Chris Houston out?

[mhughes0021]

the problems are he drops too many passes and when he does catch them all the fans are holding their breath praying he doesn't fumble. outside of that stuff coupled with the coaches not using him to max potential in run game, he was an outstanding 3rd round pick.

what's that? we took him in the 1st??? you're...serious? well...interesting. seems there might have been some other necessity that could have been filled following the BPA concept. doesn't seem like a run blocking TE fits in with the BPA concept when constantly sent out on pass routes and the run game hasn't improved, but what do i know.

how MM&Co deemed him as BPA with the 20th overall pick still confuses me. even if he would have been taken by the time lions picked again, sure seems they could have gotten a more pass oriented TE to fit their new passing schemes later in the draft and used the #20 pick to grab a guy able to have a larger overall impact. pett's impact has been average at best in getting 700 yards per season and factoring in his drops and fumbles...especially the fumbles...and deflected passes that turn into INTs.

but some will say i have zero knowledge of the game, all i do is complain, and i need to pick up my purse when i go to log out, so what do i know.

+1 If he was this stud inline blocker in the run game that he was supposed to be than id justify the pick a bit more. But our run game still blows after 1st rd run blocking tight ends, 1st and 2nd round rbs, and 1st round tackles all get drafted.

 

[lionsFTW]

Man this thread turned out really good!

LKP, I agree with pretty much everything you've said.

zyxt, hughes I see your end of the argument about pettigrew and I can understand it. I just have one question for you two. Do you guys see a large difference between Heath Miller and Pettigrew? That's what I feel like Mayhew was aiming for and he pretty much hit the nail on the head, imo.

 

[tonyballs]

mitch..thats all he can do. hes not a dynamic route runner. Hes not a "pass catching" TE even though he catches a lot of balls for us. Hes an outlet guy that runs dinky routes. Do you ever see him running 30-40 yards down the sidelines like gronk. Or deep crossing routes like aaron hernandez. No....cause he cant.....hes much much slower than those guys and not a very good route runner. He runs 6 yards than turns around.

And LKP...enough with your "hes a 700 yard" thingy lol. We throw for 5000 yards the last couple years. Even if you take out CJs 2k that still leave 3k to split between a handful of guys. Everyone should have 700 yards lol. That is not impressive....at all. Its not a stat worth mentioning in our offense. If this was the cleveland browns...than fine. 700 yds would make him a superstar lol.

You're comparing him to Gronk and Hernandez now? What's next? Maybe one day he can strive to be as good as Tony Gonzalez, but he won't..lol. Give me a break. He's a safety net for Stafford. He's done a pretty damn good job since he's been here, but the drops kill him. Racking up yards isn't that easy to do in the NFL...you still have to go out there and earn it.

 

[cheeno]

Man this thread turned out really good!

LKP, I agree with pretty much everything you've said.

zyxt, hughes I see your end of the argument about pettigrew and I can understand it. I just have one question for you two. Do you guys see a large difference between Heath Miller and Pettigrew? That's what I feel like Mayhew was aiming for and he pretty much hit the nail on the head, imo.

Well other than the fact Heath Miller rarely if ever drops a pass. Minor detail.

 

[cheeno]

Wow Pettigrew had the least value as a tigh end in the NFL this past year according to Football Outsiders

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/te2012

 

[boogerlovejoy]

Man this thread turned out really good!

LKP, I agree with pretty much everything you've said.

zyxt, hughes I see your end of the argument about pettigrew and I can understand it. I just have one question for you two. Do you guys see a large difference between Heath Miller and Pettigrew? That's what I feel like Mayhew was aiming for and he pretty much hit the nail on the head, imo.

Agreed. I think Heath Miller is a great comparison. Miller has better hands, but the skill set is very similar.

Pettigrew was ABSOLUTELY drafted to help protect Stafford.....both in the passing game, running game, and as an outlet receiver. He has done a great job of all three. He wasn't drafted to run crossing routes and 30 to 40 yard sideline routes.

The Lions are using Pettigrew exactly as he should be used. It is one of the areas they have actually been pretty damn smart about....that is why they also brought in Scheffler....to run those type of routes.

 

[boogerlovejoy]

Wow Pettigrew had the least value as a tigh end in the NFL this past year according to Football Outsiders

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/te2012

Those rankings, as they say, are for passing plays thrown at that receiver ONLY. It does NOT take into account the value of that player on ALL other plays. So that ranking is taking into account about 8% of all the Lions plays this year. Great stat!!!!!! It actually proves VERY LITTLE about the talent of the receiver.

The point of this conversation is that Pettigrew has more value than just a receiver....so you aren't really proving anything.

He had a bad year catching the ball. We all knew that already.

 

[cheeno]

Those rankings, as they say, are for passing plays thrown at that receiver ONLY. It does NOT take into account the value of that player on ALL other plays. So that ranking is taking into account about 8% of all the Lions plays this year. Great stat!!!!!! It actually proves VERY LITTLE about the talent of the receiver.

The point of this conversation is that Pettigrew has more value than just a receiver....so you aren't really proving anything.

