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Justin Henry?

because the most important thing from a 2-hole hitter is having a high OBP so they can get on in front of the middle-of-the-order hitters.

Exactly. You want your 2-hole hitter to be a guy who makes a lot of contact and doesn't strike out. Polanco did just that....
 
Exactly. You want your 2-hole hitter to be a guy who makes a lot of contact and doesn't strike out. Polanco did just that....

Yep, if there's one thing I want in a guy batting ahead of Cabrera and Fielder, it's to be able to ground out to short consistently. That's the shit right there.
 
Exactly. You want your 2-hole hitter to be a guy who makes a lot of contact and doesn't strike out. Polanco did just that....

No, you won't somebody who gets on base.

Not striking out does not equate to getting on base.
 
I want a guy who won't GIDP, or strikeout with men in scoring position and actually move 'em over with the hit and run..Polanco was a good player here. As a 2-hitter.
 
I want a guy who won't GIDP, or strikeout with men in scoring position and actually move 'em over with the hit and run..Polanco was a good player here. As a 2-hitter.

It's not like Polanco had some special ability to avoid GIDP.

Polanco was a good player here, and was a good option for the 2 hole in 2007, but he over his tenure here he wasn't a good 2 hitter, you have to be ignorant to think he was.
 
Yep, if there's one thing I want in a guy batting ahead of Cabrera and Fielder, it's to be able to ground out to short consistently. That's the shit right there.

Ok...lol
 
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It's not like Polanco had some special ability to avoid GIDP.

Polanco was a good player here, and was a good option for the 2 hole in 2007, but he over his tenure here he wasn't a good 2 hitter, you have to be ignorant to think he was.

Yeah okay maybe not. But he got the job done when it mattered, in my opinion.
 
Can we at least agree that Polanco should have been a major priority? I see where Lynn Henning says DD will trade for a 2Bman. Let's hope it won't be too late, b/c it won't be until July I guess.
 
Can we at least agree that Polanco should have been a major priority? I see where Lynn Henning says DD will trade for a 2Bman. Let's hope it won't be too late, b/c it won't be until July I guess.

For me, I wouldn't go that far. He was very good here, but getting up there in age and wanting a 3-year deal. Even now I'd take him over kburn but I can certainly understand letting him walk.
 
Can we at least agree that Polanco should have been a major priority? I see where Lynn Henning says DD will trade for a 2Bman. Let's hope it won't be too late, b/c it won't be until July I guess.

Absolutely not.

The Tigers 2B outperformed Polanco at the plate in each of the past two seasons, at a fraction of the costs.

Factoring in age, injury, and salary, it was clearly the right decision to let Polanco go.

Polanco isn't even the best 2B the Tigers have let go in the last three years.
 
Polanco with PHI hitting #2 (893 PAs)

.302 BAVG .351 OBP .381 SLG .732 OPS



Polanco with PHI with runners on base

.293 BAVG .342 OBP .380 SLG .722 OPS


An issue being overlooked, DET didn't offer Polanco arbitration. Had he declined, and still signed with PHI, we would have received draft pick(s). That fall/winter we also traded away Granderson and E. Jackson for A. Jackson, Scherzer and Schlereth.

We got younger and cheaper. That's it.
 
For me, I wouldn't go that far. He was very good here, but getting up there in age and wanting a 3-year deal. Even now I'd take him over kburn but I can certainly understand letting him walk.

Yeah, in truth what I was saying was simply in hindsight. Fact is, I had no problem seeing PP go at the time. Monday morning QB in me says that I and others were horribly wrong & short sighted. Sizemore, Rhymes and Kbum are all inferior in the field and no match for Polanco or Infante at the plate, imho. And, unless DD makes a trade for a solid 2nd baseman, I can see the Tig's in 3rd or 4th by the end of the season. It's that important.
 
Yeah, in truth what I was saying was simply in hindsight. Fact is, I had no problem seeing PP go at the time. Monday morning QB in me says that I and others were horribly wrong & short sighted. Sizemore, Rhymes and Kbum are all inferior in the field and no match for Polanco or Infante at the plate, imho. And, unless DD makes a trade for a solid 2nd baseman, I can see the Tig's in 3rd or 4th by the end of the season. It's that important.

