Tigers aren't getting Choo, okay already?

[spockmaster]

We still have Don Kelly!!!

now you're just being mean ;_;

 

[Rebbiv]

now you're just being mean ;_;

I have been accused of that before.

But hey, we have the speedster Steve Lombardozzi who could work out in LF!

 

[stonecold2136]

I don't see where you proved your point. Maybe other posters can chime in and maybe offer insight.


Anyways...you took a 22-year old minor league stats (Runs and Stolen Bases) and assimilated them to 4 x 2013 MLB Players. Using the same basic values, I showed you 3 x Ex-Tigers with those same stats (3 from early age and in the minors) who WERE NOT known for blazing speed. Yet, you say I changed the argument. LOL.

By saying 4 x 2013 MLB players that had at least 86 Runs Scored and 30 Stolen Bases, who also are fast runners, does not make Lombardozzi a fast runner because he had those values in one season in the minors. Geez.

FYI...from what I know, Jose Iglesias is the fastest runner on the Tigers right now (Jackson is probably next). Neither will come close to stealing 30 bases in a season. Also, Runs are like Runs Batted In, they are more of a team stat.

I suggest you get a MLB package and watch some out of the market games. I watched a ton of Nationals last year. Lombo has above average speed, and aside from injury he will continue to have his speed. It's been stated over and over by broadcasters other people in the organization and even the fans. But you refuse to accept it. I am done with you and this stupid subject u keep dragging out.

Here is footage a Lombo getting thrown out trying to steal. As you can see he has a terrible jump. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hyl58yw6S3I

It takes a player with average speed 4.2 seconds to 4.6 seconds to get from 1st to 2nd when stealing a base. Anything from 3.6 to 3.9 seconds is considered above average. Anything faster than 3.6 or lower is considered fast. Get your stop watch out I got 3.53 seconds

Good bye MR KNOW IT ALL............ You have been owned

 

[Thumb]

Oh the eye test, yeah you really owned him.

I also like how you picked an instance where Lombozzo got picked off to try to prove how fast he is.

Major LOL props.

 

[pr0tege]

Well Billy Hamilton regularly has 2.9 speed so what classification would that have? lol

 

[UMRules06]

Oh the eye test, yeah you really owned him.

I also like how you picked an instance where Lombozzo got picked off to try to prove how fast he is.

Major LOL props.

I don't really have a dog in this fight but it wasn't an eye test. He said he timed him using a stopwatch and got real data from it. He didn't just watch him and say "wow look how fast he is!"

Just sayin'

 

[Rebbiv]

I suggest you get a MLB package and watch some out of the market games. I watched a ton of Nationals last year. Lombo has above average speed, and aside from injury he will continue to have his speed. It's been stated over and over by broadcasters other people in the organization and even the fans. But you refuse to accept it. I am done with you and this stupid subject u keep dragging out.

Here is footage a Lombo getting thrown out trying to steal. As you can see he has a terrible jump. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hyl58yw6S3I

It takes a player with average speed 4.2 seconds to 4.6 seconds to get from 1st to 2nd when stealing a base. Anything from 3.6 to 3.9 seconds is considered above average. Anything faster than 3.6 or lower is considered fast. Get your stop watch out I got 3.53 seconds

Good bye MR KNOW IT ALL............ You have been owned

I have/had MLB Package and local games are blacked out, so everything is out of market. LOL!!!

 

[Thumb]

I don't really have a dog in this fight but it wasn't an eye test. He said he timed him using a stopwatch and got real data from it. He didn't just watch him and say "wow look how fast he is!"

Just sayin'

Yeah, that's called an "eye test".

Where you don't use official stats, and rely on what you see, even if it's trying to accurately time something from TV (not accurate either) it's still "eye test".

Just sayin'

 

[UMRules06]

Yeah, that's called an "eye test".

Where you don't use official stats, and rely on what you see, even if it's trying to accurately time something from TV (not accurate either) it's still "eye test".

Just sayin'

He's not relying on what he sees. He's using a stopwatch to measure something that he believes is true based on what he sees. He has a hunch and he's setting out to prove it with an experiment.

We just have different definitions of eye test I guess. What he's doing is not an MLB official stat sure, but it's enough to help confirm or deny his hunch based from his observations. It's not somebody just going "hey I watch this guy all the time, and he's the fastest guy in MLB for sure!"

An eye test for me is just what it says. Information gleaned just from watching and nothing else.

 

[Rebbiv]

It takes a player with average speed 4.2 seconds to 4.6 seconds to get from 1st to 2nd when stealing a base. Anything from 3.6 to 3.9 seconds is considered above average. Anything faster than 3.6 or lower is considered fast. Get your stop watch out I got 3.53 seconds

Good bye MR KNOW IT ALL............ You have been owned

http://www.minorleagueball.com/2011...day-steve-lombardozzi-2b-washington-nationals

The quote: "He has average physical speed but is an aggressive and skilled runner and stealer."

I will take a Minorleaguebaseball.com assessment of his speed before your's.

 

[Rebbiv]

http://www.hsbaseballweb.com/pro-scouting/scouting_speed.htm

Oh, and an average is 4.2 to 4.3 to go to 1st base. Why would it take longer to go to 2nd?

 

[turok]

If the Tigers are not going to sign any FA positional players, then although they may still be contenders in the weak AL Central, I don't see them advancing much less to the WS in the postseason despite their SP, morso b/c of their weakened offense, the lack of a decent bench and perhaps a shaky and undependable BP. Their closer in Nathan would need 1-3 run lead to justify his appearance, and the Tigers offense might not be able to provide him with one often enough.

