OMFG I am going COMPLETELY CRAZY for March MADNESS

[MSUMatt28]

I don't understand why Goins is suddenly being shit on by some of your fan base. He was one of your better shooters and helped out a ton in the big moments.

To be honest, as a Michigan fan, I love when Ward is on the court. Every time State tried to get him involved in the post last night, the possession completely collapsed. He can't handle double teams, can't shoot past 10 feet, and he's not a good FT shooter. I think you guys are better without him on the court.

Whenever you guys enter the season with massive expectations, MSU always falls short or is massively underwhelming. State does better when they are under the radar.

Every season is so different. You have no idea who will improve, who will get worse, who will get hurt, etc. All I know is that in this Final 4, the championship was staring you in the face. I fully would have expected you to smash Virginia in the finals. Chances like this are rare.

Goins had a great year overall. Averaged 9 boards on the season and did a lot of little things that don't show up in the stats. He also shot 12 for 50 (that's 24% for you math majors) from 3 in the post-season (BTT and NCAAs). He was the one who usually got the least attention from the other team (Duke blanketed our wings, McQuaid in particular) and needed to be the one to knock a few down to keep the other teams honest. And for the most part in these late season games he didn't do that. Though there will always be the shot vs Duke.

As for Ward, the team's style changed out of necessity once he got injured and he didn't seem to fit (nor was he fully effective) once he returned, but he was having a very strong year up until that point. The question remains whether he and Tillman playing together is an effective lineup, though Tillman is starting to show some legitimate stretch 4 skills (hit a 3 vs Duke and Tech) to go along with all the other things he does well.

 

[Spartanmack]

I don't understand why Goins is suddenly being shit on by some of your fan base. He was one of your better shooters and helped out a ton in the big moments.

To be honest, as a Michigan fan, I love when Ward is on the court. Every time State tried to get him involved in the post last night, the possession completely collapsed. He can't handle double teams, can't shoot past 10 feet, and he's not a good FT shooter. I think you guys are better without him on the court.

Whenever you guys enter the season with massive expectations, MSU always falls short or is massively underwhelming. State does better when they are under the radar.

Every season is so different. You have no idea who will improve, who will get worse, who will get hurt, etc. All I know is that in this Final 4, the championship was staring you in the face. I fully would have expected you to smash Virginia in the finals. Chances like this are rare.

I wouldn't say it's all that sudden. I've never liked Goins as a player. He had a couple games where he shot well this year but was never the kind of player you could count on to contribute on offense with any consistency.

Ward was better in the post last night than Tillman - he's a beast and has much better post moves. He got into foul trouble and when he was on the floor, he couldn't get a call down low despite getting mugged a few times. He's not perfect - bad foul shooter as you pointed out and doesn't have much range, but he's a post player.

I think that "Izzo only does well when MSU is under the radar" thing is a bit of a myth too. Izzo has taken teams w/ big expectations deep - won the title with that kind of team. But he's also fallen massively short a couple times - nobody seems to remember the title or FF teams that were supposed to be there.

Every season is different, no doubt. This team massively outperformed expectations. As good as TT defense is and as bad as we played against it, if we shot better, we could have beaten them but I wouldn't expect us to smash uva - i'd expect to win though. I still think next years team will be better on paper and hopefully on the floor. But there are a lot of other factors within and beyond their control that go into making a run in the tournament.

 

[rumseyhouse77]

Congratulations to MSU on a great season. Big 10 regular season champs, Big 10 tournament champs, beating Michigan 3 times, and making it to the final 4. Above expectations. Unfortunately, you ran into a TT team that was hitting its stride at the right time. TT reminds me of Michigan when the offense was working earlier in the season. As I said before I think TT will win it all.

 

[dubbsco]

I wouldn't say it's all that sudden. I've never liked Goins as a player. He had a couple games where he shot well this year but was never the kind of player you could count on to contribute on offense with any consistency.

Ward was better in the post last night than Tillman - he's a beast and has much better post moves. He got into foul trouble and when he was on the floor, he couldn't get a call down low despite getting mugged a few times. He's not perfect - bad foul shooter as you pointed out and doesn't have much range, but he's a post player.

I think that "Izzo only does well when MSU is under the radar" thing is a bit of a myth too. Izzo has taken teams w/ big expectations deep - won the title with that kind of team. But he's also fallen massively short a couple times - nobody seems to remember the title or FF teams that were supposed to be there.

