Ferguson, MO

[mhughes0021]

 

[Monster]

Please tell me that's not photoshopped.

 

[tigersofjustice]

I really hate this whole thing about 'well he robbed a store so its ok'.

If I go out tomorrow and rob a store, and by rob lets just say I use an actual weapon and threaten people rather than grab some cigarettes on the way out and push someone a little bit, am I marked for death now?

Lets say I make it home and have a seat on my couch enjoying the day. And lets say the police bust in hours later and shoot me before I can even move. Would that be ok because I was a robber thug?

It just isn't a logical justification for killing somebody. Because person x committed crime y sometime well before incident z resulting in person x's death therefore it is justified because of crime y is just plain bad logic.

I mean use the alleged "charge" or the car wrestling, those are at least reasonable justifications on some level. Anyone saying well Mike Brown was a thief/robber therefore his death was fine just loses all credibility in my mind. I hate that it's a bad justification that people are putting out there and I hate that a decent amount of people seem to agree with it nationally. Implicit in that for me is at least the idea that a decent amount of people think that people who commit crime of any type deserve to die. That is a scary thought.

 

[Gulo Blue]

Please tell me that's not photoshopped.

It is photoshopped. It's been in the news.

 

[mhughes0021]

It is photoshopped. It's been in the news.

What does the original sign say? Just curious. ..

 

[Mitchrapp]

I really hate this whole thing about 'well he robbed a store so its ok'.

If I go out tomorrow and rob a store, and by rob lets just say I use an actual weapon and threaten people rather than grab some cigarettes on the way out and push someone a little bit, am I marked for death now?

Lets say I make it home and have a seat on my couch enjoying the day. And lets say the police bust in hours later and shoot me before I can even move. Would that be ok because I was a robber thug?

It just isn't a logical justification for killing somebody. Because person x committed crime y sometime well before incident z resulting in person x's death therefore it is justified because of crime y is just plain bad logic.

I mean use the alleged "charge" or the car wrestling, those are at least reasonable justifications on some level. Anyone saying well Mike Brown was a thief/robber therefore his death was fine just loses all credibility in my mind. I hate that it's a bad justification that people are putting out there and I hate that a decent amount of people seem to agree with it nationally. Implicit in that for me is at least the idea that a decent amount of people think that people who commit crime of any type deserve to die. That is a scary thought.

Yeah that's the same. Now if you went over to a cop's house and while sitting on his sofa you started to beat on him than yeah..It wasn't that he just robbed a store, it's he robbed it -- saw a policeman, reached into his car and started to fight.

 

[zyxt9]

Anyone else notice a certain poster seems to have disappeared?

After throwing around several baseless accusations against a couple of us, looks like he tucked his tail between his legs and bolted.

Yet I constantly see his name at the top of the main page, so it's not like he's just not around.

So Mr. Invisible, you can do one of three things, you can offer some proof to back up your accusations, you can swallow your pride and retract said accusations, or you can keep hiding hoping people will forget.

We won't.

Fuck off and die already you fucking Racist piece of shit.

 

[zyxt9]

For the record, I'm surprised the New York cops were not sent to a Grand Jury trial. Being in New York, I have seen tons of info on that one. Guy had hands up, wasn't resisting IMO. Zero need to have used such force on him. Then they also failed to get him necessary medical help, completely going against the motto of protect and serve.

That said, there is zero reason to go beyond peaceful protests. It is extremely sad situation.

 

[Thumb]

Fuck off and die already you fucking Racist piece of shit.

LMAO how am I a racist? :cheers:

 

[zyxt9]

Did any of them inform him that he was under arrest before tackling him? If so, you can say he resisted arrest, but even then the force was excessive. It didn't seem like they even gave him instructions to stop resisting. They just kind of grabbed him and took him to the ground.

That's pretty spot on from everything I have seen. The cops tried using fact he was a big guy, blah, blah, blah. There were enough officers around they didn't need to use that degree of force. They could have cuffed him while he was standing.

The fact the entire NYPD is now undergoing new training points to these cops were wrong.

