Ownership Supports Caldwell

[johnny2x2x]

Ownership should have kept their mouth's shut! If we get a new GM now and he keeps Caldwell it will be a story about how he was pressured to do so.

 

[everyoneneedsasmil]

Caldwell doesn't seem to produce anything on the field that a head coach is responsible for. His clock management is a debacle, his challenges are nonsensical, and his players are no more disciplined or motivated than they were under anyone else. His record here looks good because he took over in a great year schedule-wise. I don't think it should be constantly overlooked that in our 11-5 year we beat exactly one team with a winning record, and lost to EVERY playoff team we could have faced. The team this year is just as indicative of the overall ability as last year.

Martha saying she supports Caldwell was a pointless and confusing thing to say. Caldwell wasn't a good head coach when he was winning. Martha supporting him is more of what fans expect from Lions management - loyalty to a personality (she likes him as a person) over actual ability. This is how the team gets years and years of Matt Millen, how it justifies promoting his only slightly less inept proteges, and how a team with multiple all-time greats in its history could never build anything that lasts more than one fluky year.

 

[boogerlovejoy]

I have no problem retaining Caldwell if the end result is what we've seen the last 7 weeks. As Ink mentioned......I think the Lions found their rhythem, though it was too little too late.

We wont lose anyone of any importance (unless CJ leaves, which I don't believe he will)....we have a good amount of top 100 picks (4 I believe) and we'll get Levy back. Play their cards right.....we could get an influx of talent in and have coordinators who seem to know how to use the talent we do have.

However, next year would have Caldwell on an EXTREMELY short leash.....and he already coaches with a puckered asshole. That might not be a good thing.

 

[cheeno]

I have no problem retaining Caldwell if the end result is what we've seen the last 7 weeks. As Ink mentioned......I think the Lions found their rhythem, though it was too little too late.

We wont lose anyone of any importance (unless CJ leaves, which I don't believe he will)....we have a good amount of top 100 picks (4 I believe) and we'll get Levy back. Play their cards right.....we could get an influx of talent in and have coordinators who seem to know how to use the talent we do have.

However, next year would have Caldwell on an EXTREMELY short leash.....and he already coaches with a puckered asshole. That might not be a good thing.

Like smile said, the last 7 weeks we've played teams with records below .500 save the Packers, which we lost. We already know he can beat the bad teams. His litmus test he went 1-7

 

[inkfreq]

Ladies and Gentlemen your 2015 Detroit Lions! At least they're not a trainwreck.

Well, is there anything else we can say about this season?

We can play the "should have been" game all day. I did in this very thread. But in reality our team hired a man to do a job. He's had two years to do it. One of those years was a success in terms of making the playoffs, the other was a disaster in comparison to that, but not in comparison to the rest of the league.

We went from a playoff team year one, to a middle of the pack team year two after losing some pretty damned critical free agents. and being hamstrung with cap problems.

That's the actual results of his tenure. His job is to win games, not to make fans understand or agree with every challenge, every time out, or every play.

I am not defending the guy. I don't like him as a coach. I want a more aggressive approach. But if you review his status as the coach from the objective (not subject) view of the results of his performance, there is zero reason to fire him yet.

 

[inkfreq]

I'll say this.. if it was a normal job, not a coaching job... let's say accountant for a corporation, and you fired him based on his current results, you'd be sued for wrongful termination and you'd lose.

He's had a year above league average, and a year, at about league average. Yes, the NFL is a competition based job, not a normal job, but his performance isn't fire worthy by any other standards than those of angry fans.

 

[cheeno]

I'll say this.. if it was a normal job, not a coaching job... let's say accountant for a corporation, and you fired him based on his current results, you'd be sued for wrongful termination and you'd lose.

He's had a year above league average, and a year, at about league average. Yes, the NFL is a competition based job, not a normal job, but his performance isn't fire worthy by any other standards than those of angry fans.

Compare it someone in mergers and acquisitions, he fucks up all the big accounts while doing well with acquiring the average and small accounts.

 

[Mitchrapp]

The problem with 6 wins it 8 games is there is no guarantee you continue that next season. Or do we forget 11 wins in two season after 2011?

 

[inkfreq]

Compare it someone in mergers and acquisitions, he fucks up all the big accounts while doing well with acquiring the average and small accounts.

Agreed. But again, the job of the GM is not just to hire the coach, but to coach the coach.

