Sources: NCAA investigating Michigan football for alleged rule violations related to

[wlvrnstlr4life]

One of the articles state the point of the rule is to protect programs that don't have the resources to send scouts all over the country to record opponents signs. I think it's not illegal for in-game because 1) everyone is going to try to do it 2) it's impossible to police and 3) everyone can do it, not just the rich teams.

As for the reimbursements, I doubt they need to prove that - although it would certainly be more obvious if there is an auditable trail of money. If he was instructed to do it and paid a salary, that's likely all they need.

Its a rule from 1994 because of the disparity in big school to small school money. This argument does not hold anymore. Everyone has been making money the past 15 yrs and EVERYONE has enough to do so. Before 1994, they had dudes with big ass camera recorders in the stands recording lips and hand signals. Should we asterisk every National Champion before '94?

Not saying this yelling at you, just saying.

 

[biggunsbob]

Ncaa is making Billions. Give every college the equipment to radio plays into helmets on offense and defense. Problem solved for sign stealing.

 

[bphillips4gg]

This dude was a bigger fan than any of us. It's looking more and more likely that this dude paid for all these tickets out of his own pocket and of his own volition in order to impress the staff. What a nerd.

https://soldierstosidelines.org/blog/cotm-jan-2022/

 

[biggunsbob]

Decent article

https://mgoblog.com/content/more-sign-stuff

 

[Michchamp]

I think this is all clearly bullshit, and the fact that it's coming out DURING THE FUCKING SEASON, shows someone has it in for Michigan football.

There seems to be a pretty clear divide among coaches, fans, writers, etc. between those saying that - even assuming this guy was operating at the direction of the coaching staff and the allegations are accurate - to single Michigan out over this is bullshit, and it's something that goes on constantly and is not policed, AND those that are pulling their hair out/clutching their pearls and claiming we only won as many games as we did because of cheating and should have to forfeit all out wins going back to (pick date of the whiner's team's losing streak to Michigan started)

 

[bphillips4gg]

Yoder saying his sources are telling him that Stallions was buying tickets for military friends returning from deployment. It's Yoder so that probably rules this theory out.

 

[thewolverines24]

NCAA considered repealing the rule in 2021:

"The Board of Directors Infractions Process Committee requested that the Legislative Committee Modernization of the Rules Subcommittee focus its rules modernization efforts on identifying rules that no longer serve the needs of the membership and the 21st century student-athlete, and recommending modifications to or the elimination of such rules. Specifically, livestreams of intercollegiate competition and prerecorded game film are readily available in the digital age. The minimal competitive advantage gained by scouting future opponents in-person is outweighed by the monitoring and enforcement burdens of ensuring compliance with the legislation."

This never mattered.

 

[Spartanmack]

So one of two things is true. Either Thamel is a complete moron or he is knowingly publishing incorrect information because has an agenda. Either way his credibility on this entire situation is gone.

Based on this report Michigan and Stallions did not break any rules. The advanced scouting rule applies to staffers and coaches of the team. The story being circulated now is that Stallions provided tickets for students at the schools where the future opponents were playing. That's not against the rules.

The rules regarding recording equipment are regarding the game that you're currently playing. It has nothing to do with other games and has nothing to do with individuals who are not affiliated with the school recording what they want at games.

Thamel is conflating the two rules and reaching on what constitutes "people affiliated with the program". I'm sure the NCAA will try to argue to whom that term applies. But it appears that Stallions was operating in a gray area that did not violate the letter of the law but did certainly violate the spirit of the law. Day isn't mad that they did it, he's just mad that he didn't think of it.

The Manson defense - classic. As long as you use a proxy, you've done nothing wrong.

 

[Spartanmack]

Its a rule from 1994 because of the disparity in big school to small school money. This argument does not hold anymore. Everyone has been making money the past 15 yrs and EVERYONE has enough to do so. Before 1994, they had dudes with big ass camera recorders in the stands recording lips and hand signals. Should we asterisk every National Champion before '94?

