Veras

[tigermud]

Offense is still the best in mlb

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The complete lack of offense in last years WS still stings, they've shown signs of this very same ability to get owned by ave pitchers a few times this year as well throughout the year and that's the continued concern. Best paper offense won't change the reality that they often can't hit there way out of a wet paper sack and go into shutdown mode for long consecutive inning stretches at a time

 

[UMRules06]

The complete lack of offense in last years WS still stings, they've shown signs of this very same ability to get owned by ave pitchers a few times this year as well thoughtout the year and that's the continued concern. Best paper offense won't change the reality that they often can't hit there way out of a wet paper sack and go into shutdown mode for long consecutive inning stretches at a time

I understand this concern, but to me I don't know how you address it, because it's a problem that every team has. What team doesn't go through stretches where they can't score runs, or they get "owned" by average starters? It's this very reason, why I think it's more important to get the pitching and bullpen in order as much as possible. The offense is good if not great, and if it happens to go cold at the wrong time again, then c'est la vie. Appropriate heads will roll.

Yes the Tigers have sucked offensively in their last two WS appearances, but why exactly? Were they constructed poorly to begin with? Was it the long layoffs? The weather? Or just a fluke stretch of bad hitting which can happen to any team? I honestly don't know. The giants weren't exactly offensive wonders either outside of Sandoval's insane game 1. They won games 2 and 3 both by a 2-0 score, and managed only 5 hits in each of the last 3 games of the series. I guess what I'm trying to say is, offense is more unpredictable and less crucial to postseason success than great pitching.

 

[tigermud]

I understand this concern, but to me I don't know how you address it, because it's a problem that every team has. What team doesn't go through stretches where they can't score runs, or they get "owned" by average starters? It's this very reason, why I think it's more important to get the pitching and bullpen in order as much as possible. The offensive is good if not great, and if it happens to go cold at the wrong time again, then c'est la vie. Appropriate heads will roll.

Yes the Tigers have sucked offensively in their last two WS appearances, but why exactly? Were they constructed poorly to begin with? Was it the long layoffs? The weather? Or just a fluke stretch of bad hitting which can happen to any team? I honestly don't know. The giants weren't exactly offensive wonders either outside of Sandoval's insane game 1. They won games 2 and 3 both by a 2-0 score, and managed only 5 hits in each of the last 3 games of the series. I guess what I'm trying to say is, offense is more unpredictable and less crucial to postseason success than great pitching.

All good points, for the most part the pitching was well good enough last year to win, we just needed a little offense against soft tossing lefties and couldn't do it. It was bad a d everytime I see the same lack of patience and hacking at anything that looks remotely hittable like prince is doing right now I can't help have nightmares. Lol

 

[Mitchrapp]

Add to this Tigers have been shut out SEVEN times. FIVE times by scores of 3-0 or less, that five games had the offence showed up with a 4 spot a full run under there average they could have won.

IMO the pitching relief has given 2 to 3 games away Coke (2) Valverde (1) for sure. The offence too many. The Defence who knows for sure but I'll go 2-3 for the sake of argument. ESPN has them at 65-39 in expected W-L. That's 6 six games better than they are. Only two other teams are at 4. Tigers are leading in underperforming.

IMO it's the offence. Avlia has been a big downfall,Fielder of late has falling off. Dirks have been short in the batting average.A few injuries have been account of some shortness.Early in the season V-Mart was on my list. BUT lately has been hitting like more than most expected..427 so far in the month of July!! This should help Fielder. And then carry up to Cabrera, like he needs any help this season.

But the bottom line is 12 games the Tigers have scored 10 or more runs and been shutout SEVEN. Somewhere the Offence is not together for some reason?!

Have you looked how many times other teams have been shut out? Detroit is better than average in the AL.

 

[Thumb]

They will trade Kinsler before Profar. Ian is approaching 30 and Profar is 20, and Profar is more versatile, while Kinsler can only play 2nd and 1st base. I'm actually hoping Detroit makes a play for Kinsler in the offseason.

The Rangers have long term deals with both Kinsler and Andrus, if they were to trade someone it would likely be Profar, who while less proven on the field, will likely get a higher return because he's still cheap and under team control for a long time.

With Hamilton gone Kinsler is really the face of that franchise, and Profar is blocked at his natural position, Texas wants to win a WS just like we do, and I don't see them trading one of the top 2B in the AL in favor of an unknown. I can see them trading Profar to improve weak positions.

 

[Thumb]

Have you looked how many times other teams have been shut out? Detroit is better than average in the AL.

Yes, but we should not be middle of the pack with our offensive numbers.

 

[Thumb]

Offense is still the best in mlb

Very 2-dimensional way of putting it though.

Almost like saying a pitcher is good or bad based on his W-L record.

We scored a bunch of unearned runs the last 2 series against terrible teams, and that put us just past Boston. But it does not tell the whole story, especially how this offense is Mike Tyson one day and Rip VanWinkle the next.

 

[Mitchrapp]

Yes, but we should not be middle of the pack with our offensive numbers.

How did you get in the middle. I said better than average..lol.