And the new GM should absolutely put him on an improvement plan. His clock management skills, challenges, and 10 men on the field problems should be a part of it.

I think people might think I want Caldwell retained. I don't. I want him fired. But based on performance, I wouldn't do it.

I want him gone because I don't think he's a bad coach, but suddenly there are a few good coaches out there. Let's upgrade.

 

[everyoneneedsasmil]

I'll say this.. if it was a normal job, not a coaching job... let's say accountant for a corporation, and you fired him based on his current results, you'd be sued for wrongful termination and you'd lose.

He's had a year above league average, and a year, at about league average. Yes, the NFL is a competition based job, not a normal job, but his performance isn't fire worthy by any other standards than those of angry fans.

Michigan is an at-will state. If I was fired tomorrow, despite being very good at what I do, there isn't anything I can do about it. Similarly, if I quit my job tomorrow, there's nothing my employer could do about it.

Further, football is very different from most other professions. Results aren't nearly as black and white. Ink, you talked about the what ifs, but remember that each year is not created equal. Winning in 2014 was like doing a good job closing a sale after someone else had done all the legwork. 2015 was the first time Caldwell had to put in the legwork, to actually out-coach or out-motivate his opponents, and it was a failure. What did Caldwell actually have to do well in 2014? As I've argued before, he wasn't a good coach last year, the only difference is that our schedule was filled with cupcakes.

 

[Mitchrapp]

I'll say this.. if it was a normal job, not a coaching job... let's say accountant for a corporation, and you fired him based on his current results, you'd be sued for wrongful termination and you'd lose.

He's had a year above league average, and a year, at about league average. Yes, the NFL is a competition based job, not a normal job, but his performance isn't fire worthy by any other standards than those of angry fans.

Every state, but one, companies can have at-will. Meaning, they can fire you just because.. And many companies have these policies.

 

[Mitchrapp]

Thinking alike.

 

[dubbsco]

Don't look too much into this late season improvement by the team. The wins have come against Philadelphia, Oakland, SF and NO. GB was nice, but it was a shanked FG from a loss.

When the lights were the brightest in the early season, the team failed. That's all that matters. This late season stuff is like the sprinkles on top of a cake. Don't really taste them at all, but look nice.

 

[boogerlovejoy]

Like smile said, the last 7 weeks we've played teams with records below .500 save the Packers, which we lost. We already know he can beat the bad teams. His litmus test he went 1-7

We got rid of the biggest issue from that 1-7 start. Lombardi is gone.

Cant agree with you that the litmus test was the first 8 games simply because you say it was. It's the NFL. Shitty teams beat good teams every week. Simply put, we were a better team the last 8 than were the first 8.

 

[Mitchrapp]

We got rid of the biggest issue from that 1-7 start. Lombardi is gone.

Cant agree with you that the litmus test was the first 8 games simply because you say it was. It's the NFL. Shitty teams beat good teams every week. Simply put, we were a better team the last 8 than were the first 8.

He was a goofball but it's hard to know if Cooter would have fared better against those early teams.

 

[tonyballs]

Nothing wrong with management showing support for their current HC. And at the same time having the respect and decency to let everyone know that they have the new GMs back on any decision that they make on Caldwell.

It's perfectly normal....

 

[cheeno]

We got rid of the biggest issue from that 1-7 start. Lombardi is gone.

Cant agree with you that the litmus test was the first 8 games simply because you say it was. It's the NFL. Shitty teams beat good teams every week. Simply put, we were a better team the last 8 than were the first 8.

The win loss record of those teams says it was the litmus test not me. We lost against the leagues better teams, won against the teams that were worse. Even last year that was the trend.

 

[dubbsco]

Booger, would you say shitty teams consistently beat better teams in the NFL? I'm failing to follow your logic here.

The team is going to be better and show improvement when you play crappier teams. I think that goes without saying. I find it hard to believe that if you took this team and dropped them in a time machine that they would suddenly just punk the good teams.

 

[cheeno]

Nothing wrong with management showing support for their current HC. And at the same time having the respect and decency to let everyone know that they have the new GMs back on any decision that they make on Caldwell.

It's perfectly normal....

As a top GM or coaching candidate, huge red flag.

 

[tonyballs]

As a top GM or coaching candidate, huge red flag.

No its not. You're paranoid lol