Game 10: Lions @ Panthers Thread

[Mitchrapp]

Matt was never good enough to produce without everything going well. He could never take it upon himself to win a game by himself. The Cleveland game when he busted his shoulder was the only time. He's need Calvin.

 

[LKP]

Matt was never good enough to produce without everything going well. He could never take it upon himself to win a game by himself. The Cleveland game when he busted his shoulder was the only time. He's need Calvin.

He has a better QB rating without Calvin actually

But the point is, he has no support. None. If its just run game, yeah ok he should still produce. The point you all are missing is

HE HAS NOTHING IN THESE TYPE OF GAMES
No run game, drops galore on good throws, penalties killing drives (and taking away beautiful TDs), sacks not Staffords fault killing drives, bad defense, bad game plan, no open WRs. It is literally impossible for any QB to have success with all those negatives. Stop comparing him to teams that have open WRs or some defense or some run game.

 

[tomdalton22]

He has a better QB rating without Calvin actually

But the point is, he has no support. None. If its just run game, yeah ok he should still produce. The point you all are missing is

HE HAS NOTHING IN THESE TYPE OF GAMES
No run game, drops galore on good throws, penalties killing drives (and taking away beautiful TDs), sacks not Staffords fault killing drives, bad defense, bad game plan, no open WRs. It is literally impossible for any QB to have success with all those negatives. Stop comparing him to teams that have open WRs or some defense or some run game.

finally, you are admitting that you have been wrong all year about this team. You finally realize they have a shitty coaching staff, shitty offensive players, and a shitty defense.

 

[LKP]

finally, you are admitting that you have been wrong all year about this team. You finally realize they have a shitty coaching staff, shitty offensive players, and a shitty defense.

Bevell needs running success for the offense to work it seems and loves Peterson too much. Swift was hurt which seems pretty big now. Oline needs to man up and block better. They are capable just were awful yesterday. They have in other games.

So am I wrong about the talent on offense. No. Are they executing though, not yesterday but have other days. Are there injuries that change things. Yes. It's not right or wrong, it's alot is happening that causes lack of execution in certain games. Also KG out is pretty big for this offense too.

You guys need to take everything into account

 

[tomdalton22]

Bevell needs running success for the offense to work it seems and loves Peterson too much. Swift was hurt which seems pretty big now. Oline needs to man up and block better. They are capable just were awful yesterday. They have in other games.

So am I wrong about the talent on offense. No. Are they executing though, not yesterday but have other days. Are there injuries that change things. Yes. It's not right or wrong, it's alot is happening that causes lack of execution in certain games. Also KG out is pretty big for this offense too.

You guys need to take everything into account

10 games in and the offense averages 343 yards per game (25th in the league) and 22.7 points per game (22nd in the league). Stafford with a QB rating that ranks 20th in the NFL.

Shitty offense, check.

10 games in and the defense is giving up 397.4 yards per game (27th in the league) and 28.7 points per game (29th in the league)

Shitty defense, check.

lack of execution is due to shitty players and shitty coaching.

Shitty coaching, check

4-6 getting shut out by a shitty Panthers team led by a QB making his first NFL start. Only the second shutout of the season (the other being the winless Jets)

LKP wrong as usual, check! :lmao:

 

[LKP]

Yeah a shut out skews things for PPG in 10 games

The Lions offense has played well a good amount of the year. There are halves or the Panthers game where they have struggled. Not having KG sucks and they need Swift for a run game.

Offense has talent and has executed this season and 2019 first half too. They laid an egg on Sunday with a bunch of key injuries, poor game plan and lack of execution

Have to run the table now which looks daunting with how they are playing.

New regime incoming so I won't have to hear bitching about this one anymore. You will all love the new regime just like you did Patricia when he got hired. Trade Stafford, he deserves to be on a team that gives him support and stays healthier

 

[tomdalton22]

Yeah a shut out skews things for PPG in 10 games

The Lions offense has played well a good amount of the year. There are halves or the Panthers game where they have struggled. Not having KG sucks and they need Swift for a run game.

Offense has talent and has executed this season and 2019 first half too. They laid an egg on Sunday with a bunch of key injuries, poor game plan and lack of execution

Have to run the table now which looks daunting with how they are playing.

New regime incoming so I won't have to hear bitching about this one anymore. You will all love the new regime just like you did Patricia when he got hired. Trade Stafford, he deserves to be on a team that gives him support and stays healthier

well, every game counts...even the ones that an offense doesn't score. I know one thing for sure, you are never going to win a game with 0 points.

