Tired of talking about 2013 and before.....

[tonyballs]

You have? Not to be a jerk, but do you really know what is going on in those rooms while they are discussing this stuff?

Ink, teams trade down all the time. I would much rather have seen this Lions team trade back, end up with a defensive prospect and another 2nd round pick vs the guy that they took in the top 10.

I'll be honest, and maybe this is just my blinders speaking, but whenever I watch the entire first round, I see most of the teams using the majority of the clock. I know this because I get irritated with it taking so long. And then the Lions roll up, and they don't even have time to flash the Lion logo before it says "Pick is in." To me, that's piss poor management. If you don't hear something that works, you still have your guy. He won't know the difference. It's just doing your due diligence. That is what being an owner/manager is all about.

Practice what you preach. You or i don't know what's going on or what was even said between Mayhew and other GMs. You're 100% assuming that they haven't listened to anybody. They were the 10th pick in the draft. Plenty of time to talk to other teams about trades. We don't have a fn clue what was said or not even said.

 

[tonyballs]

And the Lions are not the only team that "runs up to the podium". My God, man, you're reaching lol

 

[dubbsco]

Tony, how do teams that want their guy know he will be available until the Lions get their pick? It's entirely possible a bunch of guys wanted guy X at pick 10, thought he was going to be taken at 9, and when he wasn't, they had an opportunity to swap with Detroit. The clock is there for a reason, to me it's just bad management to not let the time run out and see if a team behind you cracks under the pressure and offers you more than you expected for the pick.

 

[tomdalton22]

And the Lions are not the only team that "runs up to the podium". My God, man, you're reaching lol

we know MN doesn't...they are so slow that they missed 2 first round picks!

 

[tonyballs]

Tony, how do teams that want their guy know he will be available until the Lions get their pick? It's entirely possible a bunch of guys wanted guy X at pick 10, thought he was going to be taken at 9, and when he wasn't, they had an opportunity to swap with Detroit. The clock is there for a reason, to me it's just bad management to not let the time run out and see if a team behind you cracks under the pressure and offers you more than you expected for the pick.

I can't answer that question and I won't pretend to know the answer either. But it's all guessing at this point. These guys talk though and I'm guessing they have a pretty good idea if they can make a trade or not. So, to sit there and say it's "bad management" on the Lions for not letting the time run out is pure speculation on your part that they weren't trying to make a deal beforehand. Maybe nobody wanted to talk to them and they knew? Their guy was there and they were picking him anyways? I don't know and neither does anyone else if you weren't in the war room with those guys. We do know that some calls were made, but it ends there......

My guess is they wanted Watkins and Gilbert bad. Both were gone. Next in line was Ebron and they jumped on it. They could have been talking to teams right after Watkins went to Buffalo. Who knows!!

 

[tonyballs]

we know MN doesn't...they are so slow that they missed 2 first round picks!

Exactly! Still managed Kevin Williams though lol

 

[LKP]

Everything you post you've said 100X before. Just shut up.

No. You are wrong. As always.

 

[dubbsco]

Well, as an outsider viewer who has no idea what is going on in the war room, I have an opinion that I know is shared by some but not all. I have talked to people who said that was the guy they wanted, why wait? I have also talked to some friends who took my side and said they didn't do their homework.

The time is there for a reason. Other teams around may buckle under the pressure with 1-2 minutes left and offer more than you ever imagined. As a GM, he didn't even give himself a chance for that. You can have a guy standing by the door with the card that says Ebron on it. Tell him to hang on while the clock runs, sit by the phone and if you get blown away by an offer, then you used every resource the draft provides. And if nothing comes, or nothing that you want, tell the kid to walk that card up. No harm, no foul. You don't even give yourself a chance for that opportunity.

 

[tonyballs]

Well, as an outsider viewer who has no idea what is going on in the war room, I have an opinion that I know is shared by some but not all. I have talked to people who said that was the guy they wanted, why wait? I have also talked to some friends who took my side and said they didn't do their homework.

The time is there for a reason. Other teams around may buckle under the pressure with 1-2 minutes left and offer more than you ever imagined. As a GM, he didn't even give himself a chance for that. You can have a guy standing by the door with the card that says Ebron on it. Tell him to hang on while the clock runs, sit by the phone and if you get blown away by an offer, then you used every resource the draft provides. And if nothing comes, or nothing that you want, tell the kid to walk that card up. No harm, no foul. You don't even give yourself a chance for that opportunity.

Again....you're opinion

 

[dubbsco]

Of course it is. But it's pretty factual that the draft gives every team a certain amount of time, and the Lions used little to none of it. I'm forming my opinion off of that. That's the part that bothers me.

The former GM used to do this crap all the time. Rush the pick up to the podium like he was a kid who just discovered plutonium. I get the shivers thinking about that.

 

[LKP]

The draft is about planning. You should know your pick and not be making this decision in 10 minutes. And we don't know if the phone rang or not or would have in the last few minutes.

Maybe Ebron was rated high enough a trade wouldn't be worth it to them.

 

[dubbsco]

LKP, it's not about making the pick in 10 minutes. That's not what the issue is. I understand every team is going to have their guy. The issue (for me, not everyone) is that the draft can be planned for 8 months, and then your entire system blows up in 2 minutes because someone took a weird player in the top 5, or offered a trade that you didn't expect.

