The FIX is in!!!

[mhughes0021]

Hell guys, let's break it down like this....

If Alex Henery goes a measy one for three against Buffalo, a shitty rate for a kicker as is, and the Lions likely win. ONE FOR THREE! Two for three guarantees the win.

The Lions finish the season 12-4 and win the NFC North.

The difference between a disappointing season and a divisional title was a kicker being able to hit one lousy field goal from under 45 yards in three attempts.

I feel I have a lot more reason to say let's give it another season to see what happens, than anyone else does to throw the baby away with the bath water.

ink...we held 12 teams to 21 points or fewer. 12! that's ridiculous lol. Vince Young could have won 12 games on this team lol.

 

[inkfreq]

ink...we held 12 teams to 21 points or fewer. 12! that's ridiculous lol. Vince Young could have won 12 games on this team lol.

It's a great argument too. The defense was stellar this season, and there is no one who can argue that.

However, I will make this counter argument...

In 2013 we had 9 games of 21 points or more. In 2012 we had 8 games of 21 points or more. In 2011 we had 11 games of 21 or more.

So am I now supposed to believe that same QB who led those with fewer weapons has revealed his true colors and can't eek out more than six game sof 21 or more with better weapons, like Tate?

Or am I suppose to believe there were other factors like new coaches, bad play calling, and a crumbling offensive line.

Sorry guys, but Occam's razor dictates that ALL THINGS BEING EQUAL, the single simplest solution is usually the correct one. This season all things were not equal. In the three previous seasons, without those mitigating factors, our offense was better and the defense sucked.

You simply can't convince me that this is the right season to judge him long term based on everything, because the evidence shows something was different this year than in years past.

The offense dipped with better weapons but the same QB. It's not hard to realize this may not be as much Matt's doing as other factors.

 

[Mitchrapp]

Yes. When we were scoring more points Matt still sucked..It's not all about the points..the dudes average at best. Can he be better for a season, like 2011? No.

 

[Mitchrapp]

The offense dipped with better weapons but the same QB. It's not hard to realize this may not be as much Matt's doing as other factors.

So Matt sucked, got better weapons and still sucks yet you think its other factors? :lmao:

 

[mhughes0021]

It's a great argument too. The defense was stellar this season, and there is no one who can argue that.

However, I will make this counter argument...

In 2013 we had 9 games of 21 points or more. In 2012 we had 8 games of 21 points or more. In 2011 we had 11 games of 21 or more.

So am I now supposed to believe that same QB who led those with fewer weapons has revealed his true colors and can't eek out more than six game sof 21 or more with better weapons, like Tate?

Or am I suppose to believe there were other factors like new coaches, bad play calling, and a crumbling offensive line.

Sorry guys, but Occam's razor dictates that ALL THINGS BEING EQUAL, the single simplest solution is usually the correct one. This season all things were not equal. In the three previous seasons, without those mitigating factors, our offense was better and the defense sucked.

You simply can't convince me that this is the right season to judge him long term based on everything, because the evidence shows something was different this year than in years past.

The offense dipped with better weapons but the same QB. It's not hard to realize this may not be as much Matt's doing as other factors.

totally agree not all things are equal. Schwartz sucked and Caldwell is marginally better. But Lombardi was not ready to be a ocord in this league. The ingame adjustments were awful. Playcalling as you said was terrible. Oline probably wasn't as good as last year....but wasnt terrible imo. Moreso than any of that is progression throughout the season.....there was none. Not from Matt..not from Joe...and that's on Caldwell.

 

[inkfreq]

totally agree not all things are equal. Schwartz sucked and Caldwell is marginally better. But Lombardi was not ready to be a ocord in this league. The ingame adjustments were awful. Playcalling as you said was terrible. Oline probably wasn't as good as last year....but wasnt terrible imo. Moreso than any of that is progression throughout the season.....there was none. Not from Matt..not from Joe...and that's on Caldwell.

Now see... this I agree with completely. Lombardi was not ready, he couldn' t make those adjustments. These guys were suppose to be QB gurus, and we saw no signs of progress from Stafford other than his picks being down, and that was far more a result of the check-down/screen game they used than better decision making.

I do feel the O-Line was far worse this year than last year, and we can debate that ad nauseum, but the crux of it all is exactly that... too much blame on coaches to put all the blame on the QB.

I have never said I am a Stafford believer. I was damned excited about his skills early on, and his toughness. But over time, I haven't seen anything to make me believe he's elite.

I think he's good enough to win a title, maybe more. I think he IS better than Eli Manning. I think he's far worse than Luck, Brees, Peyton, Rodgers, etc...

I'm just not willing to say "There is no chance of success" in a season in which Caldwell and Lombardi couldn't figure out how to put an offense together. Its clear to me that Lombardi brought the Saints playbook with him, but didn't bring Sean Payton's mind or his ability to coach.

