New Commit

[wolverine304]

Do you have a thing agaisnt camping? You say you don't understand why people hunt now that we don't have to. Well people don't have to go stay out in the woods but tons still do.

 

[lostleader]

Here is a good link that will fill in some of our gaps. Its even a study done in the UP, if that helps. Its not 100% clear but gives you a good idea. Heck some of this information even supports your argument.

http://www.outdoorlife.com/photos/gallery/hunting/2011/03/whats-killing-your-deer

 

[MAIZEandBLUE09]

Do you have a thing agaisnt camping? You say you don't understand why people hunt now that we don't have to. Well people don't have to go stay out in the woods but tons still do.

Nothing against camping. Enjoying the outdoors is different than enjoying killing. I'd suggest camping is a great alternative to hunting. If you say you hunt because you like the outdoors that doesn't justify why you have to kill the outdoors.

 

[MAIZEandBLUE09]

Here is a good link that will fill in some of our gaps. Its even a study done in the UP, if that helps. Its not 100% clear but gives you a good idea. Heck some of this information even supports your argument.

http://www.outdoorlife.com/photos/gallery/hunting/2011/03/whats-killing-your-deer

This doesn't just kinda prove my point - it exactly proves my point. Re-introduce wolves and there's your deer population control. No reason for hunters to hunt.

What's more important about this is that hunters aren't happy about the declining populations. They want MORE deer so they can shoot them - which disproves the whole "I hunt to keep down the population" theory. If that was true, hunters wouldn't be complaining "what's killing my deer".

 

[wolverine304]

The thrill of man vs wild.


Do you hate fishing? Lol

 

[lostleader]

Do you have a thing agaisnt camping? You say you don't understand why people hunt now that we don't have to. Well people don't have to go stay out in the woods but tons still do.

Nothing against camping. Enjoying the outdoors is different than enjoying killing. I'd suggest camping is a great alternative to hunting. If you say you hunt because you like the outdoors that doesn't justify why you have to kill the outdoors.

Cant eat my tent.

You understand that wolves will kill, because the enjoy killing right? Ask the guys out west about their elk populations and the studies done that show wolves killing, just for the kill. Caribou herds have been destroyed because of wolves that train their packs to kill on the calving grounds.

 

[lostleader]

Here is a good link that will fill in some of our gaps. Its even a study done in the UP, if that helps. Its not 100% clear but gives you a good idea. Heck some of this information even supports your argument.

http://www.outdoorlife.com/photos/gallery/hunting/2011/03/whats-killing-your-deer

This doesn't just kinda prove my point - it exactly proves my point. Re-introduce wolves and there's your deer population control. No reason for hunters to hunt.

No way you read that whole post. You only read the first slide!

 

[MAIZEandBLUE09]

The thrill of man vs wild.


Do you hate fishing? Lol

I like fishing - catch and release only. If I want a fish to eat I'll go to Meijer. Fishing is more about the chase and the catch. It would be like trying to trap a deer instead of shooting it.

If it was simply about just killing fish - like hunting - I could just throw a few cherry bombs into the water and be on my way.

 

[MAIZEandBLUE09]

This doesn't just kinda prove my point - it exactly proves my point. Re-introduce wolves and there's your deer population control. No reason for hunters to hunt.

No way you read that whole post. You only read the first slide!

I edited my post above so I re-state it here:

This quote "Hunters see less game in their hunting area" proves that hunting really has nothing to do with maintaining populations. If it did - they wouldn't care that "their deer" were going away. They'd be happy that the population was stabilizing. They're truly in it just to kill something. It's "their deer" to kill - not the wolves or anything else.

 

[MAIZEandBLUE09]

Nothing against camping. Enjoying the outdoors is different than enjoying killing. I'd suggest camping is a great alternative to hunting. If you say you hunt because you like the outdoors that doesn't justify why you have to kill the outdoors.

Cant eat my tent.

You understand that wolves will kill, because the enjoy killing right? Ask the guys out west about their elk populations and the studies done that show wolves killing, just for the kill. Caribou herds have been destroyed because of wolves that train their packs to kill on the calving grounds.

So what? If the wolves kill everything - the wolves die. At no point would the wolves be able to bring the population to 0 and live. The point is that if you want to control the population that is how you do it. The population is naturally outgrowing itself because we've destroyed all of the natural predictors.

 

[MAIZEandBLUE09]

Here's another good line from your articles:
"Many biologists work off of the estimate that an average wolf kills more than 20 adult deer each year"

So if hunters are killing around 400,000 deer each year, like your article states, and say each hunter kills 2 deer that's 200,000 hunters. That means you'd only need a population of 10,000 wolves to get the job done of 200,000 hunters.