To me, there is absolutely zero harm in letting the clock run out to see if a GM in the 15-20 range blows their nut with a few minutes left and offers you something ridiculous to get to 10. Lions didn't even leave themselves open to that possibility.

 

[SouthOfMackinac]

LKP, it's not about making the pick in 10 minutes. That's not what the issue is. I understand every team is going to have their guy. The issue (for me, not everyone) is that the draft can be planned for 8 months, and then your entire system blows up in 2 minutes because someone took a weird player in the top 5, or offered a trade that you didn't expect.

To me, there is absolutely zero harm in letting the clock run out to see if a GM in the 15-20 range blows their nut with a few minutes left and offers you something ridiculous to get to 10. Lions didn't even leave themselves open to that possibility.

I felt like Ebron was who they wanted and they were giddy he was still on the board. Their target was available. Why wait? They had their bird in hand.

I'm more perplexed by picking a project center so early in the draft than I thought twice about them sprinting up to get the guy they were known to covet.

 

[dubbsco]

It's not a hill I'm going to stay on and fight off the hordes. It's just how I feel, regardless of whether or not that's the guy you want. I get flashes of Millen doing the same crap, and it scares the hell out of me.

Yeah, that part bothers me too lol.

 

[tomdalton22]

LKP, it's not about making the pick in 10 minutes. That's not what the issue is. I understand every team is going to have their guy. The issue (for me, not everyone) is that the draft can be planned for 8 months, and then your entire system blows up in 2 minutes because someone took a weird player in the top 5, or offered a trade that you didn't expect.

To me, there is absolutely zero harm in letting the clock run out to see if a GM in the 15-20 range blows their nut with a few minutes left and offers you something ridiculous to get to 10. Lions didn't even leave themselves open to that possibility.

I agree with this. People say that the Lions had 4 "blue chip" players in this draft and Ebron was one of them. When he slid to 10 they were "ecstatic". So...when he "slipped" to 10 I would have 2 thoughts on my mind. 1) this guy has top 4 talent so there will be some team that wants to trade up to get him...let's listen. 2) 6 teams in front of us don't agree with our assessment...I wonder if we missed something about this kid.

 

[boogerlovejoy]

I agree with this. People say that the Lions had 4 "blue chip" players in this draft and Ebron was one of them. When he slid to 10 they were "ecstatic". So...when he "slipped" to 10 I would have 2 thoughts on my mind. 1) this guy has top 4 talent so there will be some team that wants to trade up to get him...let's listen. 2) 6 teams in front of us don't agree with our assessment...I wonder if we missed something about this kid.

Holy crap, #2 is dumb. If you don't have confidence in your own evaluations, you shouldn't be a GM. NOBODY bases their board according to what other teams think.

Think about that? Just stop and think about what you just said. Wow.

Wonder if Minnesota thought that way when they drafted a free falling Randy Moss. "Well, 20 other teams passed on him.....guess we should too"

Just dumb, man.

 

[tomdalton22]

Holy crap, #2 is dumb. If you don't have confidence in your own evaluations, you shouldn't be a GM. NOBODY bases their board according to what other teams think.

Think about that? Just stop and think about what you just said. Wow.

Wonder if Minnesota thought that way when they drafted a free falling Randy Moss. "Well, 20 other teams passed on him.....guess we should too"

Just dumb, man.

So if you are a GM you just assume that you and your staff are the only ones that know what they are doing? That would be dumb!

As far as basing your board on what others think...that is not what I said. If a guy you think is top 4 and he is passed over you have to wonder why. It could be need based, etc. but if you are not looking at what other teams are doing and how they evaluate talent you are not doing your job. Hell, there are probably 15-20 teams in the league that consistently draft better than the Lions!

Ebron might be the best player that comes out of this draft. He might be the 4th best player. My guess is he won't. The odds say he won't and the Lions draft history tells me he won't. I trust other team's talent evaluation abilities much more than the Lions.

 

[boogerlovejoy]

So if you are a GM you just assume that you and your staff are the only ones that know what they are doing? That would be dumb!

As far as basing your board on what others think...that is not what I said. If a guy you think is top 4 and he is passed over you have to wonder why. It could be need based, etc. but if you are not looking at what other teams are doing and how they evaluate talent you are not doing your job. Hell, there are probably 15-20 teams in the league that consistently draft better than the Lions!

Ebron might be the best player that comes out of this draft. He might be the 4th best player. My guess is he won't. The odds say he won't and the Lions draft history tells me he won't. I trust other team's talent evaluation abilities much more than the Lions.

Nowhere did I say that nobody else knows what they're doing, nor did I imply it. My point was simple, you trust YOUR scouting and YOUR board. You don't second guess a player because another team passed on him. THAT, would be dumb.

 

[dubbsco]

Well unfortunately, some others on this board have justified passing on Dennard because he fell to 24.

 

[LKP]

Well unfortunately, some others on this board have justified passing on Dennard because he fell to 24.

Ebron is the better prospect with a higher rating. He has matchup problem potential for opponents.

Slay year 2 and Mathis are the starters. Probably even if Dennard is drafted.

We'll see how it all turns out. Cincy and their 4 1st round picks at CB with Hall, Kirkpatrick, Jones and now Dennard.