Josh Mccown released by Bucs

[LKP]

His numbers the past 3 years, overall record, and record vs winning teams say otherwise. Top 5 defense or Stafford can't win games

2011 he won without a top 5 defense or run game and mediocre protection.

2012/2013 the team had more problems than just bad (2012) or mediocre defense (2013). Weapon issues by weapons (fumbles double digits each year), ints that were the weapons fault (including Calvin), lack of separation, drops, run game issues at times (moreso 2012 but 6 games in 2013 no run game) plus injuries to Calvin and Burleson.

And 2013 Stafford still moved the ball well and was 6th in TDs and good on 3rd down.

 

[grandy]

 

[LKP]

Valid reasons. Watch the tape. 16 fumbles 2012, 15 fumbles 2013. 8 fumbles lost in 2014.

17 turnovers forced 2012, 22 turnovers forced 2013 and finally 27 turnovers forced by our defense in 2014. +7 TO difference compared to -16 in 2012 and -12 in 2013.

Drop % was about 3% better. Thank you Tate and healthier finger Calvin.

Tate and Ebron got a little more separation than Burleson/Durham and Pettigrew getting a ton of targets.

But then the run game was terrible and the protection was bad in 2014.

+7 turnover ratio was huge. Thanks Caldwell/Lombardi/Austin.

If the Lions have average run game and protection next year. Stafford will have a monster year.

 

[jared]

That's actually a really good comparison. I wouldn't say Dalton's numbers are better though. Dalton throws less, so his totals are smaller. Also, his ypa is slightly lower for their respective careers. Of course, Dalton also entered the league two years later.

Matt's best is better than Dalton's best. Matt's worst is worse than Dalton's worst. Overall, though, they are very similar. Dalton has won more games because his team has been better for a longer period of time, and similarly has played more playoff games. Neither have any playoff wins. Dalton just got a big extension that was panned, and is considered nowhere near elite. Stafford has been paid big since he was drafted, and is considered nowhere near elite.

That's fair. And thanks for reading my mind and explaining it better than I did.

 

[kdp1980]

So why did Stafford fall apart and complete 50% of his passes during the final 8 games last year? Do good quarterbacks do that?

 

[LKP]

So why did Stafford fall apart and complete 50% of his passes during the final 8 games last year? Do good quarterbacks do that?

Drops, separation issues like I said, some bad run games mixed in there. A blizzard game for 40% throwing, Calvin limited in one and out another without Tate.

54% by the way and threw 13 TDs in 8 games.

 

[tomdalton22]

Drops, separation issues like I said, some bad run games mixed in there. A blizzard game for 40% throwing, Calvin limited in one and out another without Tate.

54% by the way and threw 13 TDs AND 13 INTS in 8 games.

fify

 

[LKP]

fify

Not all the picks were his fault. All the TDs were because of Stafford.

 

[kdp1980]

Not all the picks were his fault. All the TDs were because of Stafford.

Mkay. What would be a bad enough season for you to want Stafford out?? Serious question

 

[tomdalton22]

Not all the picks were his fault. All the TDs were because of Stafford.

If he gets the credit for the TDs he gets the credit for the INTs.

Ravens game

Detroit (7-7) has hurt its playoff chances by losing four of five, falling out of sole possession of first place in the NFC North to third behind the division-leading Chicago Bears and Green Bay.

"This is a setback, no question," Lions coach Jim Schwartz said. "We had control and now we need help. We have to get two wins and let the rest shake out."

Stafford's three interceptions followed a troubling trend for the franchise.

He has 12 turnovers, including two fumbles, in his last five games. Not coincidentally, the Lions have been able to overcome those miscues well enough to win only one game during the slump.

Giants game

"Matthew Stafford was worse: 25 of 42 for 222 yards and two interceptions, the second was returned by Will Hill for a TD that tied it at 20 with 4:57 left in the lackluster game.

Stafford threw high and wide of 6-foot-7 tight end Joseph Fauria, who had to leap just to get his hands on the errant pass."

 

[LKP]

Mkay. What would be a bad enough season for you to want Stafford out?? Serious question

It would take two bad seasons in a row. 2014 was a good season considering his lack of support.

Depends on his support. If he had run game, protection and weapons and had 17+ picks and upper 50%. He's never had all 3 and even when he had 2, the run game wasn't there for 6 games, Calvin was hurt, weapons had troubles, lost fumbles, drops etc etc. Stafford still produced 29 TDs and good 3rd down % and alot of yards leading us on long drives in 2013. Great PFF rating too.

Also depends on the wins and playoff performance. 11 wins and Stafford played well against Dallas even without much run game or protection. His grade suffered some but he didn't have the run game or protection. 33 TDs and 38 FG attempt drives depsite lack of support. Stafford, Calvin/Tate and defense are all on the same level of why we won 11 games.