He had a bad year catching the ball. We all knew that already.

Where is Heath Miller on that list?

 

[boogerlovejoy]

Where is Heath Miller on that list?

3rd.....what's your point?

It's a stupid ranking....it means nothing.

 

[cheeno]

3rd.....what's your point?

It's a stupid ranking....it means nothing.

Yeah, your probably right. Stupid football outsiders, whatta they know.

 

[boogerlovejoy]

Yeah, your probably right. Stupid football outsiders, whatta they know.

It has little to do with the talent of the guy catching the ball.....more to do with the QB throwing it.

So to use it in an argument about Pettigrews talent is stupid.

 

[cheeno]

It has little to do with the talent of the guy catching the ball.....more to do with the QB throwing it.

So to use it in an argument about Pettigrews talent is stupid.

Oh okay thanks for the clarification. Stafford sucks. I can buy that.

 

[boogerlovejoy]

Oh okay thanks for the clarification. Stafford sucks. I can buy that.

Yep. Staff had a bad year...it hurt everyone not named Megatron.......at least you realize it.

Thanks for using a stat that has NOTHING to do with the talent of the guy catching the ball to point out what everyone already knew. KUDOS!!!

 

[zyxt9]

Man this thread turned out really good!

LKP, I agree with pretty much everything you've said.

zyxt, hughes I see your end of the argument about pettigrew and I can understand it. I just have one question for you two. Do you guys see a large difference between Heath Miller and Pettigrew? That's what I feel like Mayhew was aiming for and he pretty much hit the nail on the head, imo.

in that draft, i think they could have waited till later and picked up jared cook. in all honesty, i think pettigrew is a better fit for the Titans O and Cook is a better fit for the Lions O and i for one would be all for an even swap, even though it would be a value trade in favor of the Titans on paper I think the Lions would get far more production from Cook.

however, cook has had a few fumbles of his own of late, so cannot say for certain if they had done that we wouldn't be ragging on him at this point. still, getting cook in R3 would have been better than pettigrew in R1...IMO. probably a few others could have also been grabbed in R3 or later, but Cook is the first one that comes to mind. impressive numbers at the combine, but i think the lions bought into all the hype over pettigrew by the media.

look at it this way...if lions had not traded with cowboys to move back into R1, they would likely have had:

R1: Stafford
R2: Delmas
R3: Levy and Cook
R4: Maybe Glover Quinn? Granted they already picked their S, so maybe not...but he was available early R4 and would have been a hedge on their Delmas bet. At least Quinn stays healthy.

Regardless, they could have had 2 starters instead of 1. When a team has that many holes to fill, you need more picks, not less, and there are guys in R4+ who can fill holes. Yes, there is a ton of luck involved, but taking Quinn would have meant not taking Spievey the next year...and what could the Lions have done with that pick?

Signed,

Captain Hindsight

 

[zyxt9]

before anyone screams at me for saying in previous post that the lions had a R4 pick when in reality they did not, please remember they had used that R4 pick to trade back into R1. i was looking at it as though they had not made that trade, so no pettigrew in R1 and retain the R4 pick.

 

[cheeno]

Couple things: 1. We got Pettidrop from Dallas. 2. Captain Hindsight might as well be the Lions board's official mascot.

 

[boogerlovejoy]

2. Captain Hindsight might as well be the Lions board's official mascot.

That, I agree with.

 

[zyxt9]

Oh, right...forgot about that pick being part of the whole Roy Williams trade. Ok, well they could gave gotten Michael ober then and at least shored up the RT position and still gotten cook. Or maybe they grab a CB or dt or who knows. Team would be better if they had gotten a different TE in R3 and used the R1 to fill a more pressing hole. Plus cook in R3 means not taking derrick Williams and wasting that pick so even if oher proved no better than a RT fix, it sure as hell would be better than Derick Williams. And oher could just as easily been considered a pick to protect Stafford and improve the running game.

Or take a solid running back so we don't have the whole Best fiasco. It would have been hard to do worse with those picks.

 

[mhughes0021]

You're comparing him to Gronk and Hernandez now? What's next? Maybe one day he can strive to be as good as Tony Gonzalez, but he won't..lol. Give me a break. He's a safety net for Stafford. He's done a pretty damn good job since he's been here, but the drops kill him. Racking up yards isn't that easy to do in the NFL...you still have to go out there and earn it.

they (gronk and hernandez) were both 2nd round picks.....id expect pettigrew to be better than both of them (common sense would say a first round pick is better than a 2nd round pick). Pettigrew was supposed to be a superior run blocker....which is why he was worthy of a 1st round pick. He isnt. To be honest i dont think hes any better of a run blocker than gronk is.

 

[boogerlovejoy]

they (gronk and hernandez) were both 2nd round picks.....id expect pettigrew to be better than both of them (common sense would say a first round pick is better than a 2nd round pick). Pettigrew was supposed to be a superior run blocker....which is why he was worthy of a 1st round pick. He isnt. To be honest i dont think hes any better of a run blocker than gronk is.

Hernandez was a 4th. Pick 113. 2010.