 

[lostleader]

http://www.norcalblogs.com/gate/2010/08/photograpkic-proof-that-wolves-do-kill-without-wating-their-prey.php

http://www.rense.com/general93/idaho.htm

http://www.savewesternwildlife.org/sport-killing.html

All day, you don't want these babies near your poodle, or your kids!

 

[MAIZEandBLUE09]

http://www.norcalblogs.com/gate/2010/08/photograpkic-proof-that-wolves-do-kill-without-wating-their-prey.php

http://www.rense.com/general93/idaho.htm

http://www.savewesternwildlife.org/sport-killing.html

All day, you don't want these babies near your poodle, or your kids!

They were here before we were. You don't just kill things because they can kill you. We'd be dead as a species if we did that - and that's partially the reason there are huge problems with the ecosystem around the world. The fact is that wolves RARELY have attacked humans throughout history and there are only a small number of cases where they actually killed humans. Just like in every other state with dangerous animals you just have to be careful and attacks will, and do, happen on humans and pets once and a while. Michigan already has a small bear population up north and it causes little, if any, problem.

Just because they kill something without eating it doesn't mean anything. You just admitted you do the same thing.

 

[lostleader]

Here's another good line from your articles:
"Many biologists work off of the estimate that an average wolf kills more than 20 adult deer each year"

So if hunters are killing around 400,000 deer each year, like your article states, and say each hunter kills 2 deer that's 200,000 hunters. That means you'd only need a population of 10,000 wolves to get the job done of 200,000 hunters.

Start adding up the cost of 200,000 license and all the other gear that is bought. Not only introducing wolves bad for the environment is bad for the economy. The money spent on government snipers alone is astonishing, why pay for it to be done, when you can get it done and get paid. Your argument is unraveling, Sir.

 

[MAIZEandBLUE09]

Here's another good line from your articles:
"Many biologists work off of the estimate that an average wolf kills more than 20 adult deer each year"

So if hunters are killing around 400,000 deer each year, like your article states, and say each hunter kills 2 deer that's 200,000 hunters. That means you'd only need a population of 10,000 wolves to get the job done of 200,000 hunters.

Start adding up the cost of 200,000 license and all the other gear that is bought. Not only introducing wolves bad for the environment is bad for the economy. The money spent on government snipers alone is astonishing, why pay for it to be done, when you can get it done and get paid. Your argument is unraveling, Sir.

Never said it wasn't. I'm just saying I find it barbaric and pointless.

 

[lostleader]

http://www.norcalblogs.com/gate/2010/08/photograpkic-proof-that-wolves-do-kill-without-wating-their-prey.php

http://www.rense.com/general93/idaho.htm

http://www.savewesternwildlife.org/sport-killing.html

All day, you don't want these babies near your poodle, or your kids!

They were here before we were. You don't just kill things because they can kill you. We'd be dead as a species if we did that - and that's partially the reason there are huge problems with the ecosystem around the world. The fact is that wolves RARELY have attacked humans throughout history and there are only a small number of cases where they actually killed humans. Just like in every other state with dangerous animals you just have to be careful and attacks will, and do, happen on humans and pets once and a while. Michigan already has a small bear population up north and it causes little, if any, problem.

Just because they kill something without eating it doesn't mean anything. You just admitted you do the same thing.

Black bears rarely attack. People are rarely attacked because they are not around these animals. Get a pack of wolves in your subdivision and see how many dogs come up missing. When your out for your morning jog down the nice bike path, watch your ass.

 

[MAIZEandBLUE09]

They were here before we were. You don't just kill things because they can kill you. We'd be dead as a species if we did that - and that's partially the reason there are huge problems with the ecosystem around the world. The fact is that wolves RARELY have attacked humans throughout history and there are only a small number of cases where they actually killed humans. Just like in every other state with dangerous animals you just have to be careful and attacks will, and do, happen on humans and pets once and a while. Michigan already has a small bear population up north and it causes little, if any, problem.

Just because they kill something without eating it doesn't mean anything. You just admitted you do the same thing.

Black bears rarely attack. People are rarely attacked because they are not around these animals. Get a pack of wolves in your subdivision and see how many dogs come up missing. When your out for your morning jog down the nice bike path, watch your ass.

I would be fine with being a little more careful and I have an 8 foot fence in my back yard. No wolf is getting my dog.

 

[lostleader]

http://www.hcn.org/issues/315/16084
http://www.backpacker.com/fatal_wolf_attack_alaska/blogs/1703

 

[lostleader]

He is my poor, great tasting deer I shot!

 

[MAIZEandBLUE09]

http://www.hcn.org/issues/315/16084
http://www.backpacker.com/fatal_wolf_attack_alaska/blogs/1703

Yeah, and coconuts kill people too - should we dig up all coconut trees? I said it's rare - the fact you found a few cases proves my point. It is not a common occurrence.