They may as well shoot for '15, and trade Scherzer and Porcello for the pieces that they will need to replace Hunter and Martinez, Avila is perhaps just one more concussion away from becoming the Tigers version of ex-Lions RB Best. Yet the Tigers will sit on this and apparently intend to provide a backup in Holaday who may not and probably never will be worthy of succeeding Alex as the Tigers starting C.

This team as it is comprised now @ this point in the off-season, is VERY ill-equipped to withstand injuries that inevitably will occur during the long grind of the regulat season. If they have merely a couple of DL stints by the rotation, and/or a few in the field, then they might very well become sellers before the late July '14 trade deadline.

 

[UMRules06]

If the Tigers are not going to sign any FA positional players, then although they may still be contenders in the weak AL Central, I don't see them advancing much less to the WS in the postseason despite their SP, morso b/c of their weakened offense, the lack of a decent bench and perhaps a shaky and undependable BP. Their closer in Nathan would need 1-3 run lead to justify his appearance, and the Tigers offense might not be able to provide him with one often enough.

They may as well shoot for '15, and trade Scherzer and Porcello for the pieces that they will need to replace Hunter and Martinez, Avila is perhaps just one more concussion away from becoming the Tigers version of ex-Lions RB Best. Yet the Tigers will sit on this and apparently intend to provide a backup in Holaday who may not and probably never will be worthy of succeeding Alex as the Tigers starting C.

This team as it is comprised now @ this point in the off-season, is VERY ill-equipped to withstand injuries that inevitably will occur during the long grind of the regulat season. If they have merely a couple of DL stints by the rotation, and/or a few in the field, then they might very well become sellers before the late July '14 trade deadline.

Yea I hate to be pessimistic because I'm usually the opposite, but it's hard to see the glass as half full with the kind of offseason the Tigers have had so far. I do agree that our rotation is still strong enough at this point to keep us as contenders in 2014, but your point is valid about injuries. What happens if Sanchez goes down again for example? Or even worse JV or Miggy?

I suppose no team can really handle losing their best players all that well, but it's a troubling thought.

 

[pr0tege]

Check FanGraphs for crying out loud. Probably the most in-depth statistical sight for baseball statistics and yes they even have a speed rating for players.

Steve Lombardozzi rates in at a 3.7 Speed Rating.

Tigers Ratings:
Hernan Perez - 7.4
Austin Jackson - 6.1
Andy Dirks - 4.7
Don Kelly - 4.5
Torii Hunter - 4.4
Jose Iglesias - 3.1
Miguel Cabrera - 2.8
Alex Avila - 1.9
Victor Martinez - 1.3

So honestly a 3.7 is not a classification for above average speed. By the way I believe Ellsbury has the highest rating at an 8.2

 

[tomdalton22]

Check FanGraphs for crying out loud. Probably the most in-depth statistical sight for baseball statistics and yes they even have a speed rating for players.

Steve Lombardozzi rates in at a 3.7 Speed Rating.

Tigers Ratings:
Hernan Perez - 7.4
Austin Jackson - 6.1
Andy Dirks - 4.7
Don Kelly - 4.5
Torii Hunter - 4.4
Jose Iglesias - 3.1
Miguel Cabrera - 2.8
Alex Avila - 1.9
Victor Martinez - 1.3

So honestly a 3.7 is not a classification for above average speed. By the way I believe Ellsbury has the highest rating at an 8.2

Based on those ratings I assume that 0 is the starting point.

 

[grandy]

Paul Konerko had a 0.8 rating this past season, so my guess is 0 = stationary

http://www.fangraphs.com/library/offense/spd/

 

[Thumb]

He's not relying on what he sees. He's using a stopwatch to measure something that he believes is true based on what he sees. He has a hunch and he's setting out to prove it with an experiment.

We just have different definitions of eye test I guess. What he's doing is not an MLB official stat sure, but it's enough to help confirm or deny his hunch based from his observations. It's not somebody just going "hey I watch this guy all the time, and he's the fastest guy in MLB for sure!"

An eye test for me is just what it says. Information gleaned just from watching and nothing else.

It's still an eye test because his stopwatch is not official. Unless it's timed in realtime, than the accuracy is questionable. In fact, the TV broadcast and subsequent youtube replay is not likely to be in realtime either.

So my point is he can use whatever method he likes, it still falls under his human error of what his eye see's on a non official replay, plus the eye-hand coordination of being able to accurately start and stop a stopwatch at the correct times.

 

[turok]

Yea I hate to be pessimistic because I'm usually the opposite, but it's hard to see the glass as half full with the kind of offseason the Tigers have had so far. I do agree that our rotation is still strong enough at this point to keep us as contenders in 2014, but your point is valid about injuries. What happens if Sanchez goes down again for example? Or even worse JV or Miggy?

I suppose no team can really handle losing their best players all that well, but it's a troubling thought.

I feel that Avila needs a PLATOON partner, not a cheap scrub backup in Holaday. Signing the FA Napoli might be their best bet, b/c he would provide the Tigers with more IF flexibility, for example in the event that Castellanos proves himself not ready for prime/full time @ 3B, The Tigers could slide Miggy back to 3B, in a platoon while platooning Napoli @ C and @ 1B with VMart. He could also serve as DH on occasion, as could Nick when Miggy plays 3B.

 

[Thumb]

Wait...Iggy is slower than Don Kelly, Andy Dirks, and the old-as-dirt-Torii Hunter?

and only marginally faster than Cabrera?

 

[pr0tege]

Based on those ratings I assume that 0 is the starting point.

Excellent - 7.0
Great - 6.0
Above Average - 5.5
Average - 4.5
Below Average - 4.0
Poor - 3.0
Awful - 2.0