 

[Rebbiv]

They will trade Kinsler before Profar. Ian is approaching 30 and Profar is 20, and Profar is more versatile, while Kinsler can only play 2nd and 1st base. I'm actually hoping Detroit makes a play for Kinsler in the offseason.

Kinsler sucks outside of Ranger Stadium.

Career Home .305 BAVG .388 OBP .518 SLG .907 OPS

Career Away .240 BAVG .312 OBP .398 SLG .710 OPS

2010-2012 Home .300 BAVG .398 OBP .506 SLG .904 OPS

2010-2012 Away .227 BAVG .302 OBP .377 SLG .679 OPS


These splits are awful.

 

[Mitchrapp]

I'm not going to completely over look road numbers but has it ever occurred to you that guys do better at home because of their families, sleeping in their own bed, home cooked meals etc..

Because there are many guys who do well at home, bad on the road - get traded, do well in their new place, bad on road, traded again - do well at home and again bad on the road.

Just a thought.

 

[spockmaster]

He does better at home because texas is a bandbox and one of the best hitters parks in baseball.

 

[Rebbiv]

I'm not going to completely over look road numbers but has it ever occurred to you that guys do better at home because of their families, sleeping in their own bed, home cooked meals etc..

Because there are many guys who do well at home, bad on the road - get traded, do well in their new place, bad on road, traded again - do well at home and again bad on the road.

Just a thought.

Name some names.

You basic premise is sound. There are a vast majority who have better home versus away splits. And yes, for the most part that is normal. The issue is the margin of difference. 200 points in OPS is not the normal. Maybe 50-75 point difference.

Additionally, players like Chase Headley see a reverse effect because they play in such a pitcher friendly park.

Every player plays half their schedule away. DET currently has issues hitting on the road. Do you really want to add another player who cannot hit outside of his own bed?

 

[tomdalton22]

I understand some of the frustration about the inconsistant offense but every team has an inconsistant offense. Some point out that the tigers have scored a lot of un-earned runs lately to take the lead in runs but they lead the league in runs (22 more than boston in 3 less games) and #1 in OPS.

 

[byco42]

Kinsler sucks outside of Ranger Stadium.

Career Home .305 BAVG .388 OBP .518 SLG .907 OPS

Career Away .240 BAVG .312 OBP .398 SLG .710 OPS

2010-2012 Home .300 BAVG .398 OBP .506 SLG .904 OPS

2010-2012 Away .227 BAVG .302 OBP .377 SLG .679 OPS


These splits are awful.

And he wears his pants like Brandon Inge.

 

[spockmaster]

Putkonen sent down.

 

[Mitchrapp]

Name some names.

You basic premise is sound. There are a vast majority who have better home versus away splits. And yes, for the most part that is normal. The issue is the margin of difference. 200 points in OPS is not the normal. Maybe 50-75 point difference.

Additionally, players like Chase Headley see a reverse effect because they play in such a pitcher friendly park.

Every player plays half their schedule away. DET currently has issues hitting on the road. Do you really want to add another player who cannot hit outside of his own bed?

I'm not going through names. Are you saying that there are no players like that..?

I didn't post because of Kinsler or Utley, just a generic post that its not all as simple as that.

 

[gotime909]

Getting a starter out of the game is a weakness of this team if they are not "pounding" out hits.

They lead the league in runs scored, because they score 10-12 runs for 3 out of 10 games, and then cannot score more than 3 in half. Yes, the average those runs, but that is very misleading.

Allowing mediocre pitcher to have 5 pitch innings against DET should be classified as a crime. This same hitting approach (or lack thereof) is also what the team uses in innings 7-9 and Close/Late games.

All it takes is one game in a series where you get to the other team's bullpen. These depletes their ability to keep using certain relievers during that series. But, DET sucks even at that. How many times have they scored 8-10 runs early, only to allow a reliever to go 3+ innings without them scoring more runs?

If you do not see how this ineffective offense can be debilitating in a playoff series, I do not know how better to describe it. DET' offense is all smoke and mirrors. And FYI, Infante sucks at drawing walks and/or running the opposing pitcher's pitch count out. In fact, he is in the same league as Delmon Young.

Where do your numbers come from????

The Tigers have scored 10+ runs 12 times this year for a total of 11% of their games, not the 30% you suggest.

The Tigers have also scored less than 4 runs in 35 games this year for a total of 33% of their games, not the 50% you suggest.

 

[jdeb]

As far as a second baseman for next season, I am in favor of H. Perez getting the shot. He is a fantastic defender. However, I would not be surprised if the Tigers land Jose Altuve for the stretch run and beyond. Maybe they were showcasing H.Perez a little? I read or heard somewhere that Infante has the same injury Maggs had. I also like Daniel Murphy on the Mets, not sure if he would blend in though.

 

[Thumb]

I don't like the idea of resigning Infante, who is old, and overrated. But I also don't think Hernan is quite ready for the full time MLB gig just yet.

 

[Rebbiv]

I don't like the idea of resigning Infante, who is old, and overrated. But I also don't think Hernan is quite ready for the full time MLB gig just yet.

I agree 100%