60% to 65% is 2 better throws a game or the weapons doing their job 2 more times or the protection doing it's job 2 more times or the run game getting better down and distance 2 more times. Lots can happen.

 

[kdp1980]

If he gets the credit for the TDs he gets the credit for the INTs.

Ravens game

Detroit (7-7) has hurt its playoff chances by losing four of five, falling out of sole possession of first place in the NFC North to third behind the division-leading Chicago Bears and Green Bay.

"This is a setback, no question," Lions coach Jim Schwartz said. "We had control and now we need help. We have to get two wins and let the rest shake out."

Stafford's three interceptions followed a troubling trend for the franchise.

He has 12 turnovers, including two fumbles, in his last five games. Not coincidentally, the Lions have been able to overcome those miscues well enough to win only one game during the slump.

Giants game

"Matthew Stafford was worse: 25 of 42 for 222 yards and two interceptions, the second was returned by Will Hill for a TD that tied it at 20 with 4:57 left in the lackluster game.

Stafford threw high and wide of 6-foot-7 tight end Joseph Fauria, who had to leap just to get his hands on the errant pass."

Yep, and somehow this gets sugar coated by lkp. Stafford single handedly destroyed that season.

 

[LKP]

Yep, and somehow this gets sugar coated by lkp. Stafford single handedly destroyed that season.

Watch the tape. Not every pick was his fault. It's clear as day.

Every TD was Stafford based on the game tape.

 

[tomdalton22]

Watch the tape. Not every pick was his fault. It's clear as day.

Every TD was Stafford based on the game tape.

He had 8 INTs dropped in 2013. True 27 INT season.


http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stat-analysis/2014/adjusted-interceptions-2013

 

[LKP]

He had 8 INTs dropped in 2013. True 27 INT season.


http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stat-analysis/2014/adjusted-interceptions-2013

DBs can't catch. It happens for QBs. How many TDs did he have dropped or drops to kill TD drives. Alot and he still had 29 TDs (6th in league).

True 12 int season for Stafford in 2013 with a true over 30 TDs.

I can think of 3 TDs in the Pats game alone this year that were dropped TDs.

And that listing is claiming all 19 are Stafford's fault. That is clearly incorrect. 7 weren't in 2013 and you could make an argument for more.

 

[dubbsco]

When they needed him most in 2013, against Baltimore and the Giants, he was terrible. Just downright terrible. And the stats back that up. True stats.

 

[LKP]

When they needed him most in 2013, against Baltimore and the Giants, he was terrible. Just downright terrible. And the stats back that up. True stats.

Those picks were not all his fault in those 2 games. Separation issues. Calvin limited against Giants. Crazy play by Ngata and Tuck (not Staffords fault on either those. Poor route on 2nd pick. Last pick against Ravens shouldn't have even happened. Miracle FG after Stafford led a game winning drive.

Fauria could have caught that ball. LB to inside had to go outside.

A game winning drive against Baltimore then a miracle FG. Nice lead on Giants with limited Calvin. Big penalty in OT.

Stafford truly won both of those games.

 

[kdp1980]

Those picks were not all his fault in those 2 games. Separation issues. Calvin limited against Giants. Crazy play by Ngata and Tuck (not Staffords fault on either those. Poor route on 2nd pick. Last pick against Ravens shouldn't have even happened. Miracle FG after Stafford led a game winning drive.

Fauria could have caught that ball. LB to inside had to go outside.

A game winning drive against Baltimore then a miracle FG. Nice lead on Giants with limited Calvin. Big penalty in OT.

Stafford truly won both of those games.

I'd honestly like to meet you just to see how far gone your mind really is. It's gotta be incredibly skewed

 

[LKP]

I'd honestly like to meet you just to see how far gone your mind really is. It's gotta be incredibly skewed

You don't give Stafford enough credit on TD drives and FG attempts. You are blind to why plays go wrong. It's not always Stafford fault for the drive stalled or pick or fumble. Penalties, separation, ball security, drops, protection all go into it. It is usually Stafford deserving credit on a TD drive and FG attempt drive (at least doing what he is supposed to do). If he didn't, there probably wouldn't be a TD or FG drive.

 

[tomdalton22]

You don't give Stafford enough credit on TD drives and FG attempts. You are blind to why plays go wrong. It's not always Stafford fault for the drive stalled or pick or fumble. Penalties, separation, ball security, drops, protection all go into it. It is usually Stafford deserving credit on a TD drive and FG attempt drive (at least doing what he is supposed to do). If he didn't, there probably wouldn't be a TD or FG drive.

every QB has that kind of shit happen to them...every one!