.

 

[Gulo Blue]

Okay...so there's this farmer, and for him, farming is for shit.

He's about to lose the land. So anyways, one day, this traveling salesman comes by, shows the farmer a rooster, and says to the farmer, he says "this here is a stud rooster. This here stud rooster will solve all your farming woes."

So anyways, the farmer, desperate that he is, parts with his last penny to purchase the stud rooster.

BAM!!!!


Shit on the farm changes dramatically - miraculously (figuratively speaking, so as to not offend either the believers nor the atheist here) for the better.

The crops are springing out of the ground, the eggs are springing out of the chickens, the calves are springing out of the cows, and they bulls? They're pretty much just springing.

Even the farmer is finally gettin' a little action again from ol' Mrs. McDonald.

So, anyways, one day the farmer gets up and goes outside, and to his dismay - the stud rooster is laying on its back; its neck twisted, its tongue dangling out the side of its beak, and a swarm of buzzards circling overhead.

The terrified farmer rushes to the stud rooster, and kneels next to him in a panic.

The stud rooster looks up at the farmer, smiles and gives him a little wink.

"No, I ain't dyin.' It's just, if ya wanna fuck a buzzard, ya gotta play their stupid game..."

I like it!

 

[tinselwolverine]

Or Barney Frank telling them via MSNBC that Wall St is evil.

Well, in Frank's defense, Bill O'Reilly didn't make him feel very welcome on Fox News...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Unj-kcGOe5I

Frank comes on at about 1:00