 

[inkfreq]

And let me say again... the argument here isn't whether or not Matt's a good QB or even has been a good QB in the past.

The argument is whether or not it's time to shit or get off the pot.

If I am the Lions GM, I am not moving away from Stafford after this season. I am certainly putting a lot of emphasis on offensive growth, and demanding more from my coaches next season. I'm putting financial resources into bringing in whatever coaching I need to in order to make the offense better, the same way I put money into Brian Xanders to improve my drafting.

I'm not looking to add more weapons in the draft on offense, I'm looking for ways to improve the play calling, the TE coaching (which was horrible), etc... but I'm running next season with the same offense I ran with this year, except for improving the offensive line at all costs.

And yes, that means I am giving Stafford time to grow into the new offensive scheme, and if he doesn't I will have to evaluate that at the appropriate time, but in my opinion, one season in a new scheme, with new coaches, and the challenges the line faced is NOT the right time to pull that trigger.

That is the argument here. There is no arguing the offense was not up to par this season. But there wasn't enough there on Stafford's shoulders alone to tell me I need a new QB in order to win titles.

 

[tomdalton22]

And let me say again... the argument here isn't whether or not Matt's a good QB or even has been a good QB in the past.

The argument is whether or not it's time to shit or get off the pot.

If I am the Lions GM, I am not moving away from Stafford after this season. I am certainly putting a lot of emphasis on offensive growth, and demanding more from my coaches next season. I'm putting financial resources into bringing in whatever coaching I need to in order to make the offense better, the same way I put money into Brian Xanders to improve my drafting.

I'm not looking to add more weapons in the draft on offense, I'm looking for ways to improve the play calling, the TE coaching (which was horrible), etc... but I'm running next season with the same offense I ran with this year, except for improving the offensive line at all costs.

And yes, that means I am giving Stafford time to grow into the new offensive scheme, and if he doesn't I will have to evaluate that at the appropriate time, but in my opinion, one season in a new scheme, with new coaches, and the challenges the line faced is NOT the right time to pull that trigger.

That is the argument here. There is no arguing the offense was not up to par this season. But there wasn't enough there on Stafford's shoulders alone to tell me I need a new QB in order to win titles.

Trent Dilfer and Brad Johnson won titles. The question is this...is he good enough to "lead" a team to a title. He is being paid like an elite QB and elite QBs are supposed to be able to lead their teams to a title. Look at the 8 QBs that played over the weekend. I would say 7/8 of them are superior to Stafford with the only exception being Cam (who is on the same level as Matt)

 

[inkfreq]

Trent Dilfer and Brad Johnson won titles. The question is this...is he good enough to "lead" a team to a title. He is being paid like an elite QB and elite QBs are supposed to be able to lead their teams to a title. Look at the 8 QBs that played over the weekend. I would say 7/8 of them are superior to Stafford with the only exception being Cam (who is on the same level as Matt)

I would say if he plays to his potential, then yes, I believe he is good enough to lead a team to a title.

I am not sure at all that the system Lombardi has installed will allow him to play to his potential.

Lead is a pretty dicey word in my opinion. There are many ways to "lead", but I think we can all agree, the most common form of it in football terms is to put a team on your shoulders and carry them.

I do feel he has the qualities to do just that, and I think when he's had the opportunity, he's demonstrated those qualities as well. Obviously, that is a very subjective thing to discuss, and many will disagree. I accept that we will not all agree unless he proves one side of the discussion right.

If your question is truly "can he"... then I think he can. If the real question is "has he" or "will he" then there is much room for debate there, and the raw metrics probably don't play out in his favor.

 

[cheeno]

I would say if he plays to his potential, then yes, I believe he is good enough to lead a team to a title.

I am not sure at all that the system Lombardi has installed will allow him to play to his potential.

Lead is a pretty dicey word in my opinion. There are many ways to "lead", but I think we can all agree, the most common form of it in football terms is to put a team on your shoulders and carry them.

I do feel he has the qualities to do just that, and I think when he's had the opportunity, he's demonstrated those qualities as well. Obviously, that is a very subjective thing to discuss, and many will disagree. I accept that we will not all agree unless he proves one side of the discussion right.

If your question is truly "can he"... then I think he can. If the real question is "has he" or "will he" then there is much room for debate there, and the raw metrics probably don't play out in his favor.

I think we can agree for all our sakes, let's hope it's the positive side of the discussion that wins out. But how can you not agree, apart from the first half of 2011 and some really specific examples we don't have much to go on.

 

[mhughes0021]

And let me say again... the argument here isn't whether or not Matt's a good QB or even has been a good QB in the past.