Now, were their actions racially motivated? no... cops in NY are pretty arrogant and throw their weight around. They constantly drive off the clock the way they would when they have full sirens on. Many aspects of the NYPD need to be fixed, specifically how they interact with Joe Public, regardless of race. This is also why blacks refer to blacks in uniform as being blue. Several times I've seen reports of black cops shooting blacks and there are riots with things said that would make one believe the cop was white. They are not understanding the issue isn't racial, but police on power trips.

Still, in NY there are so many arrogant fucks all over that the cops are pretty much behaving like the general population. Doesn't make it right, but NY isn't known for customer service in general, so many carry their attitude when cops confront them or are working as member of NYPD... which is not going to be a good mix.

 

[Monster]

I really hate this whole thing about 'well he robbed a store so its ok'.

If I go out tomorrow and rob a store, and by rob lets just say I use an actual weapon and threaten people rather than grab some cigarettes on the way out and push someone a little bit, am I marked for death now?

Lets say I make it home and have a seat on my couch enjoying the day. And lets say the police bust in hours later and shoot me before I can even move. Would that be ok because I was a robber thug?

It just isn't a logical justification for killing somebody. Because person x committed crime y sometime well before incident z resulting in person x's death therefore it is justified because of crime y is just plain bad logic.

I mean use the alleged "charge" or the car wrestling, those are at least reasonable justifications on some level. Anyone saying well Mike Brown was a thief/robber therefore his death was fine just loses all credibility in my mind. I hate that it's a bad justification that people are putting out there and I hate that a decent amount of people seem to agree with it nationally. Implicit in that for me is at least the idea that a decent amount of people think that people who commit crime of any type deserve to die. That is a scary thought.

What the fuck are you talking about?

You are ignoring all known facts and coming up with conclusions that make the rioters look intelligent.

Nobody is saying that its ok that he was killed because he robbed a place. The robbery shows WHO Brown was and the mindset he has, which is of a thug who has no regard for law. This is part of the process to determine guilt or innocence since eye witnesses were so unreliable.

What is more likely, that a thug like Brown assaulted the officer and became a big enough threat that he was kiled or that Brown robbed that store, walked away, and wilson killed him after he did nothing to earn a bullet in the head?

 

[zyxt9]

LMAO how am I a racist? :cheers:

Everything about you, every fucking post is anti-white.

Now fuck off you piece of shit, I'm done discussing anything with you ever again.

 

[Thumb]

All my posts are anti-white. LOL

I feel like this is that episode from Chappelle show where he plays the blind guy who is a grand dragon in the KKK and doesn't know he's black.

Maybe I forgot I'm a white dude?

 

[zyxt9]

I really hate this whole thing about 'well he robbed a store so its ok'.

If I go out tomorrow and rob a store, and by rob lets just say I use an actual weapon and threaten people rather than grab some cigarettes on the way out and push someone a little bit, am I marked for death now?

Lets say I make it home and have a seat on my couch enjoying the day. And lets say the police bust in hours later and shoot me before I can even move. Would that be ok because I was a robber thug?

It just isn't a logical justification for killing somebody. Because person x committed crime y sometime well before incident z resulting in person x's death therefore it is justified because of crime y is just plain bad logic.

I mean use the alleged "charge" or the car wrestling, those are at least reasonable justifications on some level. Anyone saying well Mike Brown was a thief/robber therefore his death was fine just loses all credibility in my mind. I hate that it's a bad justification that people are putting out there and I hate that a decent amount of people seem to agree with it nationally. Implicit in that for me is at least the idea that a decent amount of people think that people who commit crime of any type deserve to die. That is a scary thought.

Robbed the store, fought with cop, tried to grab cops gun, ran approximately 100', turned to face police officer who remained close to car, Brown moved TOWARD cop despite orders to stop and shots fired prior to kill shot which happened no more than 10' from the cop. Hands up or not, moving toward a cop in defiance of orders to stop in that situation will get you shot at and still continuing toward the cop SHOULD result in your death as you are presenting yourself as a threat to the cop.

Why is this so difficult to grasp?