Sizemore was a better hitter than Polanco last season.

And Raburn has been better every season since 2009.
 
Sizemore was a better hitter than Polanco last season.

And Raburn has been better every season since 2009.

Really?
S Sizemore, 2011: 112 K's, .245, 11 HRs
P Polanco, 2011: 44 K's, .277, 5 Hrs

since 2009:

Raburn 295 hits, .291, .280, .256, .154 162 RBIs, 158 Runs
Polanco 507 hits, .285, .298, .277, .281 182 RBIs, 218 Runs

and we won't even mention the fielding differentials.
 
I think we should discuss this some more ..Because like Mjsb2 said you have to factor in his injuries salary and such but when is too many guys a problem.. Here goes... Now we all know Polonco played mostly 3rd base those two years but anyway here is what the tigers had in 2010 and 11.


2010 Games started and WAR overall 4.3 WAR from these guys overall.. polanco had a 3.1 for 2010...
................GS.........WAR
Rhymes.....46.........1.0
Guillen .....45..........0.2
Sizemore..36.........-0.8
Santiago...12..........2.4
Raburn.....15...........1.5
Worth........8...........0.0

In 2011 Tiger hitters had a combined +0.7 WAR, and Polanco had a 1.6....Surely Polanco's .335 OBP last year would have taken some of the pressure off of Jackson last year and stretched our line-up out even more while he was playing.
2011...........GS.........WAR
Santiago......40...........1.6
Raburn........55..........-0.1
Guillen.........25.........-0.3
Rhymes........22........-0.4
Sizemore......17..........0.1
Worth............3.........-0.2


We also committed 34 errors over two years 16 in 2010 and 18 in 2011 while Polanco committed 2 for the tigers in 2009, and 5 in 2010, and 8 in 2011 (again mostly playing 3rd for Philadelphia) remember he had that great fielding stretch with Detroit.. I think it is worth the argument that having a steady 2nd basemen who can play 132 games and 122 (Polanco's last 2 years) games is better then throwing a guy on the dart board to see who sticks..


I will give raburn credit this year his fielding is much better but he did commit 10 of the 18 second basemen errors last year in 55 games ...He only had 1 in 2010 in much less games. The Hitting numbers could change a tad depending on who played second base and when give or take a tad but if you ask me if a team has had 7 different 2nd basemen in two year's counting Inge has a real big problem.
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Really?
S Sizemore, 2011: 112 K's, .245, 11 HRs
P Polanco, 2011: 44 K's, .277, 5 Hrs

since 2009:

Raburn 295 hits, .291, .280, .256, .154 162 RBIs, 158 Runs
Polanco 507 hits, .285, .298, .277, .281 182 RBIs, 218 Runs

and we won't even mention the fielding differentials.


Triple crown stats, strikeouts, and hits?

This isn't 1940.

First, Sizemore and Polanco last season:

Sizemore .245/.342/.399 for a .741 OPS. He had a .330 wOBA, good for a 108 wRC+.
Polanco .277/.335/.339 for a .674 OPS. He also had a .304 wOBA, for a 88 wRC+.

So yeah, Polanco got on base less and hit for significantly less power. Using these raw numbers alone it's clear Sizemore was a more effective hitter.

But then you factor in Polanco did this with half his games coming in a little league ballpark while Sizemore played in Detroit and Oakland, and yeah, you get the large gap you find in their wRC+ numbes.

At the plate...Sizemore>>>Polanco.

Now for Raburn.

2009:

Raburn hit .291/.351/.533 for a .378 wOBA.

Polanco hit .285/.331/.396 for a .321 OBP.

This season isn't even close.

2010:

Raburn hit .280/.340/.474 for a .354 wOBA.

Polanco hit .298/.339/.386 for a .323 wOBA.

Once again, it's not even close.

2011:

Raburn hit 256/.297/.432 for a .314 wOBA.

Polanco hit .277/.335/.339 for a .304 wOBA.

This season is close, but Raburns power makes up for Polanco's OBP advantage.

Hey, if Polanco didn't have the power of a little leaguer he'd have an argument here, unfortunately he does, and really doesn't get on base all that much to make up for it either.
 
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