Stafford Tops Sporting News' Overrated QB List

[tomdalton22]

well...it sounds like most rational Lions fans do not over rate Stafford. We all know he is a middle of the pack QB. Only delusional fans think he is top 5.

 

[Mitchrapp]

The numbers do lie. The numbers extremely lie. The game tape doesn't lie.

ints not his fault, drops and protection, skew his numbers.

The game tape tells me when everything is perfect..OL and WR..Matt is still not good.

 

[LKP]

The game tape tells me when everything is perfect..OL and WR..Matt is still not good.

Matt is elite when everything is perfect.

 

[zyxt9]

Staff’s not worried ‘bout dem Haters
Cuz this year he’s got da players
Gonna achieve the dream
By winnin’ all 19
Then come back again
Twenty 16 he will end
All this BS debate
By redefining “Great”
Extending the steak
Then everyone will freak
Wonderin’ if he’ll lose
Drivin’ haters to booze
While Staff gets to gloat
“You know I’m the GOAT!”

*drops mic*

 

[Mitchrapp]

Matt is elite when everything is perfect.

 

[tomdalton22]

Matt is elite when everything is perfect.

guess what...it is VERY rare when everything is perfect. You need a QB to be good when things aren't perfect. That is what separates the truly elite players from guys like Matt.

 

[LKP]

guess what...it is VERY rare when everything is perfect. You need a QB to be good when things aren't perfect. That is what separates the truly elite players from guys like Matt.

Stafford was good in 2013 and 2014. When things were far from perfect.

 

[LKP]

2011
healthy weapons (WR 1-3 all year and top TE all year), 34 turnovers forced by our D, run game 4.3 YPC (Morris and Smith held their own after Best was hurt), decent protection

41 TDs and 5,000 yards. Elite.

 

[grandy]

My question is, how should we compare QBs if the stats don't tell the whole story?

I'm sure if you followed every team and watched every game you could make a case for each QB getting screwed over at some point with injuries, personnel quality, scheme, etc. as well as cases where the QB benefited from issues that opposing defenses dealt with.

What's the answer, PFF? Where do they have Stafford?

Obvious rankings are meaningless in the end since team success is all that matters, but it's nice to see where each player stands compared to the rest of the league.

 

[Mitchrapp]

My question is, how should we compare QBs if the stats don't tell the whole story?

I'm sure if you followed every team and watched every game you could make a case for each QB getting screwed over at some point with injuries, personnel quality, scheme, etc. as well as cases where the QB benefited from issues that opposing defenses dealt with.

What's the answer, PFF? Where do they have Stafford?

Obvious rankings are meaningless in the end since team success is all that matters, but it's nice to see where each player stands compared to the rest of the league.

I'm pretty sure we get screwed more.

 

[LKP]

My question is, how should we compare QBs if the stats don't tell the whole story?

I'm sure if you followed every team and watched every game you could make a case for each QB getting screwed over at some point with injuries, personnel quality, scheme, etc. as well as cases where the QB benefited from issues that opposing defenses dealt with.

What's the answer, PFF? Where do they have Stafford?

Obvious rankings are meaningless in the end since team success is all that matters, but it's nice to see where each player stands compared to the rest of the league.

You can't compare QBs especially if comp % and QB rating is your biggest guide. It's impossible. Each QB has different circumstances. Run game, protection, fumbles, drops, ints caused by others ,defenses faced, turnover support from your own defense, injury components, number of attempts required from a QB. Impossible to compare.

You can set a benchmark what you want based on a variety of circumsntances. Stafford has hit and surpassed that benchmark.

He moves the chains and puts us in position to score. He's the only reason we even move the chains really given our run game (injuries and Raiola/Sims problems). He does this facing immense pressure (again Oline injuries and drops (even Calvin some years).

Look at sacks, hits, hurries, drops, fumbles lost by weapons, turnover support, YPC from the run game and you'll see Stafford has it way worse than most QBs. Much of this is because of concentrated injuries to our Oline 2014) and weapons (2012-2014). 2012 and 2013 it was not enough firepower (some injury to Calvin/Burleson, some Durham just stunk, Young never progressed in 2012 after a solid rookie year, Pettigrew regressed from 2011, Burleson got older etc.).

Sure we got Tate finally and fix the fumbles lost in 2014 finally but then the protection and run game get worse. Drops still a problem (not Tate).

A healthy Lions offense (relatively) and Stafford not only will show good on game tape like he has but also in stats (which has in 2011, some categories in 2013/2014 too).

 

[tomdalton22]

You can't compare QBs especially if comp % and QB rating is your biggest guide. It's impossible. Each QB has different circumstances. Run game, protection, fumbles, drops, ints caused by others ,defenses faced, turnover support from your own defense, injury components, number of attempts required from a QB. Impossible to compare.