The argument is whether or not it's time to shit or get off the pot.

If I am the Lions GM, I am not moving away from Stafford after this season. I am certainly putting a lot of emphasis on offensive growth, and demanding more from my coaches next season. I'm putting financial resources into bringing in whatever coaching I need to in order to make the offense better, the same way I put money into Brian Xanders to improve my drafting.

I'm not looking to add more weapons in the draft on offense, I'm looking for ways to improve the play calling, the TE coaching (which was horrible), etc... but I'm running next season with the same offense I ran with this year, except for improving the offensive line at all costs.

And yes, that means I am giving Stafford time to grow into the new offensive scheme, and if he doesn't I will have to evaluate that at the appropriate time, but in my opinion, one season in a new scheme, with new coaches, and the challenges the line faced is NOT the right time to pull that trigger.

That is the argument here. There is no arguing the offense was not up to par this season. But there wasn't enough there on Stafford's shoulders alone to tell me I need a new QB in order to win titles.

I agree its not the time.....but then again weve used the "he needs time to grow" excuse for going on 7 years. Pretty soon itll be his 12th season and we'll still have a top 20 qb. Hes the only bottom 16 qb in the league that no one wants to replace. And thats why were not a good franchise....we settle for mediocrity.

 

[LKP]

Stafford was pressured too much and had very little run support. He also does not have a good slot/third WR at all. Hopefully Ebron can grow more for him as it's too early to give up on that.

Still 97 QB rating at home going 7-1. (with 3 missed field goals in a loss).

The offense overall needs to get better on the road. And at Carolina, at Patriots and at Packers I wouldn't say the defense showed up really.

600 attempts, he's not a game manager. He won us alot of games.

 

[mhughes0021]

Stafford was pressured too much and had very little run support. He also does not have a good slot/third WR at all. Hopefully Ebron can grow more for him as it's too early to give up on that.

Still 97 QB rating at home going 7-1. (with 3 missed field goals in a loss).

The offense overall needs to get better on the road. And at Carolina, aterr r Patriots and at Packers I wouldn't say the defense showed up really.

600 attempts, he's not a game manager. He won us alot of games.

600 attempts and no points to show for it. Hes got a big arm...he needs to start throwing the ball further than 6 yards. And if he cant do that accurately or consistently....then we need to get a qb that can. Hes awful down field....and it makes our offense too predictable. predictable offenses are easy to stop. Calvin johnson is tge least dynamic superstar ive ever seen. He runs a 7 yard slant 90% of the time....its ridiculous.

 

[tomdalton22]

Watching the GB game yesterday...AR on one leg is 10x the QB Stafford is.

 

[Mitchrapp]

I would say if he plays to his potential, then yes, I believe he is good enough to lead a team to a title.

What potential? His potential is a average QB, as he's done the last 3 years. There probably wouldn't be so much gruff about Matt if he didn't make so much. I argue against Matt for that very reason, if he's making 3-4 million I doubt he gets close to the gruff others give him.

When do you see someone dominant, like 2011, to having 3 years sub-par and back to dominating again? Or even close?

IMO, I'd get the OLINE fixed and become more of a running team. Do what Seattle does, they only throw 450 times a year - keep building the defense and run the ball.

 

[Mitchrapp]

I got an idea, play Matt for only home games against inferior competition. Then use another QB the rest of the time.

 

[adam86107]

I think it's funny that Stafford will make an absolutely phenomenal on point pass about 5% of the time and when he does certain people will completely forget about the grossly inaccurate passes he throws 95% of the time.

 

[tinselwolverine]

I got an idea, play Matt for only home games against inferior competition. Then use another QB the rest of the time.

Dude, I was just kind of browsing through but this is the funniest post you've ever made.

I want to say that I laughed out loud, but really I only laugh out loud at the crap I come up with myself.

 

[Mitchrapp]

600 attempts and no points to show for it. Hes got a big arm...he needs to start throwing the ball further than 6 yards. And if he cant do that accurately or consistently....then we need to get a qb that can. Hes awful down field....and it makes our offense too predictable. predictable offenses are easy to stop. Calvin johnson is tge least dynamic superstar ive ever seen. He runs a 7 yard slant 90% of the time....its ridiculous.

I think we should draft slot receivers. We all want Matt to throw more down field until we see he can't do it.

Anyone watch the Indy-Denver game? Near the end of the first half, Peyton who's typically pretty good down field - looked like Matt Stafford. 3 throws, didn't come close to anyone.

 

[tomdalton22]

I got an idea, play Matt for only home games against inferior competition. Then use another QB the rest of the time.

97.7 rating at home is very good. However, it just highlights how shitty he has been on the road. 74.9 rating at home, 54% completion percentage. Also, in wins he has a 93.1 rating adn in the losses 70.2