Not saying this yelling at you, just saying.

I'm not making the case for the rule or defending it. But NOT everyone is making money. That's simply false. There may be more programs running a surplus than before because of conference TV networks but to say everyone is making money is definitely not true. And even if it were, saying the rule is unnecessary is an opinion, not a defense.

The NCAA should get rid of the rule, allow electronic communication like they have in the NFL and make a rule prohibiting stealing electronic signals. Obviously, they'd have to make it broadly defined for schools like uofm who might try to get around the rule by having students hack into their opponent's transmissions.

 

[tinselwolverine]

The Manson defense - classic. As long as you use a proxy, you've done nothing wrong.

I would say this is just a bit of a hyperbolic analogy, no?

 

[byco42]

This entire situation is hyperbolic, with rampant speculation, circumstance, and conjecture.

 

[Spartanmack]

I would say this is just a bit of a hyperbolic analogy, no?

it is, and to be clear I'm not conflating the crimes - just making a point, however exaggerated that it's silly to think they didn't break the rule because they paid a proxy to steal other teams' signals. I certainly don't think uofm should get the death penalty or anything like that.

Like when people use the excuse that they did something on a superior's orders, it's often likened to the Nuremberg defense - I don't think anyone is accusing people that use that excuse of being Nazis...

 

[tinselwolverine]

it is, and to be clear I'm not conflating the crimes - just making a point, however exaggerated. I certainly don't think uofm should get the death penalty or anything like that.

Like when people use the excuse that they did something on a superior's orders, it's often likened to the Nuremberg defense - I don't think anyone is accusing people that use that excuse of being Nazis...

I?m kind of a fan of hyperbole.

I even use it myself from time to time.

 

[Michchamp]

This entire situation is hyperbolic, with rampant speculation, circumstance, and conjecture.

what else do the coaches of the teams we crush have to do? move on and work harder next time??? get real, man!!!

It's not like digital feeds of every game are available for cheap now, and anyone can (and probably does) do this, and even the NCAA said the limited usefulness of sign stealing didn't justify spending any money to police it and the rule should be dropped... Suspend all logic and reason and clutch your pearls.

This is also a great distraction for fans of programs that are a total mess right now.

 

[Spartanmack]

I?m kind of a fan of hyperbole.

I even use it myself from time to time.

It's an extremely effective tool - particularly when trolling.

 

[Spartanmack]

Apparently Stalions had tickets just behind both sidelines for this past weekend's PSU at OSU game. How does a guy making $55k/year afford those seats? Shockingly, those tickets went unused. Why? if you paid for 'em, you might as well use 'em, knowwaddimsayin? Especially since, as has been pointed out here, if a student or a non-coach uses them there is no rules violation even if they're stealing signs.

 

[michdad1]

Could get interesting

Reports are coming out that Ohio State?s Brent Zdbveski is being investigated for doing the same thing Michigan is accused of doing.

 

[Spartanmack]

Looks like the NCAA could be trying to take down the whole B1G...

 

[wlvrnstlr4life]

Could get interesting

Reports are coming out that Ohio State?s Brent Zdbveski is being investigated for doing the same thing Michigan is accused of doing.

"There's honor amongst thieves," a former SEC coach said. "Want to turn someone in? Fine. But you better make sure no one in your building is doing anything remotely resembling cheating."

From ESPN article today

 

[rumseyhouse77]

Ncaa is making Billions. Give every college the equipment to radio plays into helmets on offense and defense. Problem solved for sign stealing.

But this would require the NCAA to provide money to all the programs to purchase and maintain the equipment, and the NCAA is poor and can't afford this. The NCAA is the real scandal.

It's all a load of crap. Even small programs can access video recordings of games at a very low cost. Let's get real here. Smaller schools are losing games because of the disparities in facilities and player quality. But it is a payday for them. It has nothing to do with "sign stealing".