You can set a benchmark what you want based on a variety of circumsntances. Stafford has hit and surpassed that benchmark.

He moves the chains and puts us in position to score. He's the only reason we even move the chains really given our run game (injuries and Raiola/Sims problems). He does this facing immense pressure (again Oline injuries and drops (even Calvin some years).

Look at sacks, hits, hurries, drops, fumbles lost by weapons, turnover support, YPC from the run game and you'll see Stafford has it way worse than most QBs. Much of this is because of concentrated injuries to our Oline 2014) and weapons (2012-2014). 2012 and 2013 it was not enough firepower (some injury to Calvin/Burleson, some Durham just stunk, Young never progressed in 2012 after a solid rookie year, Pettigrew regressed from 2011, Burleson got older etc.).

Sure we got Tate finally and fix the fumbles lost in 2014 finally but then the protection and run game get worse. Drops still a problem (not Tate).

A healthy Lions offense (relatively) and Stafford not only will show good on game tape like he has but also in stats (which has in 2011, some categories in 2013/2014 too).

how dare we compare QBs based on the percentage of passes he completes, turnover ratio, TD ratio and yards per attempt. Let's compare them based on arbitrary circumstances and make up excuses.

 

[LKP]

how dare we compare QBs based on the percentage of passes he completes, turnover ratio, TD ratio and yards per attempt. Let's compare them based on arbitrary circumstances and make up excuses.

It's dumb to compare comp %. Way too many variables. It's not a controlled experiment.

Separation of weapons, injured weapons, drops, ints not your fault greatly affect your completion % and QB rating. It's using a team stat for an individual really.

Even if the QB is doing his job it could look like is not if the weapon or backup weapon isn't. Plus fumbles lost take away scoring changes. Turnover support (especially with a short field) add easier scoring chances even if not deserved (cough Russel Wilson 2013).

3rd and mid range is much easier than 3rd and long to convert (run game issues). Plus it's tougher on the defense to defend a 3rd and mid range compared to 3rd and long.

So many factors.

22 TDs and 12 ints is outstanding for Stafford given his circumstances. He was Super Bowl quality last year.

 

[SpartyNash]

A well deserved honor for Stafford. How people think the guy is some top QB is ridiculous. If I had to pick a QB to start for my team, he would be about my 15th pick. A very average quarterback.

 

[Mitchrapp]

A well deserved honor for Stafford. How people think the guy is some top QB is ridiculous. If I had to pick a QB to start for my team, he would be about my 15th pick. A very average quarterback.

With the money I'd pick as my 25th QB. Maybe.

 

[LKP]

A well deserved honor for Stafford. How people think the guy is some top QB is ridiculous. If I had to pick a QB to start for my team, he would be about my 15th pick. A very average quarterback.

15th LOL. He's top 5 on game tape.

Rodgers, Luck, Brady and Manning only people I would take over Stafford. And Brady and Manning have age issues now.

 

[tomdalton22]

With the money I'd pick as my 25th QB. Maybe.

25th is pretty low.

I think Stafford is under contract for 3 more years so here are the QBs that I would take over Stafford over the next 3 years. This is based on past performance and what I think these players will do in the near future.

Brees
Ben
Luck
Ryan
Rodgers
Rivers
Brady
Tannehill
Flacco
Romo
Wilson
P Manning (very close given his age)

So I have 11 or 12 ahead of Stafford but there are guys that are pretty similar to him (Dalton, Newton, Kaepernick, Bridgewater) that push him down to that mid teen level of QB.

Like most of us say...slightly above average or average.

 

[Mitchrapp]

25th is pretty low.

I think Stafford is under contract for 3 more years so here are the QBs that I would take over Stafford over the next 3 years. This is based on past performance and what I think these players will do in the near future.

Brees
Ben
Luck
Ryan
Rodgers
Rivers
Brady
Tannehill
Flacco
Romo
Wilson
P Manning (very close given his age)

So I have 11 or 12 ahead of Stafford but there are guys that are pretty similar to him (Dalton, Newton, Kaepernick, Bridgewater) that push him down to that mid teen level of QB.

Like most of us say...slightly above average or average.

It's not low. Might not be top guy anymore with the money but I'd take a ton of guys over Matt. The thing is Matt isn't slightly above average. He's not even average. He's bad.

When's the last time you said "Matt won us this game"?

 

[LKP]

It's not low. Might not be top guy anymore with the money but I'd take a ton of guys over Matt. The thing is Matt isn't slightly above average. He's not even average. He's bad.

When's the last time you said "Matt won us this game"?

All 11 games we won last year. Made important plays in each of them.

 

[Mitchrapp]

All 11 games we won last year. Made important plays in each of them.

Yeah, okay :nuts: