Russell Wilson....lol

[tomdalton22]

Don't know. But individual stats in a team sport don't tell a 100% accurate picture. Everyone wants to point to stats as the end all be all, but we don't live in a vacuum where all other things are equal.
That being said, this is a no win argument because of the fact that we don't live in a vacuum. I, like Tony, think Wilson is good, but a little overrated because of the team he's on. Would he be as good on a team like the Raiders? Who knows. What we do know is that the Hawks were a QB away from being a damn good team before he showed up. Perfect situation for him, and he took advantage of it. I'm not taking anything away from him, just my opinion.

we can all make arguments that can't be proven. One could argue that Stafford has had a better situation because he has had the advantage of throwing the ball to the best WR in football. I wouldn't make that argument just like I don't think Wilson is a better QB because he is on the Seahawks.

 

[brewer229]

That all may be true, but the one thing that isn't factored into this is that he's on a better TEAM. I think that if Stafford was on a better team, he would be miles ahead of Wilson... but that's something that can't be proven and is just an opinion.

Prior to his arrival they were 4-12, 5-11, 7-9, 7-9. With offense ranked 25, 25, 23, 23 in scoring. Since Wilson has been QB they have been ranked 9, 8, 10, 4. With records of 11-5, 13-3, 12-4, 10-6

Obviously no one is saying it is all Wilson, he is on a very good team. However, if you were to look at individual talent on the offense at the other positions, you may very well think that the Lions have more offensive talent than the Seahawks.

The Lions o-line was consistently rated higher in pass protection than the Seattle o-line. The pass catchers you would give the advantage to the lions. Seattle has had better production from their RB for most years.

Obviously opinions differ. Watching both play my opinion is Wilson is significantly better. (Significantly being the differences from maybe the 5th best in the world to the 15th best in the world at what they do). I can also backup with my opinion with stats and facts, so I'm going to do that.

With Stafford, opinion is backup up with opinion.

My opinion is that since people are fans of this team, they tend to prop up their guy and downplay another, because they want their guy to be better. No one likes being the crappy one. A

Now Stafford, when asked to throw shorter routes and basically play a dumb downed offense did show improvement down the stretch. Will that carry over into next year when the games matter and we play good defenses? Who knows.

 

[jared]

Prior to his arrival they were 4-12, 5-11, 7-9, 7-9. With offense ranked 25, 25, 23, 23 in scoring. Since Wilson has been QB they have been ranked 9, 8, 10, 4. With records of 11-5, 13-3, 12-4, 10-6

Obviously no one is saying it is all Wilson, he is on a very good team. However, if you were to look at individual talent on the offense at the other positions, you may very well think that the Lions have more offensive talent than the Seahawks.

The Lions o-line was consistently rated higher in pass protection than the Seattle o-line. The pass catchers you would give the advantage to the lions. Seattle has had better production from their RB for most years.

Obviously opinions differ. Watching both play my opinion is Wilson is significantly better. (Significantly being the differences from maybe the 5th best in the world to the 15th best in the world at what they do). I can also backup with my opinion with stats and facts, so I'm going to do that.

With Stafford, opinion is backup up with opinion.

My opinion is that since people are fans of this team, they tend to prop up their guy and downplay another, because they want their guy to be better. No one likes being the crappy one. A

Now Stafford, when asked to throw shorter routes and basically play a dumb downed offense did show improvement down the stretch. Will that carry over into next year when the games matter and we play good defenses? Who knows.

Its amazing that civil debate can happen when everyone acts like an adult. I like this argument.

I think that Wilson had an elite year, and is just below that first tier of QBs. Another year or two at this production level may raise him to that top tier.

I think that Stafford had a very good year, and is just below that second tier of QBs. With some consistent production (something he has never been able to maintain) he could get into the top 5-10 in the league. Talent wise, he is there. He just seems to have a million dollar arm and a five cent brain sometimes.

 

[jdeb]

Staff on the Seahawks = no Superbowl... Lol

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[sggatecl]

5000 yards isn't the problem. And this wasn't even about Matt sucks but the fact Wilson was better. Plus, are you forgetting your sig? Not like you haven't bashed our QB in the past.

I bash people that have unrealistic expectations of him. I know exactly what he is. Read the sig again maybe.

The 5,000 yards was tongue in cheek. I'm well aware of what Matt's problems are. I'm just sick of hearing them every single god damned off season like a broken record. And this thread may have been about Wilson originally, it has morphed into a Stafford v Wilson debate in some ways.

 

[Mitchrapp]

I bash people that have unrealistic expectations of him. I know exactly what he is. Read the sig again maybe.

The 5,000 yards was tongue in cheek. I'm well aware of what Matt's problems are. I'm just sick of hearing them every single god damned off season like a broken record. And this thread may have been about Wilson originally, it has morphed into a Stafford v Wilson debate in some ways.

It happens. Threads get derailed all the time, on many boards. Lions board just get more vocal but it's really not that different than anywhere else..

Just look at the game threads. They used to be awesome. Now everyone yay's when a play is made and groans when one isn't.

You're not alone in being sick of hearing about the same ole same ole. Unless there's a better plan out there I don't know what to tell you.

 

[tonyballs]

If Wilson had thrown it as much as Stafford, the difference in YPA would have amounted to an extra 890 passing yards in 2016, or 55.6 yards per game, or 5 extra first downs per game.

He would have had 4914 yds, 42 TDs and 10 INTs.

He was the absolute model of efficiency this year.

Stafford had a very good year, too. The fact that Wilson had a better one isn't an attack on Matt.

But he doesn't throw it more because they're a team that relies on their running game and their defense. It's not rocket science lol. I know Wilson had a good year, i never disputed that. I just don't think his year was hand over fist better than Staffords

 

[tonyballs]

1 yard is 10% more of a first down. 1 Yard is huge.
Could be the difference between a 4th and 3 at the 27 compared to a 1st and 10 at the 30.

But yes yards are not the whole story what so ever. No matter what you look at Wilson is just a little better than Stafford in everything. Efficiency, accuracy, scoring, wins, decision making and a lot better in running and extending plays. When you factor in all the things, those being a little better in a lot of area and a lot better in a few, make you a much better QB.

1 yard isn't huge when talking about a QB throwing the ball 7 yards instead of 8. It's peanuts. When it comes to RBs, 1 yard is huge.

 

[brewer229]

The running game which Wilson is a huge part of. Wilson has been the second lead in rusher on his team every year. He just adds so much to that team.

 

[tonyballs]

I bash people that have unrealistic expectations of him. I know exactly what he is. Read the sig again maybe.

The 5,000 yards was tongue in cheek. I'm well aware of what Matt's problems are. I'm just sick of hearing them every single god damned off season like a broken record. And this thread may have been about Wilson originally, it has morphed into a Stafford v Wilson debate in some ways.

And that's the hilarity part of it. I made it about Wilson, not Stafford. Doom and Gloom Club turned it into a debate lol. I blame myself really. You rip on another player from a different team and it's almost automatic that "Lions fans" start bashing on their own guys...lol.

 

[cheeno]

And that's the hilarity part of it. I made it about Wilson, not Stafford. Doom and Gloom Club turned it into a debate lol. I blame myself really. You rip on another player from a different team and it's almost automatic that "Lions fans" start bashing on their own guys...lol.

In the first place make a post ripping on anybody? In the second place why do it other than to open up that player's merits for debate. And is it any stretch that Lions fans would use their own QB as a measuring stick if we are debating the merits of Wilson? Who else should we compare him to Blake Bortles?

I love typing Blake Bortles, I love saying Blake Bortles, when I was a kid I used to like the Teenage Mutant Ninja Bortles.

 

[tonyballs]

In the first place make a post ripping on anybody? In the second place why do it other than to open up that player's merits for debate. And is it any stretch that Lions fans would use their own QB as a measuring stick if we are debating the merits of Wilson? Who else should we compare him to Blake Bortles?

I love typing Blake Bortles, I love saying Blake Bortles, when I was a kid I used to like the Teenage Mutant Ninja Bortles.

Why compare him to Stafford? It wasn't a "who's better than who" thread. I was simply pointing out how the Rams shut him down and the Wilson lovers morphed into a debate...lol. Comedy at its finest. Then all of a sudden RW had this phenomenal season and he's The Chosen One again. The NFLN is slobbering all over his nuts and Michael Silver did a disgusting piece pretty much telling everyone that their teams are useless and the Seahawks are raising the Lombardi trophy. Did anyone see that btw? It was fkn disturbing really. Personally, I cant wait until the Vikings beat them this week.....that's my Super Bowl lol

 

[brewer229]

Why compare him to Stafford? It wasn't a "who's better than who" thread. I was simply pointing out how the Rams shut him down and the Wilson lovers morphed into a debate...lol. Comedy at its finest. Then all of a sudden RW had this phenomenal season and he's The Chosen One again. The NFLN is slobbering all over his nuts and Michael Silver did a disgusting piece pretty much telling everyone that their teams are useless and the Seahawks are raising the Lombardi trophy. Did anyone see that btw? It was fkn disturbing really. Personally, I cant wait until the Vikings beat them this week.....that's my Super Bowl lol

See, the thing is this post came right after another debate in a different thread in which you and others (myself included) were comparing Wilson to Stafford. So starting a new thread about Wilson which was along your original thought in a previous thread that Wilson and Staff being equal is naturally going to bring up the comparison again.

It's not like there was not mention of Wilson no this board and you just suddenly brought him out of nowhere just to hate on him.

 

[jdeb]

See, the thing is this post came right after another debate in a different thread in which you and others (myself included) were comparing Wilson to Stafford. So starting a new thread about Wilson which was along your original thought in a previous thread that Wilson and Staff being equal is naturally going to bring up the comparison again.

It's not like there was not mention of Wilson no this board and you just suddenly brought him out of nowhere just to hate on him.

I agree

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[dubbsco]

Who cares where the discussion goes? Isn't that the purpose of a discussion board?

If this was just about Russell Wilson, it would be boring. Comparing him to others is what sports is all about.

 

[tomdalton22]

Who cares where the discussion goes? Isn't that the purpose of a discussion board?

If this was just about Russell Wilson, it would be boring. Comparing him to others is what sports is all about.

especially for Lions fans after the regular season is over!

 

[sggatecl]

Who cares where the discussion goes? Isn't that the purpose of a discussion board?

If this was just about Russell Wilson, it would be boring. Comparing him to others is what sports is all about.

I'm one of Stafford's biggest critics but when the conversation always goes back to the same place, it's just as boring.

 

[tonyballs]

Who cares where the discussion goes? Isn't that the purpose of a discussion board?

If this was just about Russell Wilson, it would be boring. Comparing him to others is what sports is all about.

Because the thread wasn't about Stafford, numb nuts. Clue the **** in. Stafford haters felt they needed to highjack the thread for some ****ing reason...

 

[tonyballs]

I agree

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I dont

 

[tonyballs]

See, the thing is this post came right after another debate in a different thread in which you and others (myself included) were comparing Wilson to Stafford. So starting a new thread about Wilson which was along your original thought in a previous thread that Wilson and Staff being equal is naturally going to bring up the comparison again.

It's not like there was not mention of Wilson no this board and you just suddenly brought him out of nowhere just to hate on him.

If there was another thread referring Staff and RW, then ****ing keep it over there. But no, you tards cant help yourselves lol