Lions draft grades

[sggatecl]

Guess so, but interesting you listed a bunch of GM reaches/bust. Which you think are so much smarter than everyone else. You proceeded to share your worthless opinion (your words not mine) as a fan on a guard....

Watch a lot of Duke games did you?

Just because GMs are better doesn't make them perfect. Just because fans aren't as good doesn't make them worthless. Why does it have to be one extreme or the other?

I watched Duke/GT and Duke/ASU. They don't get much air time.

 

[brewer229]

Just because GMs are better doesn't make them perfect. Just because fans aren't as good doesn't make them worthless. Why does it have to be one extreme or the other?

I watched Duke/GT and Duke/ASU. They don't get much air time.

Well if you are betting your house, you must be confident. If you give fans that have knowledge of the game a chance to do a draft, I wouldn't be shocked if they made some solid picks that help the team. Could even find some players that contribute that in the late rounds.

The only teams that seem to have consistent success in the draft is Green Bay and more recently Seattle. The rest have been very hit or miss.

My point is more likely than not you are saying Tomlinson is a good pick based on scouting reports and what you've read after we drafted him. I'm guessing you weren't focused on him while watching those two games. Even if you were, he wouldn't of gotten nearly enough camera time from the TV broadcast to come to the conclusion he is a 1st round. So you are making your assumptions based on media and reports from people that are not GMs, the same ones you are saying are worthless.

 

[LKP]

They have some game tape out there.
Draftbreakdown

http://draftbreakdown.com/?s=laken

 

[LKP]

Also every team is different.
Coaching, ability to get playting time, targets/carries, start ,schedule/competition etc.

Success on one team especially as a rookie doesn't mean success on another team.

 

[brewer229]

They have some game tape out there.
Draftbreakdown

http://draftbreakdown.com/?s=laken

That Wilson running back on Duke looks good against Kansas

 

[sggatecl]

Well if you are betting your house, you must be confident. If you give fans that have knowledge of the game a chance to do a draft, I wouldn't be shocked if they made some solid picks that help the team. Could even find some players that contribute that in the late rounds.

You never said anything about fans with knowledge of the game. You said "fans". Go read the comments of any of the Lions Facebook posts after each draft pick and you'd probably throw up. If you want to cherry pick the self informed fans and then have them go up against the GMs, sure, your probability of having a more successful draft goes up. But I'd still be far more confident in the guy(s) that has/have first hand access to the players in the weeks/months before the draft over even the most informed fans that are constantly watching out of town games and reading their fill of scouting reports. They just have an edge that fans will never have.

My point is more likely than not you are saying Tomlinson is a good pick based on scouting reports and what you've read after we drafted him. I'm guessing you weren't focused on him while watching those two games. Even if you were, he wouldn't of gotten nearly enough camera time from the TV broadcast to come to the conclusion he is a 1st round. So you are making your assumptions based on media and reports from people that are not GMs, the same ones you are saying are worthless.

Was I watching Tomlinson every play during the Duke games I watched? Nope, sure wasn't. But I distinctly remember Duke running the ball pretty well in both games and the Duke QB was well protected in both games as well. You asked how many Duke games I watched, I answered. Then you wanted to know what I watched during the games, I answered. How is this relevant at all? No idea, but there you go.

And I haven't once said GMs, fans, or "experts" are worthless. You keep using that word, but I won't.

 

[LKP]

You never said anything about fans with knowledge of the game. You said "fans". Go read the comments of any of the Lions Facebook posts after each draft pick and you'd probably throw up. If you want to cherry pick the self informed fans and then have them go up against the GMs, sure, your probability of having a more successful draft goes up. But I'd still be far more confident in the guy(s) that has/have first hand access to the players in the weeks/months before the draft over even the most informed fans that are constantly watching out of town games and reading their fill of scouting reports. They just have an edge that fans will never have.



Was I watching Tomlinson every play during the Duke games I watched? Nope, sure wasn't. But I distinctly remember Duke running the ball pretty well in both games and the Duke QB was well protected in both games as well. You asked how many Duke games I watched, I answered. Then you wanted to know what I watched during the games, I answered. How is this relevant at all? No idea, but there you go.

And I haven't once said GMs, fans, or "experts" are worthless. You keep using that word, but I won't.

Imagine if fans had to make their own scouting reports. They would be lost.

All GMs could be a scout. All fans, no chance they could scouts. Hand punch, lateral movement, pad level. Fans have no fucking clue.

 

[mhughes0021]

you guys keep saying 5 picks....he wasn't projected to go in the top 2 picks of the 2nd round either. the "projections" has him as a late 2nd round player. 'Lets analyze why:

Hes a guard....he will only ever be a guard. The average round for starting guards in the league is about 3.5.

Hes about the 8-10th best olineman in the draft. Why do I say olineman and not guard? Because most of the tackles taken before him were taken knowing the will play guard. So saying "hes the best guard in the draft" is inaccurate. Typically, (im sure someone can bring up numerous drafts the opposite happens) but typically 10 olineman don't go in the first round. He was chosen 7th....which isn't ridiculous in its own right but if you compare it to other areas of need on your board there was a lot of value a say they DT position which they obviously saw as a major need cause they pissed away a 3rd and 4th round picks on a DT later in the draft.