 

[Thumb]

Robbed the store, fought with cop, tried to grab cops gun*, ran approximately 100', turned to face police officer who remained close to car, Brown moved TOWARD cop despite orders to stop and shots fired prior to kill shot which happened no more than 10' from the cop. Hands up or not, moving toward a cop in defiance of orders to stop in that situation will get you shot at and still continuing toward the cop SHOULD result in your death as you are presenting yourself as a threat to the cop.

Why is this so difficult to grasp?

* alleged

 

[tinselwolverine]

What does the original sign say? Just curious. ..

It say...

Gulo...you a fuck.

I SAY...you a fuck.

And when I say...you a fuck...

You a fuck.

 

[Monster]

Robbed the store, fought with cop, tried to grab cops gun, ran approximately 100', turned to face police officer who remained close to car, Brown moved TOWARD cop despite orders to stop and shots fired prior to kill shot which happened no more than 10' from the cop. Hands up or not, moving toward a cop in defiance of orders to stop in that situation will get you shot at and still continuing toward the cop SHOULD result in your death as you are presenting yourself as a threat to the cop.

Why is this so difficult to grasp?

Dude, he's part of the group that believes that is made up and gives credibility to discredited witnesses and drown out the rest. I'm done with the Brown debate unless something new happens. Its completely out of control.

 

[Monster]

* alleged

*Only alleged in the eyes of non medical examiners who think because a black guy got shot, someone has to go to prison - fuck the facts! HANDS UP DON'T SHOOT! NO JUSTICE NO PEACE! BURN THIS MOTHER FUCKER DOWN!

 

[zyxt9]

Agreed - very tough situation to be put in.

According to the autopsy report Garner died from compression of the neck and compression of the chest. It further noted that his severe medical conditions - acute and chronic bronchial asthma, obesity, and heart disease contributed to his death. Garner weighed over 400lbs and was not in good health. There was no damage to Garner's windpipe or neck bones. He was not choked to death and according to police experts, the officer had him in a submission hold, designed to restrict blood flow to the brain, and not a choke hold - choke holds have been banned by the NYPD since 1993. These actions were a contributing factor that probably helped trigger the complications that led to his death but again, he was not choked to death. His breathing issues were due to his weight and chronic illnesses and the prone position he was in - that is why he couldn't breathe.

The argument then comes down to was it excessive force? He's known to the officers based on the fact he's been arrested 8 times for the same offense. He clearly doesn't submit when told he's under arrest. The suspect doesn't get to decide whether or not they're being arrested and if he doesn't submit, they still have to arrest him. If you see in the video, the officer grabs Garner around the neck and under the arm, taking Garner's right arm in the hold - that is NOT a choke hold. I don't think there was any intent to kill or even harm Garner and I think his preexisting medical conditions contributed as much if not more to his death than anything the cops did. It's a shame and a tragedy but I don't think the officers actions rise to the level of a crime here.

The issue I continue to have is less that they took him down (though I don't believe cops need to throw people to the ground to put cuffs on, seems to me they could have managed the situation better and cuffed him while standing). My issue is more that they delayed in getting him medical help. The moment he said he was having trouble breathing is the latest point they should have continued their physical restraints. If he somehow escaped as a result, I'm pretty sure he wasn't getting far. Very poor judgment there by the officers. Then the continued delay in contacting dispatch for an immediate medical assist... anyone in Garner's situation deserved more respect and the officers failed him as a human being.

 

[Thumb]

*Only alleged in the eyes of non medical examiners who think because a black guy got shot, someone has to go to prison - fuck the facts! HANDS UP DON'T SHOOT! NO JUSTICE NO PEACE! BURN THIS MOTHER FUCKER DOWN!

See, now you're just being dumb.

I have said none of that at all, but...facts are facts because they have been proven. The rest is all alleged. It's quite possible, and even likely it happened exactly that way, but there is zero evidence that Brown tried to grab Wilsons gun, or that Brown punched Wilson so hard he almost knocked him out, other than Wilson's statement.

If you, or anyone bothered to read what I have posted in this thread you would see I never really picked a side at all here. Just pointing out what many call "facts" or "evidence" is not, and that I believe this was something for a jury to decide.

It is kind of funny though the why you sarcastically posted that last bit in caps, because you're exactly the same way just 180 degree removed. You see Brown as a thug, and that made up your mind.