Every season is different, no doubt. This team massively outperformed expectations. As good as TT defense is and as bad as we played against it, if we shot better, we could have beaten them but I wouldn't expect us to smash uva - i'd expect to win though. I still think next years team will be better on paper and hopefully on the floor. But there are a lot of other factors within and beyond their control that go into making a run in the tournament.

We will have to agree to disagree about Ward. The way you feel about Goins is the way I feel about Ward. Since he's been at State, I have just not been impressed by anything with his game. Nothing about him is smooth or refined. He tries bully ball a lot, and can get away with it against some, but not the better post defenders. He's a liability at the line, can't hit a jumper, and is not very athletic (relative to what we consider athletes in college basketball). Not only that, he just has not figured out how to handle double teams at all; he continues to panic every time he even senses they are coming.

The sport is so dynamic. Teams improve, teams regress, teams surprise, etc... MSU could be the best team in the country but face someone in the tournament that gives them trouble. As a fan, it pains me how close Michigan has got to winning a title (title game 13, 18), and how ridiculously impossible it is just to get that far.

 

[MSUMatt28]

We will have to agree to disagree about Ward. The way you feel about Goins is the way I feel about Ward. Since he's been at State, I have just not been impressed by anything with his game. Nothing about him is smooth or refined. He tries bully ball a lot, and can get away with it against some, but not the better post defenders. He's a liability at the line, can't hit a jumper, and is not very athletic (relative to what we consider athletes in college basketball). Not only that, he just has not figured out how to handle double teams at all; he continues to panic every time he even senses they are coming.

The sport is so dynamic. Teams improve, teams regress, teams surprise, etc... MSU could be the best team in the country but face someone in the tournament that gives them trouble. As a fan, it pains me how close Michigan has got to winning a title (title game 13, 18), and how ridiculously impossible it is just to get that far.

Which is why to say this year could be MSU's best chance in awhile isn't necessarily true. This was a reasonably strong Final Four even if there was no juggernaut team there (without Duke). I'd felt from FEbruary onward that 11 teams had stood above the rest in college basketball and the Final Four consisted of 3 of those teams and an Auburn team that was pre-season Top 10 that got on a roll. Sure there was opportunity there, but the other 3 teams can all say the same thing. MSU also had a pretty darn tough path just to get to the Final Four. Unlike say UM last year or MSU in 2010 where after we beat Maryland at the buzzer our path was cleared because a dominant Kansas team suffered a monumental upset and then also an OSU team that had bested us in the regular season also went down. It's possible some other year maybe the path to get there opens up similarly and just avoiding getting upset is the name of the game.

I guess the trick is to continue putting strong teams on the floor, getting high seeds, and hope that some of the time things break in your favor in the tournament. If MSU continues to do that (and again next year COULD be a strong year) there will be chances. Think of all the NCAA failures by Duke and Kansas over the years. But they're there with usually a 1 or 2 seed nearly every year and then some of the years it works out.

 

[tinselwolverine]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=TFVroy_aTFM

 

[dubbsco]

Which is why to say this year could be MSU's best chance in awhile isn't necessarily true. This was a reasonably strong Final Four even if there was no juggernaut team there (without Duke). I'd felt from FEbruary onward that 11 teams had stood above the rest in college basketball and the Final Four consisted of 3 of those teams and an Auburn team that was pre-season Top 10 that got on a roll. Sure there was opportunity there, but the other 3 teams can all say the same thing. MSU also had a pretty darn tough path just to get to the Final Four. Unlike say UM last year or MSU in 2010 where after we beat Maryland at the buzzer our path was cleared because a dominant Kansas team suffered a monumental upset and then also an OSU team that had bested us in the regular season also went down. It's possible some other year maybe the path to get there opens up similarly and just avoiding getting upset is the name of the game.

I guess the trick is to continue putting strong teams on the floor, getting high seeds, and hope that some of the time things break in your favor in the tournament. If MSU continues to do that (and again next year COULD be a strong year) there will be chances. Think of all the NCAA failures by Duke and Kansas over the years. But they're there with usually a 1 or 2 seed nearly every year and then some of the years it works out.

Going to back to back Final 4s is damn near impossible. So, it will be a serious uphill climb to repeat this year's success.

Izzo is getting closer and closer to the finish line of his career. There is really not that much time left to give away chances like this.

 

[Michchamp]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=TFVroy_aTFM

That looks like some extremely dumb rioting.

Not like they did much better on the losing campus... there were ONLY 23 arrests and 10 burned couches last night, according to East Lansing's Finest.

Spartan kiddies these days wouldn't know how to riot if you handed them a 30-pack of Natty-Ice and a map...



(I kinda feel like MSU riot news deserves it's own thread for old time's sake).

 

[Michchamp]

That looks like some extremely dumb rioting.

...

Although, I guess rioting is always extremely dumb, by definition.

maybe if people are starving, and it's a bread riot it's somewhat excusable.

 

[Spartanmack]

We will have to agree to disagree about Ward. The way you feel about Goins is the way I feel about Ward. Since he's been at State, I have just not been impressed by anything with his game. Nothing about him is smooth or refined. He tries bully ball a lot, and can get away with it against some, but not the better post defenders. He's a liability at the line, can't hit a jumper, and is not very athletic (relative to what we consider athletes in college basketball). Not only that, he just has not figured out how to handle double teams at all; he continues to panic every time he even senses they are coming.

The sport is so dynamic. Teams improve, teams regress, teams surprise, etc... MSU could be the best team in the country but face someone in the tournament that gives them trouble. As a fan, it pains me how close Michigan has got to winning a title (title game 13, 18), and how ridiculously impossible it is just to get that far.

he's more athletic than you think - he's not Charles Barkley but he runs the floor and finishes really well for a guy his size and his jumper isn't that bad, same with FTs - I think he shoots in the mid 60s. And he doesn't get pushed around like Goins or even Tillman. Goins was a good rebounder but beyond that, he was basically useless. I'm not saying Ward is a world beater but there's not doubt in my mind he adds way more than Goins.

Just about anything can happen between now and next year, but if we have the lineup I think we'll have, we're going to be a tough out for anybody. Assuming they stay healthy (we've had some shit luck with injuries the last 5 or 6 years) and there are no major locker room issues (currently no indication that's a problem) this team will be capable of another deep run so long as they can handle the expectations.

Heading into a dry season for me - not a baseball fan and the Red Wings stink so I'll be looking forward to CFB kickoff and every now and then thinking about what could have been this year.

 

[dubbsco]

he's more athletic than you think - he's not Charles Barkley but he runs the floor and finishes really well for a guy his size and his jumper isn't that bad, same with FTs - I think he shoots in the mid 60s. And he doesn't get pushed around like Goins or even Tillman. Goins was a good rebounder but beyond that, he was basically useless. I'm not saying Ward is a world beater but there's not doubt in my mind he adds way more than Goins.

Just about anything can happen between now and next year, but if we have the lineup I think we'll have, we're going to be a tough out for anybody. Assuming they stay healthy (we've had some shit luck with injuries the last 5 or 6 years) and there are no major locker room issues (currently no indication that's a problem) this team will be capable of another deep run so long as they can handle the expectations.

Heading into a dry season for me - not a baseball fan and the Red Wings stink so I'll be looking forward to CFB kickoff and every now and then thinking about what could have been this year.

The irony is that the Red Wings being bad is good for the franchise... They were on pace to be the 2nd worst team in the NHL, but decided to rip off like 7 straight wins and slid up two spots in the lottery. They took a page out of the Pistons' book.

 

[Spartanmack]

The irony is that the Red Wings being bad is good for the franchise... They were on pace to be the 2nd worst team in the NHL, but decided to rip off like 7 straight wins and slid up two spots in the lottery. They took a page out of the Pistons' book.

yeah, I'm afraid it's gonna be awhile - and it sucks. When I had the time to watch games every night, deep runs in the NHL playoffs were among the best sports experiences. I would rank them college football, college hoops, then either NHL playoffs or golf majors. College hockey is awesome too but it's much harder to follow.

 

[MSUMatt28]

After March madness ends I end up taking a bit of a sports break too. Follow the NBA playoffs but don't go out of my way to watch the games. Don't really care about baseball until August/September. Have never given two shits about hockey, (and please god can I not ever hear another word about the NFL draft until it's actually done?) Otherwise, it's wait until football season.