As far as Stafford "deserving" to be on a team that gives him support and stays healthier, all teams suffer injuries. Good QBs can help overcome them...this week Stafford wasn't able to do that (0 points). :lmao:

You are right about one thing...Stafford needs a lot around him in order to win. Right now he doesn't have those things. He is surrounded by total crap....just like we tried to tell you all year. The problem with Matt is it appears that he may need to fall into a perfect situation in order to win. Maybe a team like Indy or SF. Good coaching, good D, and a team built around a running game. All they need is a QB that won't screw it up. MAYBE he could win in those two places??? :no:

 

[LKP]

Stafford needs like 2 out of 6 things for support to be great. He typically has been getting 0 of 6 recently. All Qbs need at least 2 areas of support

Run game, good weapon play, protection, defense, short field turnovers, health

And as for 0 points. Stafford still threw a bomb to Marvin that should have been a TD and Prater shanked one (his fucking 7th shank this year)

 

[detrisin]

They laid an egg on Sunday with a bunch of key injuries,...

Which means they have no depth.

Shitty GM, Check.

 

[LKP]

Which means they have no depth.

Shitty GM, Check.

Kerryon has produced. Peterson can do just enough but got old just in time to play for the Lions. The problem was more the Oline being terrible in blocking. Hock too. I think most GMs would say that is good RB depth. Didn't executue

Stafford hurt, KG and Amendola and Swift out. That is alot of offensive firepower. And again, if Stafford under pressure often, makes it even worse.

Oline should take the biggest blame

Plus the penalty taking away the TD and Prater shank. Panthers on the other hand nail a 56 yard FG and then get a second chance for another FG. 6 points right there.

And for pass rush. Flowers hurt, Hand hurt, J Okwara been IR awhile, Bryant hurt. Lots of pass rushers hurt. They even traded for Griffen. Good trade, yet didn't execute Sunday. R Okwara can't do it every week.

Walker had all day to throw. Eventually DJ Moore and Robbie Anderson will get open. Walker had like a 77 rating anyway which is not good with the 2 picks

 

[tomdalton22]

Stafford needs like 2 out of 6 things for support to be great. He typically has been getting 0 of 6 recently. All Qbs need at least 2 areas of support

Run game, good weapon play, protection, defense, short field turnovers, health

And as for 0 points. Stafford still threw a bomb to Marvin that should have been a TD and Prater shanked one (his fucking 7th shank this year)

I probably agree with you in one respect. Stafford might be the best player on the Lions. However, that isn't a ringing endorsement for Stafford...it just tells you how shitty the rest of the team is. He is an above average starting NFL QB surrounded by heaping piles of shit on both sides of the ball, coaching on the sidelines and in the front office.

 

[LKP]

I probably agree with you in one respect. Stafford might be the best player on the Lions. However, that isn't a ringing endorsement for Stafford...it just tells you how shitty the rest of the team is. He is an above average starting NFL QB surrounded by heaping piles of shit on both sides of the ball, coaching on the sidelines and in the front office.

There is talent. Some games just extreme lack of execution. Was the offensive support of Stafford this week very much so (Oline, weapons, RBs). Most other weeks it has been the defense forcing Stafford to have to score 35 points to win and then he has to force things (some of his picks).

Not having KG and Swift in one thing. Not having KG/Swift, plus no blocking, plus no short field turnovers, plus drops to the people left, plus the defense gives up points and loses TOP. It's too much for anyone

 

[tomdalton22]

There is talent. Some games just extreme lack of execution. Was the offensive support of Stafford this week very much so (Oline, weapons, RBs). Most other weeks it has been the defense forcing Stafford to have to score 35 points to win and then he has to force things (some of his picks).

Not having KG and Swift in one thing. Not having KG/Swift, plus no blocking, plus no short field turnovers, plus drops to the people left, plus the defense gives up points and loses TOP. It's too much for anyone

If a player has all of the talent in the world but doesn't execute...they aren't any good.

It'd be like a basketball player. Looks the part, can make every shot in practice, super athletic, but gets in a game situation and can't make a shot. Guess what...he sucks.

If you follow the Pistons...that's Darko Milicic.

The Lions should be called the Detroit Darkos.

 

[LKP]

It's not every game for every player.

Sometimes players play really well individually. Like Stafford could but if the Oline is playing like dogshit then Stafford can't shine. Same with RBs with no blocking. Barry Sanders isn't back there

Sometimes 18 could play really well but if 4 players play like absolute trash we could lose. Like Okudah for instance getting burnt as the trash. Or the 4 Dline as the trash giving opposing QB all the time in the world to burn even good secondary players.

And sometimes a player could play well almost all game but then 2-3 plays get absolutely beat. It could be on a play where the opposing team finally executes and our pass rush happens to not execute on that play too. Okudah beat by Moore play for instance. And then everyone just remembers the 2-3 bad plays

 

[LKP]

But whatever. Blow the team up. They had the talent, and the coaches had their chance, just never executed enough at the same time offensively/defensively. If offense did well and just needed the defense to be average/slightlybelow average, they would be god awful and cause losses. Defense does a rare step up then the offense goes to sleep for a half (or whole game in Carolina case)

New Dline but hang on to Flowers (contract and good)/Hand (cheap), 3 new LBs (though Collins depends on contract and new system), need at least one CB (maybe two if they don't like Coleman) plus Okudah is going to get his head out his ass in year 2, two new safeties (Walker regressed so so so much, Harmon a FA, Kearse gabage FA, Harris garbage)

Offense figure out how to re-sign KG or franchise but that sucks up so much cap. Have Swift and Hock, Decker, Ragnow, Jackson keepers. Vaitai one more year due to contract. So need one more guard

And then QB, Stafford is great but if you get a kings ransom, you rebuild with a new QB after a trade. That way you don't have to subject Stafford to this bullshit anymore plus get the cap space. But having QB as a hole is never a good thing

 

[tomdalton22]

It's not every game for every player.