Most sites will say he was the best pure guard in the draft but will also follow that up with things like:

"Still, it's hard to be overly complimentary about this pick. Taking Tomlinson, who projected as a late-second-round pick based on our evaluation, this early is a reach. It's also somewhat surprising they didn't address the defensive tackle position, considering that it's also a need and Texas defensive tackle Malcolm Brown was still on the board."

None of this matters if he produces like a first round pick. But then when I dare suggest he should produce like a kyle long you guys immediately back track and say...."nah, hes on the lions so he shouldn't have to produce." Which is further legitimizing my claim that it was a reach lol.

 

[LKP]

you guys keep saying 5 picks....he wasn't projected to go in the top 2 picks of the 2nd round either. the "projections" has him as a late 2nd round player. 'Lets analyze why:

Hes a guard....he will only ever be a guard. The average round for starting guards in the league is about 3.5.

Hes about the 8-10th best olineman in the draft. Why do I say olineman and not guard? Because most of the tackles taken before him were taken knowing the will play guard. So saying "hes the best guard in the draft" is inaccurate. Typically, (im sure someone can bring up numerous drafts the opposite happens) but typically 10 olineman don't go in the first round. He was chosen 7th....which isn't ridiculous in its own right but if you compare it to other areas of need on your board there was a lot of value a say they DT position which they obviously saw as a major need cause they pissed away a 3rd and 4th round picks on a DT later in the draft.

Most sites will say he was the best pure guard in the draft but will also follow that up with things like:

"Still, it's hard to be overly complimentary about this pick. Taking Tomlinson, who projected as a late-second-round pick based on our evaluation, this early is a reach. It's also somewhat surprising they didn't address the defensive tackle position, considering that it's also a need and Texas defensive tackle Malcolm Brown was still on the board."

None of this matters if he produces like a first round pick. But then when I dare suggest he should produce like a kyle long you guys immediately back track and say...."nah, hes on the lions so he shouldn't have to produce." Which is further legitimizing my claim that it was a reach lol.

There are no experts only the GMs are the experts. Scouts are the experts. Mayock and Kiper. Draftkings.com or whatever or rotoshit.com didn't have all the information.

Mayhew is the expert. Rotoworld, Mayock, Kiper are fakes.

Laken could very well had late 1st, early 2nd round grade on most GMs boards.

Not a reach with no 1st rounders left after pick 18. Which you agreed with.

 

[LKP]

We'll know his value after seeing him play.

The only other way, get a time machine, have Mayhew pick someone else and see where he goes. Or leak or steal all 32 GMs big boards.

 

[tomdalton22]

There are no experts only the GMs are the experts. Scouts are the experts. Mayock and Kiper. Draftkings.com or whatever or rotoshit.com didn't have all the information.

Mayhew is the expert. Rotoworld, Mayock, Kiper are fakes.

Laken could very well had late 1st, early 2nd round grade on most GMs boards.

Not a reach with no 1st rounders left after pick 18. Which you agreed with.

My guess is Mayhew is not the expert talent evaluator within the organization. He is the one who gets all of the info from his "experts" and makes the final decision.

 

[LKP]

My guess is Mayhew is not the expert talent evaluator within the organization. He is the one who gets all of the info from his "experts" and makes the final decision.

He watches tape. He can tell when a draft report is bullshit or not. It's his job. Mayhew is a former player and very bright guy (law degree from Georgetown).

Nobody on this board could give a good scouting report. Nobody.

Everyone on this board can read scouting reports and mock drafts. That is about it. Not a very good opinion especially when talking about value compared to every other player in the draft.

 

[brewer229]

There are no experts only the GMs are the experts. Scouts are the experts. Mayock and Kiper. Draftkings.com or whatever or rotoshit.com didn't have all the information.

Mayhew is the expert. Rotoworld, Mayock, Kiper are fakes.

Laken could very well had late 1st, early 2nd round grade on most GMs boards.

Not a reach with no 1st rounders left after pick 18. Which you agreed with.

WAIT!!!! What about PFF?

 

[tonyballs]

not sure how many times have to say mid 2nd round before it seeps into your thick caveman skull.

My skull? I'm not the one asking the question lol. But I sure as hell is waiting for an answer. Don't answer it though because watching you spin like a fkn top is pure gold!!

 

[tonyballs]

There is no way to prove it, so betting "your house" means nothing.

To say well a GM said it, so it must be close to fact is a joke. They blow picks all the time.

No way the casual fan could just build a better team than a group of scouts or GM though. Not even close

 

[mhughes0021]

My skull? I'm not the one asking the question lol. But I sure as hell is waiting for an answer. Don't answer it though because watching you spin like a fkn top is pure gold!!

mid 2nd round pick

 

[tonyballs]

mid 2nd round pick

Oh boy lol. Ok

 

[tomdalton22]

No way the casual fan could just build a better team than a group of scouts or GM though. Not even close

come on Tony...I won my fantasy football league last year!

 

[Mitchrapp]

I agree with much of what you say 'hughes..but who had him mid 2nd round? I still don't understand where you're getting that info?

 

[tonyballs]

My guess is Mayhew is not the expert talent evaluator within the organization. He is the one who gets all of the info from his "experts" and makes the final decision.

No shit? That's called the "Scouting Department". Geezus Krist