And that's all good anyway. The weather gets nice and all my kids get going heavy with Spring outdoor sports and I'd rather watch them play anyway.

 

[Spartanmack]

After March madness ends I end up taking a bit of a sports break too. Follow the NBA playoffs but don't go out of my way to watch the games. Don't really care about baseball until August/September. Have never given two shits about hockey, (and please god can I not ever hear another word about the NFL draft until it's actually done?) Otherwise, it's wait until football season.


And that's all good anyway. The weather gets nice and all my kids get going heavy with Spring outdoor sports and I'd rather watch them play anyway.

On net, we're basically in the same boat except I couldn't care less about the nfl draft even when it's happening or after. And it would be tough for me to disagree more on the NHL/NBA. I've been a seller of the NBA since the early 90s expansion but playoff hockey is awesome. It's the only pro sport I really watch at all.

I know the level of play is light years better for pro football and basketball vs college but I just can't get into it. Maybe it's because I've moved to towns of teams I don't like (Chicago then New York) and have been really turned off by the fan bases. Also, the atmosphere at a college football tailgate and game blows away the NFL experience in my opinion. I'd be embarrassed to take my kids to a Giants game. And the Jets? Forget it. You can pay several hundred per ticket to sit in some of the best seats in the stadium and it's all "F" bombs and awful behavior of drunken knuckleheads.

 

[TheVictors]

After March madness ends I end up taking a bit of a sports break too. Follow the NBA playoffs but don't go out of my way to watch the games. Don't really care about baseball until August/September. Have never given two shits about hockey, (and please god can I not ever hear another word about the NFL draft until it's actually done?) Otherwise, it's wait until football season.


And that's all good anyway. The weather gets nice and all my kids get going heavy with Spring outdoor sports and I'd rather watch them play anyway.

Completely agree (though I do like hockey playoffs)

 

[Michchamp]

I decided I'm going to follow baseball more closely this year, and see if it's as rewarding of an experience as some of the old timers say.

Seems pretty tough though... I find it harder to keep up with than many other sports. too many games.

I might shelve the idea until I'm retired.

 

[tomdalton22]

I decided I'm going to follow baseball more closely this year, and see if it's as rewarding of an experience as some of the old timers say.

Seems pretty tough though... I find it harder to keep up with than many other sports. too many games.

I might shelve the idea until I'm retired.

I don't follow baseball but I do follow the Tigers very closely. I like that there are games almost every day. I rarely watch an entire game but will catch portions of many. I like looking at the box scores every morning to see if they won, how guys played, etc.

For me, watching baseball & golf are relaxing.

 

[boogerlovejoy]

I don't follow baseball but I do follow the Tigers very closely. I like that there are games almost every day. I rarely watch an entire game but will catch portions of many. I like looking at the box scores every morning to see if they won, how guys played, etc.

For me, watching baseball & golf are relaxing.

I agree 100%. One of my favorite things in the world to do is lay down on a Sunday afternoon and watch/listen to the Tiger game. Sometimes I sleep....sometimes I just watch.....but it?s a great way to relax.

 

[biggunsbob]

Baseball is fun when your team has a shot at the title. The run the Tigers had from 2006 to 2015 was fun. Wish we had snagged a title . I could watch most of a game back then. Now it is a struggle to get excited. I just love baseball histoy. The box score of a baseball game is just amazing. The fact that we have stats that dates back to the 1800’s is so cool. We all know this years Tigers will probably lose 90 to 100 games and that is sad. But they have started great and we are in first place after 10 games. I like the youth movement just wish we could get that generational player. But then again I like all the he sports lol.. I was watch YouTube of a cricket player Chris Gayle and his shots were amazing !

 

[thewolverines24]

I'm looking forward to the NHL playoffs. Hoping it's not an early exit for the Pens.

Any hope of me really enjoying the NBA playoffs exploded with Victor Oladipo's knee. Pacers have won 3 of their last 10 games. Really limping into the playoffs with no chance of winning it.

I kind of root for the Pirates in MLB just because the Indianapolis Indians are their AAA team. Kind of cool watching the guys come up here and then move on to the Pirates. Still, I haven't been much of a baseball fan since my cousin retired from the league after the 2011 season.

I have my first kiddo on the way. Due at the end of July, so my summer is really just waiting and getting ready for her to get here.