Sometimes players play really well individually. Like Stafford could but if the Oline is playing like dogshit then Stafford can't shine. Same with RBs with no blocking. Barry Sanders isn't back there

Sometimes 18 could play really well but if 4 players play like absolute trash we could lose. Like Okudah for instance getting burnt as the trash. Or the 4 Dline as the trash giving opposing QB all the time in the world to burn even good secondary players.

And sometimes a player could play well almost all game but then 2-3 plays get absolutely beat. It could be on a play where the opposing team finally executes and our pass rush happens to not execute on that play too. Okudah beat by Moore play for instance. And then everyone just remembers the 2-3 bad plays

this is why everyone thinks you are so stupid. It's right in front of you, but you just refuse to see it. After Stafford went down last year they were 0-8. Before he went down, they were 3-4-1 which isn't great. Since that time, they are 4-6. In 2018 they were 6-10. They are near the bottom of the league in offensive and defensive stats. The team is trash. They might have a few players that are decent, but I don't think they have one really good player. Maybe Decker and Ragnow on the OL and I do like Swift. I don't know if they have a single playmaker on defense.

Like I said, I think Stafford is their best player and he really isn't anything special.

 

[Mitchrapp]

Yeah a shut out skews things for PPG in 10 games

So does a 34 point game. Take out the highest and lower and carry a 1 and the team stinks, check.

 

[tomdalton22]

But whatever. Blow the team up. They had the talent, and the coaches had their chance, just never executed enough at the same time offensively/defensively. If offense did well and just needed the defense to be average/slightlybelow average, they would be god awful and cause losses. Defense does a rare step up then the offense goes to sleep for a half (or whole game in Carolina case)

New Dline but hang on to Flowers (contract and good)/Hand (cheap), 3 new LBs (though Collins depends on contract and new system), need at least one CB (maybe two if they don't like Coleman) plus Okudah is going to get his head out his ass in year 2, two new safeties (Walker regressed so so so much, Harmon a FA, Kearse gabage FA, Harris garbage)

Offense figure out how to re-sign KG or franchise but that sucks up so much cap. Have Swift and Hock, Decker, Ragnow, Jackson keepers. Vaitai one more year due to contract. So need one more guard

And then QB, Stafford is great but if you get a kings ransom, you rebuild with a new QB after a trade. That way you don't have to subject Stafford to this bullshit anymore plus get the cap space. But having QB as a hole is never a good thing

finally...a reasonable post (except the Stafford Great comment)

I think you could get a 1st and 2nd for Matt (probably not in the same year though). 2021 1st and 2022 2nd.

 

[LKP]

this is why everyone thinks you are so stupid. It's right in front of you, but you just refuse to see it. After Stafford went down last year they were 0-8. Before he went down, they were 3-4-1 which isn't great. Since that time, they are 4-6. In 2018 they were 6-10. They are near the bottom of the league in offensive and defensive stats. The team is trash. They might have a few players that are decent, but I don't think they have one really good player. Maybe Decker and Ragnow on the OL and I do like Swift. I don't know if they have a single playmaker on defense.

Like I said, I think Stafford is their best player and he really isn't anything special.

3-4-1 is really 5-2-1 if not for refs. That shows the potential of this offense when Stafford was elite those first 8
6-10 2018 was a very different team before Patricia got "his guys'. It was the first year of the rebuild and Cooter was calling predictable plays with a terrible Oline coach in Prince. Kerryon running well but then got hurt too with no depth. And Stafford had 100 rating but then they traded Tate and Marvin got hurt plus Kerryon plus a back injury for final 4 games to lower his QB rating. So you really need some context on what happens.

My problem is I'm too smart, observant and look at everything. You can't just look at the stats and be like ok everyone sucks then. That is beyond dumb which is what most of you do. Same with a loss. Oh we lost, everyone must have sucked (though Carolina game it was damn close to the case sans Stafford). It doesn't work like that. Individuals can play well in a loss. Coaches can coach something well and then the players fuck it up. There are so many variables.

You have to look at what happened. Injuries, refs, talent playing on O but then one side of the ball is atrocious defense, Prater missing 7 kicks in 10 games.

Prater is a perfect example. He is/was a good kicker. But now he's missing 7 kicks in 10 games? That is how holeless becomes an unexpected hole.

 

[Mitchrapp]

What a joke.. Patty's press conference

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RCI2wzN6H4A